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Forums - Politics Discussion - Mom wants 'sexist' fairy tale banned

VGPolyglot said:
o_O.Q said:

and what happens of there is a disagreement or several parties refuse to cooperate? your hypothetical country just implodes on itself?

I am not talking about a country, as I prefer a stateless society. I also don't understand you talking about them imploding, are you advocating then for centralized management of the economy?

 

"are you advocating then for centralized management of the economy?"

the point i was trying to make is that societies regulate the problem of individual drives clashing by establishing something common across all of the people of a society and that is what we call government

for example government outlaws sexual harassment because the common idea of  society is that sexual harassment is bad and therefore government enforces laws to curb sexual harassment

and government is able to do so because it is a centralised force between the people of a society

 

this nonsense you were coming up with about centralisation being about individuals is wrong

 

just the word itself makes this clear "CENTRAL" or in other words "SOMETHING THAT EXISTS BETWEEN TWO OR MORE INDIVIDUAL THINGS"

 

on the other other hand "DECENTRALISED" or in other words "BREAKING OF A STRUCTURE INTO SMALLER PARTS OR INDIVIDUALS"

 

again where are you getting the idea that centralisation is about indivdiduals? while decentralisation is about groups?

 




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VGPolyglot said:
thismeintiel said:

Bwahaha!!  Privatization?  Is that what you want to call it?  I'm guessing they let anyone run those companies, right?  Including Jews?  Or all the other groups they threw into concentration camps?  The answer is no.  How bout if the leader of a company spoke out strongly against Nazis?  Did they just let them continue to run that company?  Sorry, but that's not privatization when the government can just throw out whoever is in charge and put someone in who favors them. 

And who cares if they attacked other leftists?  That's what radical leftists do.  You can see that in modern day with Antifa not caring who they hurt, including the Neo-Nazis who, if you actual listen to them, are pushing racism AND Socialist ideas.  There are different forms of radical leftism.  Nazis, Communists, Marxists.  They always fight over who is going to gain control of this big government that has all this control and power.  Whoever wins persecutes the others.  It's been happening in history since those philosophies were created.

I gave you sources that showed how they were not left-wing, now you show me how they were left-wing.

No, you posted BS that I was easily able to refute.  You don't privatize industry with a government taking it away from the people who started it and putting in someone who favors the government.  It's the exact opposite of the meaning of the word.  And o_O.Q posted something addressing it, as well.

And let me burst your little Socialist Utopia bubble.  Socialism has, is, and always will be a lie, whatever form it comes in.  A lie perpetrated by a soon to be dictator to fool gullible people into thinking they will be given power, wealth, and/or protection.  The people believe this one man, or small group lead by this man, will give them the Socialist Utopia they desire.  But, instead rights are always stripped from the people, usually free speech and gun rights, to quiet discontent, to stop another revolution.   The same people who helped him/them gain power are the same ones who are crushed beneath the weight of an oppressive government.  Sure, they give people a "vote," but no one is going to vote against the man in charge, for fear they and their families will be persecuted and/or killed.  And near the end, there is always a group/s that the people's plight is blamed on. In the end, the people are no better off and just filled with hatred for someone or something, all of which was accomplished on the backs of thousands/millions dead from either war within the country, persecution by the government, and/or starvation and disease.

That's the way it has always played out and the way it will always play out.

Last edited by thismeintiel - on 25 November 2017

o_O.Q said:
VGPolyglot said:

I am not talking about a country, as I prefer a stateless society. I also don't understand you talking about them imploding, are you advocating then for centralized management of the economy?

 

"are you advocating then for centralized management of the economy?"

the point i was trying to make is that societies regulate the problem of individual drives clashing by establishing something common across all of the people of a society and that is what we call government

for example government outlaws sexual harassment because the common idea of  society is that sexual harassment is bad and therefore government enforces laws to curb sexual harassment

and government is able to do so because it is a centralised force between the people of a society

 

this nonsense you were coming up with about centralisation being about individuals is wrong

 

just the word itself makes this clear "CENTRAL" or in other words "SOMETHING THAT EXISTS BETWEEN TWO OR MORE INDIVIDUAL THINGS"

 

on the other other hand "DECENTRALISED" or in other words "BREAKING OF A STRUCTURE INTO SMALLER PARTS OR INDIVIDUALS"

 

again where are you getting the idea that centralisation is about indivdiduals? while decentralisation is about groups?

 


Socialism would be broken into smaller groups, instead of a huge corporation overseeing a massive chain, it would be done in a bottom-top manner.

thismeintiel said:
VGPolyglot said:

I gave you sources that showed how they were not left-wing, now you show me how they were left-wing.

