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Forums - Politics - Catalonia declares independence. Puigdemont free to roam Belgium.

 

Who do you support?

Spain 139 59.40%
 
Catalonia 95 40.60%
 
Total:234
Nem said:
Goodnightmoon said:

What the fuck are you talking about imperialism, Catalona is not a colony or anything like that, Catalonia has NEVER been independent, its story is strongly united with Spain, what you call imperialism is nothing more than a country trying to protect the sovereignity of their own land, something any other country of europe would try to do, ioncluded yours, do you even know that independen is ilegal in your own country? in Portugal the creation of regional/local political parties is ILLEGAL, the politic parties that lead Catalonia to this point would have NEVER existed in Portugal, it isn't illegal here in Spain, in fact there are independentist politic parties with voice in the parlament of the Government of Spain.

Who is the imperialist now?


https://i.pinimg.com/originals/f3/05/a0/f305a050de2b133ff90d7a06f3dedf79.png

Learn some history.

Good work evading all I said, you probably didn't even knew your own country is even less flexible than Spain when it comes to separatism.

I know the history, you are showing me a map of the 13th century, so your arguments are based on  things that happenend on the middle ages lol I guess Europe should be formed by hundreds of little reigns again just because that's how it was 800 years ago. Nonsense to the highest level.

But not only that, that map can lead to wrong inrterpretations, Catalan Counties (do not confuse with the word countries) are colored in a different color but they were NEVER an independent kingdom, they were part of the Aragon Kingdom just like Valencia and Balearic Islands.

Last edited by Goodnightmoon - on 05 November 2017

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Goodnightmoon said:
Nem said:

https://i.pinimg.com/originals/f3/05/a0/f305a050de2b133ff90d7a06f3dedf79.png

Learn some history.

Good work evading all I said, you probably didn't even knew your own country is even less flexible than Spain when it comes to separatism.

I know the history, you are showing me a map of the 15th century, so your arguments are based on  things that happenend on the middle ages lol I guess Europe should be formed by hundreds of little reigns again just because that's how it was 600 years ago. Nonsense to the highest level.

That is because the parts of my country don't want to separate. Portugal isn't made of separate kingdoms subjugated to a main one. Portugal has always been one kingdom alone.



Update: Puigdemont and his friends are released under conditions, they have to stay in Belgium.



Nem said:
Goodnightmoon said:

Good work evading all I said, you probably didn't even knew your own country is even less flexible than Spain when it comes to separatism.

I know the history, you are showing me a map of the 13th century, so your arguments are based on  things that happenend on the middle ages lol I guess Europe should be formed by hundreds of little reigns again just because that's how it was 600 years ago. Nonsense to the highest level.

That is because the parts of my country don't want to separate. Portugal isn't made of separate kingdoms subjugated to a main one. Portugal has always been one kingdom alone.

Because its a small country, but if anyone in your country tried to become independent your country would say a big NO

Catalonia has never ever been an independent kingdom, it was part of the Aragon Kingdom, learn some history, seems like you know nothing.

Last edited by Goodnightmoon - on 05 November 2017

Ka-pi96 said:

Fair enough, I should have explained why I felt that way in the original post.

And how is Belgium already being a country not a caveat? The statements "it is up to us Belgians to decide whether Belgium is a country or not." and "it is up to us Catalans to decide whether Catalonia is a country or not." are practically identical, no? With those alone, as they are, how can you say one is fair and the other not? Additionally, how can you justify adding "since it's already a country" on to that statement?

I won't pretend that statement was stand alone, and you did have "Yeah except it is a country and if you don't mind" attached to the front of it. But no where in there does it suggest that it already being a country was a prerequisite for why Belgians get to decide whether it's a country or not.

Because it is up to countries to decide what they want to do with their future. Countries not regions. Well a region can decide a lot of things and regions in democratic countries do, but NOT that they can simply leave and become themselves countries. Because then any region can become a country not just Catalonia. Then I could decide my city should be a country, hell not all my city if I don't agree with other people in this city, I want my building to become a country. See? Where does it stop? Who decides how big a group must be to be independent?

