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Forums - Nintendo Discussion - Nintendo looking to support the Switch for more than the traditional 5-6 year period

DélioPT said:
zorg1000 said:

Well you must not have checked in awhile

Internally developed Wii U & Switch games first 10 months

 

Wii U

Nov 2012-New Super Mario Bros U

Nov 2012-Nintendo Land

June-Game & Wario

August 2013-Pikmin 3

 

Switch

March 2017-Breath of the Wild

March 2017-1 2 Switch

April 2017-Mario Kart 8 Deluxe

June 2017-ARMS

July 2017-Splatoon 2

Oct 2017-Super Mario Odyssey

Dec 2017-Xenoblade Chronicles 2

 

Not only is the total number higher but the size and scope of the Switch games are significantly greater than the Wii U titles.

You forgot about New Super Luigi U.
And both Zelda BoTW and MK8 are Wii U games that were ported to Switch.

If we look at only original games, Switch has 5 and Wii U has 4.

The comparison doesn't really favour Nintendo much.
Although, something different should have happened.


I didnt forget it, its just DLC that got a standalone release.

But if you insist on adding NSLU than ill add DLC for Zelda, ARMS & Splatoon.

 

Why would we disregard Zelda? It was a brand new game, it doesnt matter that its multiplat, its still a brand new title.

 

Yes Mario Kart was a port but added new content and ports still take resources.

 

I like that you conveniently ignored the part about Switch games being much larger is size/scope.

 

Overall Switch 1st party output was significantly greater than Wii U or 3DS in the first 10 months.



When the herd loses its way, the shepard must kill the bull that leads them astray.

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Hiku said:
Miyamotoo said:

And thats exatly my point with potential, Switch Pro, like wrote, at end everything is about profit, if Switch sales and Switch games are still selling, some 3rd party will definitely still port some games to Switch/Pro despite PS5/XB2. I mean Switch is still less than one year on market and still need to have peak year, easily can have instal base of around 100m at end of LT.

That's fine and all, but this is what you said earlier:
The question posed by Pegan was "How to port any games over in 7 years. Forgett 7 years. How to play games in just 3 years?"
And your answer in regards to how they will port games like that to Switch was: "That totaly make sense because Switch is Nintendo unified platform, and it will have multiply revisons with possibility of Switch Pro/Switch2 or similar that will probably support same games (look at PS4 Pro and Xbox X)."

Yeah, and I later further clarify that my point, so I dont see whats problem exalty!?

Last edited by Miyamotoo - on 04 February 2018

DélioPT said:
zorg1000 said:

Well you must not have checked in awhile

Internally developed Wii U & Switch games first 10 months

 

Wii U

Nov 2012-New Super Mario Bros U

Nov 2012-Nintendo Land

June-Game & Wario

August 2013-Pikmin 3

 

Switch

March 2017-Breath of the Wild

March 2017-1 2 Switch

April 2017-Mario Kart 8 Deluxe

June 2017-ARMS

July 2017-Splatoon 2

Oct 2017-Super Mario Odyssey

Dec 2017-Xenoblade Chronicles 2

 

Not only is the total number higher but the size and scope of the Switch games are significantly greater than the Wii U titles.

You forgot about New Super Luigi U.
And both Zelda BoTW and MK8 are Wii U games that were ported to Switch.

If we look at only original games, Switch has 5 and Wii U has 4.

The comparison doesn't really favour Nintendo much.
Although, something different should have happened.

RolStoppable said:

Switch's first party output is comfortably better in quality and quantity than what the Wii U had in its first twelve months. Switch also beats the 3DS's first year handily, so any late life sacrifices Nintendo made for the Wii U and 3DS certainly paid off this time around, unlike a generation before where the Wii was left dry and neither the 3DS and Wii U had a healthy first year.

It's a fallacy that Nintendo has to regain consumers because they've never really had those consumers in the first place. That type of consumers emerged before PS and Xbox came into play when Sega ran marketing campaigns for their Genesis to attract such consumers. The fundamental trait of such consumers is active refusal of Nintendo products, so it's pointless for Nintendo to fight that when the pool of consumers who don't have such an attitude is far, far greater.

Since you have...