No, you posted BS that I was easily able to refute.  You don't privatize industry with a government taking it away from the people who started it and putting in someone who favors the government.  It's the exact opposite of the meaning of the word.  And o_O.Q posted something addressing it, as well.

And let me burst your little Socialist Utopia bubble.  Socialism has, is, and always will be a lie, whatever form it comes in.  A lie perpetrated by a soon to be dictator to fool gullible people into thinking they will be given power, wealth, and/or protection.  The people believe this one man, or small group lead by this man, will give them the Socialist Utopia they desire.  But, instead rights are always stripped from the people, usually free speech and gun rights, to quiet discontent, to stop another revolution.   The same people who helped him/them gain power are the same ones who are crushed beneath the weight of an oppressive government.  Sure, they give people a "vote," but no one is going to vote against the man in charge, for fear they and their families will be persecuted and/or killed.  And near the end, there is always a group/s that the people's plight is blamed on. In the end, the people are no better off and just filled with hatred for someone or something, all of which was accomplished on the backs of thousands/millions dead from either war within the country, persecution by the government, and/or starvation and disease.

That's the way it has always played out and the way it will always play out.

I'm not a utopian socialist. And privatization means making state-owned corporations private, so what does that have to do with what you're saying?

BasilZero said:
VGPolyglot said:

That's what critique of art and works are for, their goal is to question them and analyse them. This is nothing new.

 

Imo, fictional works created from artist and creators should not be changed because of someone's view. If its one thing, it'll lead to another deviating from the creator's original intention which should imo be protected.

 

The creations are from the creator and any type of change that is made is censorship which I am against.

In the case of Sleeping Beauty, there's two versions - the one that Disney made which is indeed a lighter version and the original version which was darker.

 

Both versions imo should exist - not be banned or questioned otherwise. Thankfully the right minded people have allowed both versions to co-exist both physically in libraries and digitally on the internet as it should be with any other creation.

They shouldn't be changed, but you're saying too that they shouldn't even be questioned? Why?



VGPolyglot said:

I'm not a utopian socialist. And privatization means making state-owned corporations private, so what does that have to do with what you're saying?

What you are describing is a Utopia.  Where everyone will just agree to disagree nicely and work out all of their problems.  And we can just be one big world with no states.  The world doesn't work that way.  Which is why the first thing Socialists do when they get power is to start crushing those who disagree with them and/or opposed them in their path to power.  And why they don't get along with people who believe in other forms of Socialism.  They all want the control of that big government and the power and wealth that comes with it.

And how do you not get this concept of privatization?  A company is not private when the government can just take it away from you because they don't like you or don't like your beliefs.  A private company is separate from the government and not controlled by it.  Sure, they may have to obey some regulations, but that is a FAR cry from the government just taking your company from you and handing it to someone that supports them.



d21lewis said:
History is history. Some things were acceptable at one time and not so much, now. I think we should have more discretion moving forward but let's not alter the past.

The Grimm Tales have been altered already over times. Even the brothers Grimm published their own interpretation of older tales and then changed them into more "christian" versions when people demanded it.



“It appeared that there had even been demonstrations to thank Big Brother for raising the chocolate ration to twenty grams a week. And only yesterday, he reflected, it had been announced that the ration was to be reduced to twenty grams a week. Was it possible that they could swallow that, after only twenty-four hours? Yes, they swallowed it.”

- George Orwell, ‘1984’

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VGPolyglot said:
o_O.Q said:

 

"are you advocating then for centralized management of the economy?"

the point i was trying to make is that societies regulate the problem of individual drives clashing by establishing something common across all of the people of a society and that is what we call government

for example government outlaws sexual harassment because the common idea of  society is that sexual harassment is bad and therefore government enforces laws to curb sexual harassment

and government is able to do so because it is a centralised force between the people of a society

 

this nonsense you were coming up with about centralisation being about individuals is wrong

 

just the word itself makes this clear "CENTRAL" or in other words "SOMETHING THAT EXISTS BETWEEN TWO OR MORE INDIVIDUAL THINGS"

 

on the other other hand "DECENTRALISED" or in other words "BREAKING OF A STRUCTURE INTO SMALLER PARTS OR INDIVIDUALS"

 

again where are you getting the idea that centralisation is about indivdiduals? while decentralisation is about groups?

 


Socialism would be broken into smaller groups, instead of a huge corporation overseeing a massive chain, it would be done in a bottom-top manner.

thismeintiel said:

No, you posted BS that I was easily able to refute.  You don't privatize industry with a government taking it away from the people who started it and putting in someone who favors the government.  It's the exact opposite of the meaning of the word.  And o_O.Q posted something addressing it, as well.

