Forums - Politics Discussion - Trump winning is to be blamed only on the left

ratuscafoarterea said:
WolfpackN64 said:

As any real leftist knows, the economy is the foundation of society, and if you're right on economic issues, you're right-wing. Doesn't matter how far your social policies go.

You didn't read, but that's fine.

I read. But what I stated stands. It doesn't matter how she presents herself, it's what her actual economic policy will be.



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Agreed 100%.  Even though I disagree with alot of his views and positions, Bernie would've had a much better shot in the general election than Trump, since the Wikileaks email stuff and Comey's FBI letter would've been non-factors at that point.  Trump's election victory was just as much a revolt against Hillary and the establishment Democrats as it was in support of his campaign.

I think the DNC is in alot of trouble, and it's only going to get worse for them going forward.  Check out this speech by Sally Brown one of the candidates running to head the DNC at a recent political forum about the future of the Democrat party...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LDOdcsh435Q

This is what identiy politics on steroids looks like.  So much cringe in that video it's unbelievable. It really does look like the left is going to double or even triple down on their extreme social justice platform that helped drive more moderate Dems and independents away and cost them the presidential election.



On 2/24/13, MB1025 said:
You know I was always wondering why no one ever used the dollar sign for $ony, but then I realized they have no money so it would be pointless.

Soundwave said:

Clinton won the overall vote by a huge margin. More people in the United States wanted her as president than Trump.

It was basically just a swing of 80,000 votes (a tiny amount) in three swing states that gave the electoral college to Trump.

If you want to blame "liberals" for that instead of people who either voted Trump or chose to stay home, go ahead, lol.

No one wins every election either. It's not like there was never ever going to be another Republican president, just as there will be another Democratic president at some point. 

Some people are stupid and basically just vote on a "I'm tired of this party, so this time I'll vote for the other party" logic and flip flop on that every 4-8 years. Basically they don't really vote on any general issue, they just change parties like they change socks. 

The left, the regressives, and liberals are to blame because many felt that this election should have been an easy win for Clinton, despite her past and being corrupt to the core. It shouldn't have even been close. In fact, Hillary and the DNC actually wanted Trump to get the Republican nomination. That's how confident they were. This is also led to a lot of arrogance from the left and the Democrats.

Arrogance from Hillary, the Democrats, and the left is the reason Trump won. In any normal election, the candidate running tries to appeal to as many voters as possible. So how did Hillary Clinton try to appeal to the blue collar Democrats who voted for her husband in 1992 and Obama in 2008? She insulted them by calling them deplorables. Then the Democrats backed her 100%. Then the regressives referred to those same people as racists, bigots, mysogonists, called them stupid, and kept telling them to check their white privilidge. That's another thing. When a candidate is backed by a large number of people who talk about white people the same way a memeber of the KKK might talk about a black person, that is also a turnoff. But according to Hillary, the Democrats, and the regressive left, these people didn't matter because Trump had no chance of winning. They had the polls to back them up. Yes, the polls, those things that are only reliable if the person who you're polling is telling the truth. Oh and let's not forget about Bernie Sanders and that whole thing. 

Since most Americans haven't woken up yet, the voters who I refer to as the alienated majority weren't going to vote for a third party candidate, so they opted for Trump. Some voters liked certain things he said while others voted for him out of spite. So yes, the left messed up big time.

 



Check out my art blog: http://jon-erich-art.blogspot.com

I absolutely agree that this is one of the reasons Trump won, and quite a significant one.

But there are other reasons as well of course. For example, the fact that with Hillary Clinton, the democrats tried to force an extremely unpopular candidate down the voter's throat.
We even know from the DNC leaks etc. that the team behind Clinton was so well aware how unpopular Clinton is that they were actually supporting seemingly bad/unfit/crazy candidates like Trump to become Hillarys official opponent, because they believed such an opponent would be an easy victim and thus increase Clinton's rather bad chances of winning.
Trump would have lost against a popular candidate like Sanders, but the democrats didn't want Sanders and even secretly sabotaged him.



Final-Fan said:
LivingMetal said:

You're right.  The first point was not logic.  I wasn't even fact.  A more accurate statement would have been.  "Clinton won the overall vote by a huge margin. More people who voted in the United States wanted her as president than Trump."  But I digress because Iwas referring to YOUR conflict of logic in which the two statement conflicted each other.

What is your evidence, or at the very least your reason for suspecting.....

UmmMMMmm... the final election results....?



