Okay, fine, we'll move the goalpost:

Emulation is a tool of piracy for when the pirate can't even be bothered to buy the console. The kind of gamer who is so dead set on not owning the console to begin with is likely going to have a beefy PC.

As for your last part, I'll counter by saying that a substantial amount of the use of console mods and emulation is for piracy. A quick peek into any forum discussing it will reveal as much.

As for most emulator enthusiasts actually owning their games, they just want to play better versions? Bullshit. If you actually do what you say you do, fine. I've no place to call you a liar- you might be the one person who actually does. But to sit there and tell me that most do? I'm sorry, but that's simply an insult.

I just think it's crazy to make emulators illegal just because they can be used for piracy. That's like banning DVD writers because you could make illegal copies with it. Emulators just as homebrew on consoles are just a tool. What you do with it as a whole different story. 

Emulators are in fact important to preserve games of the past. Without them, the majority of games from the past would be lost forever soon enough. There will be a time when the last Amiga or C64 will cease to function. Without emulators we would have no way whatsoever to play the games from those machines, even if we have legitimate copies. Because of that I very much welcome emulators. I use them on a daily basis for playing some good old DOS games on my modern computer. No piracy involved. So why the heck should I suffer just because some other people use emulators for piracy? That's just nuts. That's like banning cars because some idiots use them to kill people. With that mindset MP3 would have also been declared illegal back in the day when music was only available on CDs. Sure, most people used MP3 for piracy in the 90s. But not everybody. Plus everyone profited from the tech that came with it. Streaming services today wouldn't be possible without the groundwork from MP3. In the same way virtual console wouldn't be possible today without the work from the developers of emulators. Even Nintendo themselves use tech from open source emulators and ROMs from the internet.

The gains are simply bigger than the losses on this one.

@Bolded for some people

I personally can't wait the 5-10+ years it takes for emulators to release after the initial release of a console, so I end up long having accrued my collection of games before it is possible to emulate them.  

@Initialize And I told you, a "beefy" pc is not enough. The system requirements for PC gaming and modern console emulation are very different. PC gaming is GPU heavy, emulation is CPU heavy. The person would have to design their PC specifically for emulation, or they are part of that 1% of PC gamers who don't care about costs and have an overclockable CPU anyway. Go to any Dolphin or PCSX2 forum and you'll find that the majority of posts are about how the games just don't run very well on their PC's that run graphically demanding PC title x, y, and z. 

@ Rest 

I chose the phrase "emulator enthusiasts" for a reason. These are the people who like to emulate because of how it makes the experiences of their games better. Emulation is not some niche exclusive to pirates. Go to Digital Foundry's videos on the best ways to play Retro games, and they'd often mention emulation as the best option. Obviously Digital Foundry a professional publication isn't going to be endorsing piracy. They are able to discern the difference between piracy and emulation. Now that isn't to say that the person who really wants to play that odd game, but doesn't have the platform is other than you described, but they aren't the ones buying the "beefy" pc's with emulation as one of the things on their mind. They are the ones downloading a GBA, N64 or PS emulator on their cell phone to play Pokemon, Ocarina of Time, or Crash Bandicoot (games released decades ago on platforms that are long dead.) 

No idea. But Ive heard with firmware version 3.00 on the switch, they forgot to add some protections or such, and hackers are having a field day.

Basically Switch Emulator might be out sooner than the PS4 one.

Never say never. As long as Atlus ain't owned by Sony or Nintendo, there is always a good chance.

Neither the Persona series or the Shin Megami series ar exclusive for Nintendo or Sony, so why not add Steam to the mix for additional sales? There was even a Persona 1 PC version in Japan.

• "PlatinumGames developed games will never come to Steam!"-> MGR:R, Bayonetta, Vanquish...
• "Spike Chunsoft developed games will never come to Steam!"-> every Danganronpa and Zero Escape game
• "Final Fantasy games will never come to Steam!"-> every Final Fantasy game
• ...

Yeah, right... heard that "prediction" very often over the years.

I wouldn't act so cock sure like that if I were you. Never say never and also emulation is a form os digital rpeservation.

You don't like the thread?, you do not have to come into it.

I don't care what they are tools for, that falacy has already been pointed out several times. Anything can be a tool for something illegal.

Personally I don't even much care about piracy. In plenty of the world there are no legal ways to buy the software to begin with and I see no moral objection why an industrious enough person shouldn't do the best he/she can to enjoy the medium that so many of us take for granted.

The reason for me to not pirate games is not because it's illegal. I don't pirate games because it's more convenient for me to play legit copies of them. Because I can afford this cost for my favourite hobby and because I love having my digital library available anytime, anywhere as long as I have internet.

Now we could have an actual conversation if we were discussing piracy itself and the moral case for/against it. In the case of emulators there's no leg to stand in trying to make those illegal.

Nintendo keeps using emulators on their consoles to play their legacy games. Sega is doing the same now on mobile. If you're not making the case it should also be illegal for them, then it shouldn't be illegal at all.

Your list of working consoles is anecdotal evidence. 

My stance was always that emulators for modern games and systems should be illegal.

PS3 is last gen and thus still modern. Especially when games like Persona 5, Trails of Cold Steel, etc. are still coming out for it. Emulators violate copyright law as clear as day. If you make a living by accepting patreon donations in exchange for working on an emulator for a modern system you are a criminal. 

I meant that playing PS1 games on an emulator is fine ethically. Legally it may be another story depending on whether or not the patent on the bios is still valid. If the patent/s on the PS1 ran out, and you own the disk, then it is legal. 

If you own a game you don't need to buy it again. Most people's hardware still works to this day. If you choose to play your original copy on an emulator (something that only really exists for a single console), and the bios patent/s ran out you should be ok. 

Incorrect! If that was the case, there would be no emulators for any relatively modern systems.

Persona and SMT have only ever been on Nintendo or Sony systems with the exception of Persona 1 in Japan. 

Platinum games games' were all multiplats. Of course they would come to steam eventually. 

Spike Chunsoft makes visual novels. That's bread and butter for PC in Japan. 

The majority of Final Fantasy games didn't come to steam until over a decade after their original release. Sure we may see a Steam version of Persona 5 by 2027, but that wouldn't be very surprising at all. By 2027 all games will be digital "games as a service" nonsense anyway.