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Forums - Nintendo - How Nintendo could get all the third party support in the world.

RolStoppable said:
sc94597 said:

(...)

were all third party games I enjoyed on Wii which I can recall. There were probably a few others as well. 

The Last Story, Pandora's Tower, Endless Ocean 1+2 and Fatal Frame 4 are Nintendo games.

Does Nintendo own the Fatal Frame franchise now?



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RolStoppable said:
VGPolyglot said:

Does Nintendo own the Fatal Frame franchise now?

They co-own the IP with Koei-Tecmo. This has been the case since Fatal Frame 4.

Ahh, now I see. Though it looks like it was actually after 4 that they did that:

https://www.destructoid.com/report-nintendo-now-co-owns-the-fatal-frame-ip-229986.phtml



I think after the wiiU, Nintendo realized their market is in the portability area rather than dedicated home consoles. Sure, Nintendo could make a competitor to the ps/xbox but then they'd always need to compete with Sony and MS with the latest console tech and exclusive deals. I don't think Nintendo wants to do that because it is not their forte.

So Nintendo's solution is to succeed in a market they have always been great at and where others continue to not keep up which is handhelds. But they also realized that they do still need a number of third party games to fill in the droughts. So with the Switch, they got third party developer input and mixed it in with their own specialties (for better or for worse) and that is how we got the Switch.

Now of course, due to the differences between the x1/ps4 vs the switch, it won't get a lot of the western third party games but, at least for this generation, it doesn't need to. It just needs to give a different enough experience with different enough games for the Switch to be considered as a secondary (or primary) gaming device and they are doing just that.

The downside is of course the risk involved. If they somehow screw up with the next generation like they did with the wiiU, they no longer have a carry device. But if they do what they are doing with the Switch, I think they will be good. It is always great to have more third party games but if it means competing with MS/Sony, then I doubt Nintendo will do it.



                  

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RolStoppable said:
sc94597 said:

(...)

were all third party games I enjoyed on Wii which I can recall. There were probably a few others as well. 

The Last Story, Pandora's Tower, Endless Ocean 1+2 and Fatal Frame 4 are Nintendo games.

Oh yes, I forgot about the first two being Nintendo IP's because they were published by Xseed in North America. I don't know why I forgot about the last three lol. 



RolStoppable said:
You have no idea what you are talking about.

This.

While Rol and I disgree often on whether or not a Nintendo console will get the big AAA support, what you suggest in the OP is how Nintendo really would doom itself. Not only that but N64 and Gamecube both prove you wrong, Wii actually had good 3rd party support, just not your cherry picked opinion that only includes big AAA titles.

NES/SNES were successfull due to providing what consumers wanted in gaming of the time, high quality and immense fun. Nintendo IPs drove the sales and 3rd parties went where 90% of the customers were. This allowed Nintendo to create ball-breaking agreements and piss them off.

N64 and GC were less successful (still profitable and thus still a success) because the market grew towards 3rd party specific titles and Nintendo had ruined that relationship. Carts vs Disks would have been overcome, after all the portable line has always remained with carts, even with others tried to offer a different path. Simple conclusion was that 3rd parties did not want to deal with Nintendo's policies and needed time to rebuild that relationship. This combined with PS machines having 70% of the market, there was little reason to deal with Nintendo.

Wii was a massive success. There is no way to argue it wasn't. It had 3rd party content that devs felt they could put on the hardware. It was too massive of a consumer base to ignore even when similar titles sold less by volume as compared to PS360. It was still worth the risk to build a one-off version for Wii as it was pretty much guaranteed to be profitable.

WiiU was a failure for reasons that do not include its raw power output. It flat out didn't sell to consumers and that justified 3rd parties to walk away. They already knew at parity their titles would sell less (evidenced by Wii) but with no one buying the console, the risk just simply wasn't worth it. Plus, this is the gen where big 3rd parties, namely EA, were attempting to push consoles to a digital only future with their stores on the devices as well. Nintendo wouldn't do that (MS tried and failed while Sony recognized early enough that MS was failing so they dropped the idea before announcment). This is literally why Nintendo went from "unprecedented EA support" at one E3 to being dropped from every possible title by the next E3 (related to EA only). Nintendo backed out of any perceived agreements they had with EA on this digital front.

Switch is already proving to be a success to consumers and that is even with unproven 3rd party support. Switch fixes the middleware support that also plagued previous Nintendo consoles which removes more barriers for 3rd parties. Switch will get as much and more 3rd party support than Wii did. There will certainly still be titles that won't make it due to the hardware differences between Switch and the top-end MSony machines, but that will be the exception and not the rule. (my opinion)



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Cerebralbore101 said:

So what does Nintendo have to do to get good third party support? Simple. Make a system that is graphically competitive, sells well, and is easy and cheap to make games for.

Theres a system like that... its the PS4.

It has no waste (unnessary features), R&D + BoM where well spent, its got good price/performance ratios, and its cheap.

Its hard to win, by being simular to the leading system.

 

Wright said:

Wii's third party support was great, by the way. Not exemplary or anything, but great. It really didn't need amazing graphics to get games on it.

^ this total system sales matter more in attracting 3rd party.

Nintendo just needs to keep up production rates, hopefully get a 50$ price cut first year (it cant be 100$ more than PS4 is come holidays).



The Switch is doing fine and their are still people who think Ninty need to make a console to compete with PS and xbox even though they have done that in the past and still failed? Jeez, they couldnt beat Sony when they were the unknown brand in gaming and they cant do it 4 home consoles each. Hell the worse selling Sony home console still sold more than any of Nintendo's but Wii and it wasnt even that far behind that one. Let it go



Cerebralbore101 said:

 If we were to include every single PS3/360 third party title that was at the minimum good we'd have a list of over 100 games. In comparison Wii didn't have good third party support at all.

That's not a counter-argument to the line of thought of what you proposed at all. You were the one that brought the total number of Wii third-party games you could think in regards to my post about Wii having great third party support; I merely expanded upon it. Whether the other consoles got 100 or 1000 third party games is irrelevant, the point was about Wii having third-party support. It did, and it was great.



N64 was more powerful than PS1 and Gamcube was more powerful than PS2. So simply making a more powerful system is not the answer.

The issue is that third parties were treated horribly by Nintendo for a long time, and then many of them wanted to focus on making cinematic games with prerendered scenes and backgrounds, which cartridges couldn't pull off as cheaply, so they went for where they could use those assets, and took the sales with them.

Nintendo has to figure out how to do their own thing, like the Wii or the Switch, while keeping the console cheap and close enough to the others in power that it can get many of those games. It remains to be seen if the Switch is at that level, but initial sales give third parties incentive to jump on board and it is easy to use the latest Unreal engine with.



Nintendo will never get all the third party support in the world because thir party developers target a different audience.