It's a matter of order and logic. It's as if you worked for a company and you said: The boss is no longer the boss, I am the boss. Or perhaps a better example would be: My department does not agree with the other departments of the company so from now on, my department is a company independent of the main company...

That's not how things work. If a department had the same right as a company to decide for itself, it would not be called a department to begin with, it would be called a company.

Catalonia is a region, like Brussels, like the region around Paris called Ile de France etc. If it must have the same level of decision as countries do, then why call it a region in the first place? Also it would be chaos if all regions declared independence and called themselves countries.

Last edited by CrazyGamer2017 - on 05 November 2017

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Flilix said:
Update: Puigdemont and his friends are released under conditions, they have to stay in Belgium.

interesting, source?



Goodnightmoon said:
Nem said:

That is because the parts of my country don't want to separate. Portugal isn't made of separate kingdoms subjugated to a main one. Portugal has always been one kingdom alone.

Because its a small country lol But it anyone in your country tried to become independent your country would say a big NO

Catalonia has never ever been a kingdom, it was part of the Aragon Kingdom, learn some history, you know nothing.

lol and what are big countries but agregates of conquered kingdoms? For a unique kingdom Portugal is pretty big. We didn't have to subdue anyone against their will and we are very happy. No inserructions, wars and separatist movements. Go figure.

Wow and you just admited to having contradicted yourself. Lovely!

You know nothing. Sick of the BS you come up to justify subduing other peoples.

Maybe look at this map and tell me why.  http://www.learnnc.org/lp/media/uploads/2007/09/1492spain.jpg

Forced subduing. That is all Spain is. It will never be a union unless it actually tried to listen to it's people's. But meh... i really don't care about what the subduers have to say. I will always defend the right to freedom you denied to the Catalunyans and other regions before it. Spain will end, sooner or later. It is a pointless struggle. Hundreads of years after and people still harbor the resentment. It's not gonna go away, especially as these events keep repeating to rekindle the hatred.

Last edited by Nem - on 05 November 2017

Nem said:
Goodnightmoon said:

Because its a small country lol But it anyone in your country tried to become independent your country would say a big NO

Catalonia has never ever been a kingdom, it was part of the Aragon Kingdom, learn some history, you know nothing.

lol and what are big countries but agregates of conquered kingdoms? For a unique kingdom Portugal is pretty big. We didn't have to subdue anyone against their will and we are very happy. No inserructions, wars and separatist movements. Go figure.

Being so proud because your country (one of the most imperialist countries of the history btw) is now little enough to not have this problems is borderline pathetic.



Goodnightmoon said:
Nem said:

lol and what are big countries but agregates of conquered kingdoms? For a unique kingdom Portugal is pretty big. We didn't have to subdue anyone against their will and we are very happy. No inserructions, wars and separatist movements. Go figure.

Being so proud because your country (one of the most imperialist countries of the history btw) is now little enough to not have this problems is borderline pathetic.

Nope, that would be you. Portugal ended it's imperial ways long ago. But Portugal is not an empire in the mainland, Spain is. Just like Great Britain is aswell and why you are both having issues now.



Nem said:
Goodnightmoon said:

Because its a small country lol But it anyone in your country tried to become independent your country would say a big NO

Catalonia has never ever been a kingdom, it was part of the Aragon Kingdom, learn some history, you know nothing.

lol and what are big countries but agregates of conquered kingdoms? For a unique kingdom Portugal is pretty big. We didn't have to subdue anyone against their will and we are very happy. No inserructions, wars and separatist movements. Go figure.

Wow and you just admited to having contradicted yourself. Lovely!

You know nothing. Sick of the BS you come up to justify subduing other peoples.

Maybe look at this map and tell me why.  http://www.learnnc.org/lp/media/uploads/2007/09/1492spain.jpg

What contradiction are you talking about? That maps shows catalonia being a part of the Aragon Kingdom, so what's your point exactly? That I was right all along? lol


Last edited by Goodnightmoon - on 05 November 2017