Your spin doesn't hold any water when there's not anyone really acting as if it's the end all be all. Not here anyway, I'm speaking to the general Xbox user here at this community. You can be excited about a beast console and yet at the same time not think graphics are everything. But that has zero to do with all the threads and posts we saw about how much power DID matter every time an Xbone game was 900p versus a 1080p PS4 version. But hey, now power is completely irrelevant. Wonder why.

Xbox fans here prefer Xbox for the games, system features like BC and Game Pass, controller, UI, network, etc. Now we still have that, and the most powerful console ever. It's exciting times. The only thing lost here is the ability for one fan base to gloat about small power differences. Hence the salt, "suddenly so coveted" LOL. Enjoy the last word, not gonna waste more time with you on this :)

First, I never said they would be successful. Just that they would do it. '

Second, I'd ask yourself what is more important to Microsoft: Windows or XBox? Which would Microsoft save first? The answer is obvious. 

The battle for the living room is pointless. It's like fighting over who has the best clown shoes. Who cares if yours are the best, why are you wearing those in the first place? XBox only exists because Sony WAS a threat. Sony is now a gutted company and Apple is a new threat. If you think Microsoft is in the console market to win it, then you don't understand Microsoft's business. If the company was so concerned about XBox, why has it been a big money pit? It's not meant to be profitable but to fight off the threat from Sony. Now, Sony isn't that big of a threat because mobile exists.

Lastly, in terms of portability, Sony's net income has declined from 15 to 16 its mostly propped up by the financial services business, so I wouldn't say they are killing it. 

Outside of the top three what are Xbox games really? There's no identity. Nintnedo and Sony fans can tell you what the mission statement of their company of choice is and they continue to deliver because they both have successsful formulas while striving to find new ones. As someone on a podcast said, "it can't be the games"... it has to be the system features.Those are the true exclusives they look for. That said, yes Microsoft does make a great interface.

Ori alone is better than any exclusive I have played on PS4. Just my opinion, you're welcome to disagree. Either way, not going to bother with list warz. You've made countless threads and posts about how crappy you think Microsoft is in this area, no point in trying to change your mind.

I have a Windows PC.  You know how much MS makes off of me?  Except for the money they were paid to put Windows on the laptop, nada.  I use Steam and, occassionaly, GOG, as do most PC gamers.  MS sees not one dime of that.  Why do you think they are trying to push Windows Store?  They want some of what Steam, Origin, and GOG has.

The average consumer is also not worried about 6Tflops of power, either.  They are going to be the ones picking up the $199 PS4, with a slight possibility of picking up a Pro, if it is $299, mostly based on price.  They aren't going to be interested in a $499 Scorpio with the other options being much cheaper.  Which is why I'm not talking about the average consumer, but those who are more informed.  And those who are interested in more power are more likely to be skilled enough to build a $499-$549 PC this holiday season with similar GPU performance of a Scorpio, but with a much better CPU.  And it will play every game the Scorpio will.

The Scorpio is also going to have problems hitting 60FPS on more demading games because they went with the same Jaguar cores, only slightly more overclocked than the Pro.  Granted, I don't really care about 60FPS as a standard, nor do most console gamers.  Steady is better.  Whether it be 30FPS or 60FPS.  Still, this isn't going to be some magical 4K60FPS machine.  Is also depends on how well devs bother to push the system.  Sony is in a position to ask devs to push the Pro, is MS? Hardly.  We may see the Scorpio just get Pro ports, some slightly upgraded, if it sells poorly.

Amazon is not the only source, but they have the most available data to the public, and it has been accurate in predicting who would win NPD over 95% of the time this gen.  It is also the largest online retailer, by far.  To have some 3rd party peripheral outselling your #1 console SKU is not good in the least.

As for the PS5, it's going to be a next gen system with all the hype that comes with it.  And Sony is sticking with AMD, most likely, which probably means the 12.5Tflops (probably 11-12Tflops after downclocking for heat) Vega 10, possibly the 15Tflops (~13-14Tflops after downclocking) Vega 20, is what's going in it.  It doesn't matter if the Scorpio is $299 at that point, the PS5 will still have much wider appeal, especially WW.  And actual exclusives to help push it.