1. ...little doubts that Switch owners already have another console to enjoy non-Nintendo games...
2. ...and since it's clear that Switch and any hypothetical hardware upgrades will always be inferior to its PS and Xbox counterparts...

...why does it make sense for you that Nintendo should fight a losing battle? Isn't it clear to you that you are advocating for another Wii U situation?

But the sacrífices weren't small, were they?
Not only they "abandoned" their platforms for quite some time, they are already showing holes in their release schedule in the first half
And speaking of sacrífices, they didn't stop supporting one platform, but two. And when we see the amount provided by Nintendo, did it really pay off? In terms of (original) games, the difference is minimal. In terms of quality, i don't think more time developing explains quality differences that we can see. It's also about what games you choose to develop.

But Nintendo did have those consumers. 
They started losing them to Sega and Sony, and even MS. So, i don't see how they can't try to regain what they had once.
If MS could gain those consumers from Sony, how can't Nintendo? The consumer is buying a Switch. What Nintendo needs is to find a way to show them that 1st party Nintendo + 3rd party is the best combo possible.

But i'm not advocating that Switch can become another Wii U.
For the first time in decades, Nintendo has managed to really grab those consumers on the home console front. Now, comes the time where Nintendo makes them stay.

Gamers are more than willing to sacrifice certain aspects to get the console they desire, but they aren't willing to sacrífice a lot or even important things.
And that's why it's important for Nintendo to get as much 3rd party support as it can as soon as possible.
Getting back to the original point, Switch's strengths will only hold the fort for so long. If they can get real 3rd party support (big names and not watered down multiplats), combined with continuous Nintendo support, people might just see Nintendo as a place they can have the best experience (Nintendo games + 3rd party games).
HW revisions that don't increase the gap between Switch and PS5/XB4, are a step in that direction.

It's a big if. But it can happen.

Are you relly still try to compare Switch 1st year with Wii U 1st year!? :D

Switch 1st year is probably strongest 1st year for any Nintendo console why Wii Us 1st year is probably weakest 1st year for any Nintendo console, and you fail to see that!? Also you are constantly negative about Switch itself, games, lineup...even before Switch launch, and almost year later you still have same story like Switch is selling bad or that dont have any releases, completly ignoring fact that Switch itself and Switch games are seeing great. Talking about ignoring reality.



zorg1000 said:
DélioPT said:  

I didnt forget it, its just DLC that got a standalone release.

But if you insist on adding NSLU than ill add DLC for Zelda, ARMS & Splatoon.

 

Why would we disregard Zelda? It was a brand new game, it doesnt matter that its multiplat, its still a brand new title.

 

Yes Mario Kart was a port but added new content and ports still take resources.

 

I like that you conveniently ignored the part about Switch games being much larger is size/scope.

 

Overall Switch 1st party output was significantly greater than Wii U or 3DS in the first 10 months.

Luigi U used NSMB assests but it was a completely different game and had to be reworked. But even then, i left it out.

Zelda for Switch is not a brand new game. It was made for Wii U, and later in it's development cycle, Nintendo decided to port it to Switch. 
In conclusion: it's a port.

Again, i didn't "conveniently ignored" anything.
What you don't seem to remember is that Wii U games were also the first time Nintendo developed HD titles and we know how Nintendo struggled with HD development.

In the end, Nintendo's streamlining development strategy hasn't really paid off in a meaningful way.

RolStoppable said:
DélioPT said: 

 

The sacrifices were small. They only scaled back on Wii U support, a console that was cemented as failure. There wasn't any real damage that could be done to the Wii U. The 3DS received continuous support even after Switch had already launched. Nintendo is releasing at least seven games from February to June 2018, so there are no holes in the release schedule; given the back catalogue that Nintendo built in 2017, Switch doesn't need system-selling software as much as an unhealthy console. You have to constantly downplay Switch's games to make your point which means that you don't have much of a point to begin with.

Microsoft is setting themselves up for a future without consoles, so they don't work as a positive example for anything. If you repeatedly denounce the Wii, you have no choice but to concede that Microsoft is nothing more than a fluke, because otherwise you contradict your own logic.