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Mar1217 said:
WolfpackN64 said:
Hillary Clinton is a centre-right figure, not left.

I'm glad someone else did their class in politics :D

The definitions of left and ring wing change over time, because politics change over time. The current left represents progressives and social democrats while the old left has been pushed to the fringe.



Jon-Erich said:

The left, the regressives, and liberals are to blame because many felt that this election should have been an easy win for Clinton, despite her past and being corrupt to the core. It shouldn't have even been close. In fact, Hillary and the DNC actually wanted Trump to get the Republican nomination. That's how confident they were. This is also led to a lot of arrogance from the left and the Democrats.

Arrogance from Hillary, the Democrats, and the left is the reason Trump won. In any normal election, the candidate running tries to appeal to as many voters as possible. So how did Hillary Clinton try to appeal to the blue collar Democrats who voted for her husband in 1992 and Obama in 2008? She insulted them by calling them deplorables. Then the Democrats backed her 100%. Then the regressives referred to those same people as racists, bigots, mysogonists, called them stupid, and kept telling them to check their white privilidge. That's another thing. When a candidate is backed by a large number of people who talk about white people the same way a memeber of the KKK might talk about a black person, that is also a turnoff. But according to Hillary, the Democrats, and the regressive left, these people didn't matter because Trump had no chance of winning. They had the polls to back them up. Yes, the polls, those things that are only reliable if the person who you're polling is telling the truth. Oh and let's not forget about Bernie Sanders and that whole thing. 

Since most Americans haven't woken up yet, the voters who I refer to as the alienated majority weren't going to vote for a third party candidate, so they opted for Trump. Some voters liked certain things he said while others voted for him out of spite. So yes, the left messed up big time.

 

Actually, I believe the polls were showing Clinton being more popular in most of the cohorts, like women and minority men, and then treated the cohorts as collective.

Leadified said:
Mar1217 said:

I'm glad someone else did their class in politics :D

The definitions of left and ring wing change over time, because politics change over time. The current left represents progressives and social democrats while the old left has been pushed to the fringe.

Political field can change, yes, but someone being on the right or on the left isn't really a matter of opinion, or change when the political field changes (unless the politican changes with it), because there are definitions on what is left and what is right. I think you're confusing it with how you see everything that's perceived good being called "left" and everything that's perceived bad being called "right" these days.



Ei Kiinasti.

Eikä Japanisti.

Vaan pannaan jalalla koreasti.

 

Nintendo games sell only on Nintendo system.

LivingMetal said:
Final-Fan said:

What is your evidence, or at the very least your reason for suspecting.....

UmmMMMmm... the final election results....?

Okay, at least one of us is misunderstanding the other one.  Let's get back to basics.  Soundwave said two things you bolded: 
"Clinton won the overall vote by a huge margin. More people in the United States wanted her as president than Trump."
and
"Some people are stupid and basically just vote on a "I'm tired of this party, so this time I'll vote for the other party" logic and flip flop on that every 4-8 years. Basically they don't really vote on any general issue, they just change parties like they change socks.";
and you said,
"Conflict of logic.
What is the conflict of logic that you believe exists between these two claims?  Why are these claims LOGICALLY in conflict with ONE ANOTHER?

P.S.  And regarding what you specifically said in the post quoted above, the final election results show that more voters preferred Clinton over Trump, even though the Electoral College gave the election to Trump.  You agreed that more voters supported Clinton, but disagreed with the claim that more Americans supported Clinton.  Therefore the final election results do not in any way give evidence for the claim "it's not true that more Americans supported Clinton compared to Trump".  That is why I asked you for what you based your position on.  So, again, what is your reason? 



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bdbdbd said:
Leadified said:

The definitions of left and ring wing change over time, because politics change over time. The current left represents progressives and social democrats while the old left has been pushed to the fringe.

Political field can change, yes, but someone being on the right or on the left isn't really a matter of opinion, or change when the political field changes (unless the politican changes with it), because there are definitions on what is left and what is right. I think you're confusing it with how you see everything that's perceived good being called "left" and everything that's perceived bad being called "right" these days.

This isn't a matter of opinion, progressives and social democrats have beliefs that fall in-line with the broad New Left movement, one that Clinton attempted to win over. I'm not sure what you are suggesting here because I consider myself right-wing.



Why do we derisively refer to civil rights as identity politics these days? No one calls evangelicals fighting for the overturning of Roe v Wade identity politics.