You mean the general Xbox fan who used to love the 360 vs PS3 comparisons?  Where lack of grass in Mafia 2 was mocked?  The ones who mostly left or stayed quiet because they couldn't stand being on the other side of the argument?  Funny how I haven't seen any PS fans leave because of the Scorpio approaching.  Probably because we feel the same way as before.  Power is great, but means nothing without something to push it or an appealing price/identity. 

And thanks for "permission" to have the last word.  Of course, that doesn't really matter to me.  But, I will say this disscussion is over, even if you feel the need to respond.  Have a nice day. 

Again, you have Windows 10 so you're in their ecosystem.

Maybe Windows 10 is spying on you (it likely is), maybe you'll buy some MS games on either Steam or their store, but like it or not you're in the MS ecosystem.

Yeah, you're stuck with Windows. Just be glad it isn't that bad.

I'm not entirely convinced the only money MS gets is from the Windows license. Either way, you're supporting MS like it or not.

I wouldn't expect a $199 PS4 anytime soon. I'm actually thinking when Pro and Scropio can achieve $249, they will stop making the OG hardware. Hence, midgen upgrades will phase out old specs.

I'm not entirely convinced Scorpio will be $499. We'll see at E3 I guess.

Console CPU aren't extremely powerful, but console games are often better optimized than PC games. I own a fairly capable gaming PC and the X1 does amazing things with little power. So Scorpio's power in the console realm is gonna be impressive.

Again, I'm curious to see what custom CPU in Scorpio is capable of. Its designed to be faster and more efficient. That should help when doing 60 fps. I'm curious to see that in practice.

Frankly, I'm not really even thinking about PS5 right now. All we can do is speculate given we don't know when its coming, the price/power it will aim for, etc. Your expectations might be a bit high if its coming in 2020 and aiming for $399. People argue Scropio has to be $499 right now with dated specs.

Well, they can enjoy my $50 over the next 3+ years before I get another laptop.

The PS4 will be $199 this year, at least during Black Friday and, most likely, some other period during the holidays.  Sony is continuing with gens.  And regardless of what MS says, I imagine they will, too.  This means that the Pro may stay on the market slightly longer than the OG PS4, but PS4 games will still be made with the OG PS4 in mind. 

I'm sure the CPU will be more capable than the Pro, but I imagine that is more to do with the overclocking than any radical change to the Jaguar cores.  There's a reason MS is pushing the clock so high.  And it's not because they customized the cores to get much more power per Hz than the Pro.  Just don't expect a 30FPS-40FPS game on the Pro to run at 60FPS on the Scorpio.  Probably be more like 45FPS.  Games that are closer to 60FPS,  like 50FPS-55FPS, on the Pro will probably hit it on the Scorpio, though.  At least more consistently.

As for price, that is what DF is proposing as the price.  Considering MS went to them to reveal the console, it sounds like they may have hinted at the price.  Probably had them "speculate" it to get the idea of it being $499 out there.  See how it sits with gamers.  We may see them try to hit $449, saying, "See, it's not as much as you thought it would be."  However, given they have said a few times it is a premium console for a premium price, it definitely doesn't seem like they are aiming at $399.

I expect the PS5 in 2019, 6 years after the PS4 launched.  As for specs, they are actually in line with making a $399 console.  The Ryzen 1700 is already out and is a much better CPU than the Jaguar.  It goes for $325 right now.  By the end of 2019, it will be at least 50% cheaper, most likely a little more.  So, ~$150 at retail.  That means Sony could probably buy them in bulk for ~$100.  At maximum, the Vega 10 is going to launch for $500 this year.  By 2019, it'll be $250, so Sony can get them for ~$200.  That brings us to just $300.  That's still ~$100 to play with RAM, motherboard, cooling, and casing.  Of course, given that the RX480 was only $200 at launch, I could see the Vega being cheaper, like $300-$400.  And keep in mind, Sony is fine with taking a loss on HW, initially.  So, they may just decide to go with a Vega 20 to make sure they have enough power to be ~2.5x the Scorpio, and not just 2x.  Either way, prices are going to fall relatively quick, which will allow them to be profitable on HW within a year or so.

Exactly. It's not like the PS4 Pro or the New 3DS received major exclusive games. The same will follow with XB1 Scorpio, it's just an updated/enhanced version of an existing console.