Forums - Politics Discussion - Betsy DeVos confirmed as Education secretary after Pence breaks 50-50 tie.

dahuman said:

More budget in education did not yield in better schools or smarter students to start with, instead of giving the money taken away from school to another set of schools, use the money to fix the fucking homeless situation in the country first, fucktarded ass politicians.

Indeed, people keep wanting more money thrown at education with no results. If Better DeVos supports charter schools and better school choice, then I have to support her by default.

But I'm not sure what the solution to the homeless is. Especially when many of them seem to be mentally ill, alcoholics, drug addicts, etc. In a lot of cases they need to help themselves before we can help them.



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StarOcean said:
I'm sure Trump's devoted cult will find a way to defend this pick

But its not just Trump supporters that support school choice and charter schools.

Lets be frank, people support this because public school aren't always doing a great job.



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Soundwave said:
fatslob-:O said:

The US spends a total of at least around $11700 on average for each student! That's enough to fund a year in university but the kicker here is we're doing it for 12 years instead of 4 ... (If anything I think we need to cut school funding and focus on the academic essentials. That means gutting gyms, the humanities, the arts, maybe some other extracurriculars, social sciences, and remedial level classes.) 

The problem isn't funding, the problem is that the US has bad curriculum and low quality students. Emulating the model that east asians use is the best bet since it's their style is the most cost efficient and it produces results. 

There's lot's of affordable colleges in the US, kids need to stop fantasizing about getting into the Ivy Leagues or similar and you wouldn't have to worry so much about debt if you picked the right field of study LOL ...

This is about money, plain and simple. There are people who see a big market in charging money for elementary to high school, why not, colleges make a fortune. 

Imagine how much money could be made for a select few if you gut public education so badly that "avearge Americans" feel like they have to pay for charter/private schools. Big, big, big money. 

And for the parents that can't afford private/charter schools -- too fucking bad for you.  Why suck people dry for education just when they're 18 when you can start to bleed them dry right from 1st grade. It's smart business actually. Completely unethical and morally gross of course, but smart business and typical dirty politics. 

But we could take a lot of money from public school, tell them to create a better curriculum that focuses on subjects that actually matter like math and english, and potentially get better results. We keep pouring money into public education with no results.

 

 

Frankly, a lot of private schools cost significantly less than the 11K we spend to educate kids in public school. So if people could take that money to the school of their choice, great.



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irstupid said:
axumblade said:

Education is already screwed up. Most schools have cut the Arts programs significantly. I've also heard there have been some schools that have cut a lot of funding for science programs as well. I can only imagine how bad it will get

I always love when people complain like this.

"OMG school has been getting shittier and shittier and are ranking and grades have been dropping steadily for years compared to world wide. How dare they put someone new into power that isn't going to do the same thing we have been doing"

I have no idea who this lady is or what she stands for, but how about we let her do something before we cry about the sky falling. I've been hearing for years how our school system is going to shit. Thus doesn't that mean that our prior Education Secretarys have been shit?

 

edit: also arts programs get cut for lack of funding, not because of some agenda. If you care so much for them, make a donation to the school of your choosing and stipulate it be used for the arts. My colleges call me all the time for donations. High Schools don't, but I guarantee they are not against donations.

What kind of tragic logic!? Do you let a Lion bite you before you deem it dangerous? If someone has  a proven track record of incompetence and has pushed values you find  hugely regressive, it makes every sense that you speak on your displeasure. 

You're complaining about people being political engaged and actually having an opinion.



Simple solution to all the whining about DeVos: abolish the Department of Education.



 
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fatslob-:O said:
The best primary and secondary schools in the world are private schools which are usually boarding schools, I don't understand the animosity towards private schools ...

I believe the problem isn't with schools (considering the funding public schools get they should be able to easily afford college level texts) but the problem lies in american students who use so much more yet don't produce results up to match with each asian countries ...

The problem with a lot of private schools in America is their religious bias. They teach children what they want to teach, and the religion often supersedes science. If they don't get enough scientific education, the US will start to lag behind in scientific and technological development.



irstupid said:
axumblade said:

Education is already screwed up. Most schools have cut the Arts programs significantly. I've also heard there have been some schools that have cut a lot of funding for science programs as well. I can only imagine how bad it will get

I always love when people complain like this.

"OMG school has been getting shittier and shittier and are ranking and grades have been dropping steadily for years compared to world wide. How dare they put someone new into power that isn't going to do the same thing we have been doing"

I have no idea who this lady is or what she stands for, but how about we let her do something before we cry about the sky falling. I've been hearing for years how our school system is going to shit. Thus doesn't that mean that our prior Education Secretarys have been shit?