You are still greatly overestimating the importance of AAA third party games. You portray those games as an essential factor that Switch needs to have, but there's no evidence to support such an assertion. What video game history shows is that those games are not important. You insist that a Nintendo console cannot remain successful without AAA third party games, but Nintendo handhelds have always done well. Since Switch is a hybrid, any honest analysis must factor in both the home console side and the handheld side of Nintendo's history. Nintendo's handheld side is not going to suddenly crumble due to a lack of AAA third party games.

As far as i remember, sacrífices weren't small: Nintendo did in fact decreased support for two platforms only to have a small increase over Wii U's 1st party titles in the first 10 months.

For the first semester Nintendo has two original titles: Kirby and Mario Tennis, plus ports.

I don't see how MS was a fluke.
Their strategy for Xb360 worked really well and now, despite making several mistakes with XB1, sales show that despite them, they have a good fanbase and if correct their mistakes nex-gen, they can increase HW sales.
I highly doubt they will go fully digital. They don't have the 1st party library required to pull it off. If you use MS's service on PC, why not just use Steam? If you use it PS4, for exemple, why not just buy the PS4 version?

I'm not overestimating the importance of 3d party support.
If you look at PS4's top ten games, 1 in 10 is a 1st party game. If you look at the top 20, 3 in 20 are 1st party games (2 IPs: Uncharted and The Last of US). Xbox One's library shows a similar pattern, with more 1st party games in both top ten and top 20 (some IPs appearing twice).

What i'm insisting in is this idea: 3rd party games will be important to reach a certain plateau of HW sales and increase it's HW life cycle. Why? Because 3rd parties sell consoles. And if Nintendo can get those games, it increases the chances of widening it's userbase, thus remaining more relevant over time.

People aren't buying Switch with a handheld mindset, so that argumente that handheld consumers won't care about Switch's success might be as strong as you think. Different proposition leads to different expectations.



Miyamotoo said:
DélioPT said:

 

Are you relly still try to compare Switch 1st year with Wii U 1st year!? :D

Switch 1st year is probably strongest 1st year for any Nintendo console why Wii Us 1st year is probably weakest 1st year for any Nintendo console, and you fail to see that!? Also you are constantly negative about Switch itself, games, lineup...even before Switch launch, and almost year later you still have same story like Switch is selling bad or that dont have any releases, completly ignoring fact that Switch itself and Switch games are seeing great. Talking about ignoring reality.

Yes, i'm comparing.
You know why? Because i want to know if Nintendo decisions turned out to pay off or not. And from what i see (Nintendo not really supporting 2 consoles), it hasn't paid off as it should... for now.
If you don't want to see it, you are free to do so.

I'm not constantly negative towards Nintendo. That's what you choose to see. "you still have same story like Switch is selling bad or that dont have any releases". See how you twist what i say?
I question Nintendo's decision when they didn't show more 2018 games at E3 and after. What do we know? 1st semester isn't that great.
And when i question what games are coming out. What do you read? a) No games are coming out; b) any title is enough to keep Switch's momentum. And i mean, any title.



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DélioPT said:
 


In the end, Nintendo's streamlining development strategy hasn't really paid off in a meaningful way.


Roughy double the output isnt meaningful? Well if thats how you feel than there is really no point in going further.



When the herd loses its way, the shepard must kill the bull that leads them astray.

I'm not entirely taking Delio's side here, but given the lack of Wii U support after 2015 and the unification of Nintendo's development teams on a single platform, I am a little disappointed that their Switch lineup for the first half of this year isn't more robust.



Nautilus said:
Well, thats pretty obvious.As long as the hardware keeps selling at an acceptable rate, and software sales dont drop, there is no reason to replace it.


Made a bet with LipeJJ and HylianYoshi that the XB1 will reach 30 million before Wii U reaches 15 million. Loser has to get avatar picked by winner for 6 months (or if I lose, either 6 months avatar control for both Lipe and Hylian, or my patrick avatar comes back forever).

RolStoppable said:

You remember it wrong. Additionally, Nintendo has four all-new games for Switch in the first half of 2018.

Oh shit really? I can only remember two. What are the other ones?



RolStoppable said:
AngryLittleAlchemist said:

Oh shit really? I can only remember two. What are the other ones?

The two Labo Kits.

It's irrelevant whether people like Labo or not, in a sales discussion they cannot be dismissed as non-existent.

Ah, you are right. I hope that Robot game is fun, it looks really cool.