Mario. No contest. Still the platform king.

"The's a whole load of null and void things in your post here for a start Splatoon has modes for competitive and non competitive play it's more inviting to play than both Smash and MK in that sense, the game scales your skill to match you with similar players so no they won't have to worry about skill level it's like the concept of match making is new to you it's been around for years and even the first game has it. Splatoon is also far more more intuitive despite your claim allowing control options that suit the player, it's a simple game that has a lot of depth."

I suppose you missed where I said, "especially if the matchmaking is as poor as the first one".  I think my level in Splatoon is about 30 or so.  When I play I'm regularly put with players that are up to 20 levels above or below me.  I'm pretty confused about the non-competitive modes you're talking about.  Aside from the short single player mode they don't exist.

"I don't know how you think controls in Splatoon are more difficult either because for years 3D Mario was scaling back and removing actions Mario could do to make the game more simple which contradicts your point."

Suppose we have two recipes.  Recipe A and recipe B.  Recipe A was created in 1995.  Since then, the amount of sugar in the recipe has been consistently scaled back.  Is it more or less sweet compared to recipe B?

The answer of course is that we have no way to tell.  Because how much something has changed over the years has no bearing on how it compares to something completely different.  How much Mario has been simplified has nothing to do with how it compares to Splatoon.

"Little pressure to rush doesn't mean a game is accessible to casuals Metroid Prime has little pressure to rush through most of it doesn't mean it helps a casual player under what you're trying say Mario Kart is stressful to them because the are 11 other players battling them as you're trying to claim competitive play is not casual friendly when that's false as casuals play games like COD, FIFA and so on all the time."

No.  I didn't claim that Mario Kart is stressful, or competitive play is not casual friendly.  Nowhere did I say any of those things, so stop putting words in my mouth.

Having a game put a timer on your actions, or having aggressive enemies that can attack you from half a screen away objectively makes then more complex and challenging than games without those features.  Of course, these are not the only factors that make a game more or less complex, so there are other factors (for instance Mario Kart's tendency to give the last place player better items) that also need to be considered.  That's why I didn't mention these things as the be all end all of accessibility, but just one factor.  When you compare all the ways that Splatoon is more complex, then it is pretty clear that it is more complex overall.

"Splatoon is simple to get into, load the game up pick your weapon and start facing off against people I guarantee you casuals will understand more about how to play Splatoon 2 after several games then what they do about navigating an open world Odyssey in the same amount of time. It's understandable because 3D Mario is more for avid players I'll bet money a 2D Mario game will appear on the Switch for casual players."

Again, you don't really seem to understand how comparing things works, or you'd stay focussed on 3D Mario and Splatoon.  I already said 2D Mario is simpler than 3D.  That has nothing to do with how it compares to Splatoon.

There is absolutely nothing that would make navigating Mario Odyssey's World more complex than navigating Splatoon's, aside from the fact that levels in Mario are somewhat larger.  Both require navigation in a 3D space.  Splatoon also involves a whole host of other actions, all while dealing with enemies that are equal in power to you, and can attack from any angle even if they are nowhere near you.

Splatoon is more complex in basically every way, which makes sense because shooters are generally more complex than platformers.  If you'd like to tell me specifically what makes a 3D Mario game more complicated than Splatoon, go ahead.

Both will sell well, but people have wanted a new 3D adventure Mario game for a long time and the WiiU never really got one. With that in mind, Mario will easily sell more.

The nonsense that people talk about Super Mario 3D World just because it wasn't the nostalgic callback to their Mario game of choice. That game was phenomenal, completely deserving of standing in the Mario series, and one of the best games on Wii U.

At any rate, this topic isn't about that. I do think that Mario will be the beneficiary of the broader userbase of the Switch and will probably outsell Splatoon, but I think we all know by now that underestimate Splatoon's selling power at your peril.

I know perfectly well how comparisons work mate you seem to be the one struggling as reading your reply it's clear you didn't even read some of the points properly, Splatoon has an unranked mode for casual play your level doesn't measure your skill only your number of games with the game hence why it only unlocks gear, rank is measured by letters S, A, B etc... the fact you don't even know this makes me question your experience with the game altogether. You even need to get to level 5 or so to start playing competitive modes unless they patched that out so newcomers play a number of casual bouts before they play higher skilled players so by default your match making argument is null and void as what you're refering to is not competitive match making you're just playing other casuals.

Under your own logic playing Mario Kart with other people trying to win would be stressful for a casual because you're arguing people would get discouraged in a 4v4 because the is another team trying to win, you may as well argue Smash is the same because the other player is trying to win. You've not given any concrete arguments why Splatoon is more complex tbh.

The 2D Mario part is were I know you're not reading the post properly, it was brought up to highlight how simple games sell better to casual players and yes having larger more complex worlds is more complex, Splatoon are small simple arenas that you spread ink in that you can use your squid ability in you simply run around and fire your weapon and don't have to worry about how many kills you rack up. A large open world Mario would not only require more use and knowledge of the move set than Splatoon does but needs a more avid approach to progress compared to shooting ink around a small arena.

Mario Odyssy

Probably Mario. I think Splatoon 2 will match or surpass its predecessor, easily, but I expect Mario Odyssey to far out pace it. 3D World is the weakest 3D game in terms of sales iirc and Odyssey has a ton more hype and interest than 3D World ever had. So yeah, I anticipate far better sales than 3D World. So I think both will be very significant successes but 3D World will be the winner easily.

How can anyone think mario will sell less?

Mario alone will create a huge stock issue for the Switch during the holidays

Haha, Mario on the Wii U sold the same as a new IP. Not only that Mario had a 2 year head start. Not only that, most of the Wii U's purchased were purchased with the Mario bundle. Splatoon is going to destroy 99% of all video games on the Switch.

That's actually huge number for Nintendo game (its easily single most viewed game vide on Nintendo YouTube channel), also comparing multi platform game with exclusive game definatly is not best comparison.

https://www.youtube.com/user/Nintendo/videos?view=0&flow=grid&sort=p

That's not true.

https://www.nintendo.co.jp/ir/en/sales/software/wiiu.html

Hardly Splatoon 2 will destroy games on Switch like Zelda BotW, MK8 Deluxe and Mario Odyssey (not to mentione games like Pokemon or Animal Crossing), but beside those game it will have great sales.

Well that explains a lot. :D