 

edit: also arts programs get cut for lack of funding, not because of some agenda. If you care so much for them, make a donation to the school of your choosing and stipulate it be used for the arts. My colleges call me all the time for donations. High Schools don't, but I guarantee they are not against donations.

Her record in Michigan is mediocre at best.



Thuglas said:
Hiku said:

This is your drained swamp, America. A billionaire GOP donor gets a Cabinet job she's utterly unqualified for.
And her embarrasing incompetence is not even the most scary part. It's that she has actively worked to ruin public schools by taking away government funding from them in order to instead fund private (religious) schools. Which caused the affected public schools to fail badly. This has been her life long ambition.

The Senate on Tuesday confirmed school choice advocate Betsy DeVos as Education secretary by the narrowest of margins, with Vice President Mike Pence breaking a 50-50 tie in a historic vote.

Two Republicans joined Democrats in the unsuccessful effort to derail the nomination of the wealthy Republican donor. The Senate historian said Pence's vote was the first by a vice president to break a tie on a Cabinet nomination.

https://www.apnews.com/53d48c109fd74ff68659e8795e70521e/Senate-set-to-confirm-DeVos-as-education-secretary?utm_campaign=SocialFlow&utm_source=Twitter&utm_medium=AP

Somehow I can't believe she got confirmed after how much public attention her confirmation hearing got, where her incompetence was put on full display. But that just goes to show how shameless politicians who are bribed by wealthy people or corporations are.

Public schools are absolutely garbage in most low income cities in America. The religious schools (and Charter schools in some states) perform better than Public school. How can you posibly be against giving more oportunity for children to get better education? I grew up in Detroit and it became so apparent why it is so hard for people to escape poverty. The biggest problem were the public schools I attended. Kids in every classroom were out of control and the teachers didn't care at all.  This isn't the case for charter schools in inner cities (she advocated for charter schools too). Charter school demand has been on the rise yet their has been fight back against creating more of them.

Democrat leaders seem to be adamently against allowing young kids a chance to escape the broken public school system as of late. They are fighting against DeVos plan for school choice and public education officials have shot down the creation of more charter schools in New York in the past claiming "it doesn't meet our education standards" despite them out perfoming public schools in the same area. We need more charter schools in inner cities! Nothing wrong with religuous schools either since they have proven they know how to teach kids. If the parents are okay with sending kids to a Catholic school then help them do so. If we want to help poor comunities then it starts at education. how many more decades of failing public schools do we need before we try something new?

The reason why public schools are garbage in low income cities is because there is no money put into those schools.  Instead that money goes to more upper to middle class areas.  Also you have to remember that charter schools are public schools.  They are regulated by the state and get their funding by the fed as well.  The difference between Charter and regular public schools is that parents can choose to send their kids to a charter school instead of tied to a school district.  Also Charter schools are not regulated the same way as public schools where a public school has to accept every child within its area while charter schools can accept student based on whatever they deem approatiate.  The reason you probably see some charter and private schools have better scores than public is because they can choose the students that go to those schools.  Private schools have interviews, testing and exams to pick their students so they can make sure they are always at the top.  

The reason there are fight back against charter schools is because of the huge corruption within the system.  A lot of charter schools Yes there are charter schools that are great but then again there are also public schools that are great as well.  The thing is that we should not be defunding any of our schools but instead putting in more money.  Why are we going to spend even more money on our military when our schools systems lack so much compared to the rest of the world.

To sum this up, I have no problem with this new education secretary wanting to bring more charter or even help fund Christian schools, what I have a problem with is that during her interview, she showed a complete lack of understanding of the education system.  She appeared to be totally without qualification or understanding.  Also, if her job is to defund already hurting public schools only to put that money into private schools leaving behind a host of children needing quality education only to help pay for the ones who can afford to go to private schools then I have a serious problem with that.



She has control over student loans, educational funding, Title IX statuses, a lot of power for someone who treated the public school system with disdain, and with no experience AT ALL.



deskpro2k3 said:

She has control over student loans, educational funding, Title IX statuses, a lot of power for someone who treated the public school system with disdain, and with no experience AT ALL.

Don't agree with her appointment at all.

However her disdain for public schooling system has no bearing on anything. Fallacy that it should.

You don't have to like the work a department has traditionally done to be good at kicking ass and making sure it's run correctly. It could be argued honestly that the reverse is true.