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Forums - Politics Discussion - Which ideology is worse: fascism or communism?

 

So, which one is it?

Fascism 127 69.40%
 
Communism 56 30.60%
 
Total:183
WolfpackN64 said:
VGPolyglot said:

I guess that is an important distinction to make: fascism was created by political leaders, while communism was more of a prediction of the future. I don't think Marx anticipated the creation of the welfare state, though.

The creation of the welfare state was necessary for capitalism to survive. The conditions under capitalism caused people to swarev to socialism, resistance and supression of those ideas created the nationalist alternative, fascism. To stop the far right from growing again, the welfare state was necessary. Capitalism couldn't really work after WWII anymore without a bit of socialism mixed in.

Politicians seem to forget the importance of the welfare state these days, que the rise of the new far right.

I don't disagree, I'm just stating that Marx himself probably didn't expect capitalism to survive this long, although I thought that the welfare state was more to appease the left than the far right.



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No point in arguing which one is the worst when both are absolutely terrible.



My bet with The_Liquid_Laser: I think the Switch won't surpass the PS2 as the best selling system of all time. If it does, I'll play a game of a list that The_Liquid_Laser will provide, I will have to play it for 50 hours or complete it, whatever comes first. 

John2290 said:
vivster said:
Looks like VGC is full of lousy commies.

Why are you even on this site? It's one thing to be negative but to be negative all the damn time in all topics? C'mon, be better or be better at it!

Or maybe you should stop being so negative all the time and pretend that every comment you don't understand is negative. That's a thought.



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VGPolyglot said:

Communism is a classless, stateless society.

Which can never exist. Hence why I said communism is the theory which is most ignorant of human nature and all attempts to implement have never and will never result in anything but death and misery.



They're exactly the same. People like to play semantics, but the truth is they are the same thing. They both involve a small central group, usually lead by a dictator, who rules the country with an iron fist (the military), pushing their beliefs. Their political enemies are dealt with by either imprisonment or death.



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Fascism isn't an idioligy.
Lol



badgenome said:
VGPolyglot said:

Communism is a classless, stateless society.

Which can never exist. Hence why I said communism is the theory which is most ignorant of human nature and all attempts to implement have never and will never result in anything but death and misery.

While I would agree today it can't work, in 200-300 years, who knows. 

How do you monetize something if everything can be replicated for example? Such a technology would destroy a supply/demand based economic system and that's a technology that theoretically we'll likely eventually get to (3D printers are the first tiny baby steps towards it). How can you have an economic system if no jobs are required?

Keep in 200-300 years ago, we didn't even have electricity or working, flushing toilets and the idea of an airplane would be pure science fiction, a device like an iPhone would be completely unfathomable. You'd be likely be strung up and burned alive for having one because they'd think you're (literally) a sorcerer. 



Soundwave said:

While I would agree today it can't work, in 200-300 years, who knows. 

How do you monetize something if everything can be replicated for example? Such a technology would destroy a supply/demand based economic system and that's a technology that theoretically we'll likely eventually get to (3D printers are the first tiny baby steps towards it). How can you have an economic system if no jobs are required?

Keep in 200-300 years ago, we didn't even have electricity or working, flushing toilets and the idea of an airplane would be pure science fiction, a device like an iPhone would be completely unfathomable. You'd be likely be strung up and burned alive for having one because they'd think you're (literally) a sorcerer. 

That still doesn't even come close to making communism feasible, especially the classless, stateless pipe dream version of it. Humans will forever divide along lines of culture and identity. We will never solve every problem, so there will always be competing ideologies proposing solutions to those problems. In today's world there are fat, spoiled people who have never known real material want in their entire lives yet who blame everything on capitalism because that's the system they live under and the only thing they know. And because people are never satisfied they'd be doing exactly the same thing in this hypothetical post-scarcity communist utopia. So what to do when people blame communism for their ennui, and a fascist/nationalist/capitalist/whatever comes along to promise to fill that void with a purpose? Should we shut down these dangerous ideas by force? Who has the proper authority to do that in a stateless world? Ultimately you'd just wind up with this mob vs. that mob, and the stronger mob would win and then establish a government to make sure this horrible thing never happened again.



Soundwave said:
Walbert said:
Both are just as bad

Fascism gave us the 3rd Reich, Hitler, Mussolini and one of the worst atrocity's in human history while Communism gave us Stalin, another mass slaughter, partly caused the cold war and Chernobyl.

It's kinda like being a crack cocaine addict (fascism) versus an alcoholic (communist). 

Neither is good, but Crack cocaine will likely kill you faster.

Look at all fascist societies, most do not last past 10 years even. If you want to drive your society straight into the toilet as quickly as possibly, fascism takes the cake. It basically is an idelogy based around hyper stupidity and paranoia taking over reason/rationality/compassion. It doesn't take long for it to fall apart on itself. 

You're just thinking about Hitler and Stalin.

Fascism is not an idioligy, it's a doctrine of mind control. It's certainly not just about people being stupid and sucking it up. It's extremely simple and yet results a complex web of superstition.

It's easy for you to call it stupid when it has been exposed as in the obvious historical versions of it you are thinking of.

Are you able to call out the fascism you ascribe to right now? I very much doubt it and myself included, that's not to attack you personally though you do portray a certain whiff of certainty of one's understanding from a very establishment centric narrative that is the most prevailing.

You are over simplifying by stating it is just paranoia taking over one's rational senses in my opinion and I say this because, If that's the case how do you explain the hate for views of people who are as some would call them "right wing". I don't see affording these people with the blessing of just being innocent people who are stupid?

The "stupid" should be educated and not attacked.

Curious on your thoughts if the past interpretations are true and appropriate today.



Fascism is capitalism on steroids. Communism is socialism on steroids. Communist dictators Mao and Stalin were responsible for the death of 30+ million people. Hitler was solely responsible for triggering World War 2 and the deaths of 60 million people including the genocide of 6 million Jews in the Holocaust. The American people are now electing the most right wing candidates for their President. Sooner or later a psychopathic leader could emerge and wreck havoc upon the USA and the world.