And let me burst your little Socialist Utopia bubble.  Socialism has, is, and always will be a lie, whatever form it comes in.  A lie perpetrated by a soon to be dictator to fool gullible people into thinking they will be given power, wealth, and/or protection.  The people believe this one man, or small group lead by this man, will give them the Socialist Utopia they desire.  But, instead rights are always stripped from the people, usually free speech and gun rights, to quiet discontent, to stop another revolution.   The same people who helped him/them gain power are the same ones who are crushed beneath the weight of an oppressive government.  Sure, they give people a "vote," but no one is going to vote against the man in charge, for fear they and their families will be persecuted and/or killed.  And near the end, there is always a group/s that the people's plight is blamed on. In the end, the people are no better off and just filled with hatred for someone or something, all of which was accomplished on the backs of thousands/millions dead from either war within the country, persecution by the government, and/or starvation and disease.

That's the way it has always played out and the way it will always play out.

I'm not a utopian socialist. And privatization means making state-owned corporations private, so what does that have to do with what you're saying?

BasilZero said:

 

Imo, fictional works created from artist and creators should not be changed because of someone's view. If its one thing, it'll lead to another deviating from the creator's original intention which should imo be protected.

 

The creations are from the creator and any type of change that is made is censorship which I am against.

In the case of Sleeping Beauty, there's two versions - the one that Disney made which is indeed a lighter version and the original version which was darker.

 

Both versions imo should exist - not be banned or questioned otherwise. Thankfully the right minded people have allowed both versions to co-exist both physically in libraries and digitally on the internet as it should be with any other creation.

They shouldn't be changed, but you're saying too that they shouldn't even be questioned? Why?

 

"Socialism would be broken into smaller groups, instead of a huge corporation overseeing a massive chain, it would be done in a bottom-top manner."

 

that's not what socialism is and even if it was the very idea of an organisation being run from the bottom is silly


do you know why we don't run organisations from the bottom? because generally the people on the bottom don't have the skill set of the people at the top

 

that's like saying that we should let children run their families as opposed to adults

 



VGPolyglot said:
DarthVolod said:

There was a 2014 study I'm trying to find that basically demonstrated it, but it is more or less something all straight men discover with experience. 

Whenever I have sex (this is assuming it is a girl you know well) I never ask for it ... and she never asks me if I'm in the mood either. It is just something you consent to in a nonverbal fashion. If you don't want it, usually you can make your intentions known ... "I'm not feeling well," "I'm tired," etc. etc. Both I and my girlfriend have used that. Honestly a flat out "No!" comes off as incredibly rude and insensitive. Of course, you may want to feel things out more if it is a girl you don't know well ... even still a "I want you" sounds smoother than "do I have your consent to engage in sexual intercourse with you now?"

OK, link me to the study.

This is the best I could find for now, I tried looking for an archive of it, but this is all that came up. 

https://plus.google.com/107285504009892166200/posts/QyhiuCMhkPL

Naturally, it is not a popular subject of research considering its implications. There really needs to be a lot more research on this imo. 

This one below is somewhat related and should be working too, it suggests that men and women look at consent rather differently, and men in particular tend to interpret people's behaviors as more sexual than a woman would on average. 

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2744967/



"Everything I don't like should be banned!" Post-modern far left in a nutshell..

They've officially taken on the role of the uber conservatives decades ago in terms of the dominant cultural authoritarians wanting everything regulated/controlled/banned



 

"We hold these truths to be self-evident - all men and women created by the, go-you know.. you know the thing!" - Joe Biden

thismeintiel said:
VGPolyglot said:

Nazis were not leftists.

National Socialists.  Yes, they were.  I know people on the left like to lump them with the right, just so the right has some big evils, too, but it's just not fact.  They wanted a big government to rule over the people with an iron fist, including businesses.  That's not a policy of the right.  Especially not the Conservative right.

This level of ignorance in 2017 is embarrassing, Nazis were never leftist, learn some history.

Last edited by Goodnightmoon - on 26 November 2017

This thread is hilarious, people getting ofended cause one random person on twitter got ofended by the sexism of a tale that has always been clearly sexist. "The world is doomed! She is a nazi! Political correctness will destroy us!" XD Sometimes it seems like we live in the age of stupidity but I guess is just the efect of internet giving voice to a mindblowing number of intelectually challenged people.

Last edited by Goodnightmoon - on 26 November 2017