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Forums - Microsoft - Digital Foundry: Scorpio Spec leak - "might suggest console isn't the "true" 4k console as MS claimed"

COKTOE on 24 January 2017
Snoopy said:



This is apparently the Ori and blind forest developer (difficult, but fun game). If true, this will confirm my speculations about no more generations. Also he said xbox scorpio is a next gen system and ps4 pro was half assed.

Wow. It's crazy if you think about it....For 2 systems to release, day and date, at the exact minute in fact, and for one of them to be so far behind the other spec-wise. It's crazy....Cough. Of course this guy's twitter profile says Xbox Gamer, and not videogamer. Because of course it does. The shit I took this morning smelled like last night's dinner mixed with shit.



- "If you have the heart of a true winner, you can always get more pissed off than some other asshole."

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TheBlackNaruto on 24 January 2017

I will have to watch this



The absence of evidence is NOT the evidence of absence...

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starcraft on 24 January 2017

Shika put together a great TL:DR in the Xbox thread here.

He also noted that the maker of Ori and the Blind Forest recently said that "Scorpio is a next-gen machine with the added benefit that all of your old games will still be compatible."

Those who have read the entire article will see that its actually just an acknowledgement that while 4k native gaming on the Scorpio is very achievable, some developers might choose to use different techniques to focus on enhanced visual features other than resolution, and that Microsoft will not restrict them from doing that.

In other words, the article just says that MS will give developers the choice as to how they wish to use the system.

Additionally, there is some evidence that this is now quite out-dated information, and speculation (thats all it is) that the Scorpio will have a better CPU than imagined when this white paper was released, and MS will permit exclusives.



starcraft - Playing Games = FUN, Talking about Games = SERIOUS

Jizz_Beard_thePirate on 24 January 2017

Alright, I have a theory

So the ps4 pro has more or less 3 modes with the devs that care enough

1080p high detail
1080p performance
1440p-1800p checkerboard with ps4 graphics settings

So maybe what Scorpio might have for the devs that care enough is

1440p high detail with checkerboard
1440p performance with checkerboard
4k Native with ps4 graphics settings

Note: high detail doesn't mean pc max, it just means higher than ps4

The reason is if we look at benchmarks for a 480 (Scorpio's GPU might be more powerful with higher vram, CUs and Memory Bandwidth)



It is capable of 1440p in optimized games and then we look at 4k benchmark



Well... 23fps at PC max isn't bad considering the card and what it's trying to do but lowering the settings enough to what ps4 has might be enough to make it run at 4k. But of course, it will be heavily game dependent.



                  

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HollyGamer on 24 January 2017

Dont worry even if Scorpio will not run on most of the games on native 4k. It will run scale bound and it will have exclusive that will not available on PC. At least they will have TV.



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HollyGamer on 24 January 2017
Snoopy said:



This is apparently the Ori and blind forest developer (difficult, but fun game). If true, this will confirm my speculations about no more generations. Also he said xbox scorpio is a next gen system and ps4 pro was half assed.

If it's still holded by an Xbox One, it's  a millions times imposible to be called next gen.  Both system (Pro/Scorpio) are just cross gen and i would love to call ,  a small enhancement. 



Pemalite on 24 January 2017
Ruler said:
So having no ESRAM means probably:
- It will be harder for developers to program for both Scorpio and the original Xbox One unlike with PS4 hardware
- The games on scorpio wont nativity run better unless they are patched

It's all abstracted anyway.

EricHiggin said:

If Scorpio is just a Pro with a slightly better GPU then its not going to sell very well.

If this has been XB's plan the whole time, then they should have just launched Scorpio at the same time as Pro and used the RX480 GPU at 5.5Tflops. Put it in an X1S sized box with external power brick, or X1 sized box with internal power supply. That would have gotten better sales as it would have gone head to head with Pro and would have had a clear hardware advantage. Launching a year later than Pro for 0.5 more Tflops (6) is just a really dumb idea.

This makes me think whether or not the GPU is Polaris with more CU's or a gimped version of Vega, odds are Scorpio is using a Ryzen CPU in some shape or form. This is probably the main reason for XB to wait an entire year to compete with Pro.

It could also be neither Polaris or Vega, but a semi-custom design like what Sony opted for.
We know it has adopted a couple of technologies that debuted in Tonga and thus is in Vega and Polaris.

Had my doubts about Zen since Scorpio was announced.

With that said, if it's using a semi-custom Vega, then it should be able to do more work than the raw flop numbers imply.

Captain_Yuri said:

The reason is if we look at benchmarks for a 480 (Scorpio's GPU might be more powerful with higher vram, CUs and Memory Bandwidth

We *really* need Vega to drop with some decent benchmarks and architectural analysis.

shikamaru317 said:

-Still no mention of what kind of CPU Scorpio is using, though Microsoft recommends using framerate upscaling if the CPU is creating a bottleneck (framerate upscaling means that GPU bound elements run at 60 fps and CPU bound elements run at 30 fps interpolated to 60 fps), which suggets that Scorpio isn't using the latest AMD Zen CPU cores, in spite of AMD hinting that Scorpio does use Zen at CES.

What about the Vega connection though? Zen will also have APU's which will be Vega powered, so the hint may have been towards Vega and not Zen at CES.




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LurkerJ on 25 January 2017
LudicrousSpeed said:

 

But remember boys and girls, the Scorpio doesn't exist :)

The scorpio that is capable of "high fidelity VR" doesn't exist anymore :)



LudicrousSpeed on 25 January 2017

Good, maybe they realized VR is a waste of time and money right now.



exclusive_console on 25 January 2017
Captain_Yuri said:

Alright, I have a theory

So the ps4 pro has more or less 3 modes with the devs that care enough

1080p high detail
1080p performance
1440p-1800p checkerboard with ps4 graphics settings

So maybe what Scorpio might have for the devs that care enough is

1440p high detail with checkerboard
1440p performance with checkerboard
4k Native with ps4 graphics settings

Note: high detail doesn't mean pc max, it just means higher than ps4

The reason is if we look at benchmarks for a 480 (Scorpio's GPU might be more powerful with higher vram, CUs and Memory Bandwidth)



It is capable of 1440p in optimized games and then we look at 4k benchmark



Well... 23fps at PC max isn't bad considering the card and what it's trying to do but lowering the settings enough to what ps4 has might be enough to make it run at 4k. But of course, it will be heavily game dependent.

From where are you getting these modes from ?

As far as I know very few games have such modes in PS4P. Hopefully exclusives will get this treatment. Very few devs will put in time for such modes. Biggest problem with PS4P is that it is not getting 1080P high gfx asset  game. Same will be the problem with Scorpio. It specs will not be utilized properly. The way I look at it is say PS4P running a game at 1440P Scorpio with same performance can run it at 1800P