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Forums - General Discussion - It's extremely frustrating being a technology lover in Brazil.

The problem with Brazil is bad salaries and high taxes due to incompetent and corrupt politicians. PS4 would not be so expensive if these things were fixed, but it is a veeery delicate and endemic problem.

$399 is equivalent to 1300 BRL, and they sell for 1750 BRL here, a little more expensive, but ok. Canada has the same treatment, no?

The average payments here are 1000 BRL ($300). Meanwhile in Canada is... what? $1000 per month?

So we need two months to pay for a PS4 while Canada needs only one, and yet they (rightfully) complain about the price increase. You can imagine how much we complain around here...

USA is one of the only places where gadgets have a good price. That's why when I see americans saying PS Vita or wtv is expensive I don't understand. We want these kind of "problems". hahaha



3DS, Wii, PSP, Vita, PS2, PS3, PS4 & Steam.

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Phronesis said:
The problem with Brazil is bad salaries and high taxes due to incompetent and corrupt politicians. PS4 would not be so expensive if these things were fixed, but it is a veeery delicate and endemic problem.

$399 is equivalent to 1300 BRL, and they sell for 1750 BRL here, a little more expensive, but ok. Canada has the same treatment, no?

The average payments here are 1000 BRL ($300). Meanwhile in Canada is... what? $1000 per month?

So we need two months to pay for a PS4 while Canada needs only one, and yet they (rightfully) complain about the price increase. You can imagine how much we complain around here...

USA is one of the only places where gadgets have a good price. That's why when I see americans saying PS Vita or wtv is expensive I don't understand. We want these kind of "problems". hahaha

Canada has only 4x the average wage of Brazil.



SvennoJ said:
Swordmasterman said:

Isn't there any imigration laws on Canada ?

You can drift in on a boat like American refugees :)
http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/windsor/floatdown-sarnia-americans-wash-ashore-1.3730792

There are plenty hoops to go through, I've done it myself in 2002. The whole process took about 15 months back then. (It didn't help I lived in The Netherlands, the closest immigration embassy was in Berlin and my physical checkup results needed to go through Switzerland)

The English word stress is too difficulty. I would rather go to France, where is easier to pronounce things. In my language we only stress one of the last 3 syllable of the word and only 1 per word



Swordmasterman said:
SvennoJ said:

You can drift in on a boat like American refugees :)
http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/windsor/floatdown-sarnia-americans-wash-ashore-1.3730792

There are plenty hoops to go through, I've done it myself in 2002. The whole process took about 15 months back then. (It didn't help I lived in The Netherlands, the closest immigration embassy was in Berlin and my physical checkup results needed to go through Switzerland)

The English word stress is too difficulty. I would rather go to France, where is easier to pronounce things. In my language we only stress one of the last 3 syllable of the word and only 1 per word

You can always apply for Quebec. French is a national language although outside Quebec you pretty much need English to get around. France is beautiful though, plus you can easily travel to tons of diffirent cultures from there.



Funny that as shitty as Brazil is, it has a decent health care system if you can afford private health insurance. For me it is more than affordable since get paid in US dollars which is worth more than 3x as much. I live in the US and I have health insurance in Brazil. I pay about 70 dollars a month and I going to Brazil in a month or 2, to have a knee surgery. It will be the second time I do that. Only this time I'll have surgery on my right knee. D.



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BHeletrica said:

The blame is ours?

The brazilian government tax rape all medium companys, thats why theres no fair market for tec products, everything has to be imported at 40% only to cover taxes, if you add the profit margin the final cost gets astronomical. Brazilian society is at a loop: corrupt politics incourages people ignorrance that elects corrupt politics. Recent events(impeachment and all) shows that the people is getting less ignorant but there is too much room to improve.  If someday we achieve a economy whith less taxes (for this to happen we have to erradicate grand scale corruption) tec products would be far more accessible for everybody.

About Elon Musk, i have to brake it tou you but hes a big time con man, just like the infamous Eike batista. Both have/had dark business whith the government and theirs companys are built on hype. If you take Tesla, theres no car being built/sold so no profit being made, and the stock price is higher than companys like hyundai, ford etc. How come a company that has just promisses AND DONT MAKE ANY PROFIT can be more stock valuable than companys that are profitable for years? The answer is that elon musk companys are built to con the market to the sole purpose of make profit whith stock prices. A lot of people that real understand economy say this things im saying, if you wanna see for yourself just make a internet research.

Brazil is a very dificult place to live, in this country our work is worth far less than in developed countries. After i finish colege ill defenitely try to move! 

Profit margin in Brazil aren't as big as you think, and if you study business you'll see that anything below 20% to 30% in Brazil is low because for this year for example the interest rate is 14,5% per year. So if you plan on have a company that profit less than 20% of your invested capital you are better off loaning the money and collecting the interest rate. So don't hate on the companies. And government rape all the population with taxes, not only mid-size companies. And about reducing the taxes it won't happen with less corruption, it will happen when people accept that they need to provide for themselves instead of the government so the government loses power and size.

You were already explained why the market price rise even without profit, that is a new mentality based on constructing value instead of profits, you may not agree or understand, but some investors especulate on that. It's their money so if they want to burn it I don't care, but I agree it's strange how much they value some companies that have very little asset or profit to secure that.

Our work isn't worth less, we actually produce less.

invetedlotus123 said:
DonFerrari said:
Datacap is norm outside Brazil, and you can try to use other companies, besides 200Gb is nothing shy...

But the guilty is on ANATEL limiting the market soo much

It really depends on the person use. I myself is a pretty heavy user. I download steam games and do loads of streaming. Once I get a 4k TV 200 gb will be nothing to stream 4k content. 

If you want to use more you have to pay more it's quite simple.

Do you think two people, one using 10 Gb and one using 1 Tb should pay the same for the service or they should have the option to pay how much they evaluate worth?

invetedlotus123 said:
Swordmasterman said:
A lot of countries have their high tax, and even some states of the USA. The US$ being up YOY isn't just for 1 country, it is a worldwide problem. And what is expected for a technology lover is to be among the early adopters, they are supposed to have money.

For a country like Brazil with 200+ Millions of people, very poor regions and very rich ones, having a PIB Per Capita of over 29.000R$ (over 14.500US$ at last year's exchange rate) per citzen isn't a low number.

It becomes low because here there's a huge unequally division of riches. There are a part of the population that is obscenely rich and a huge amount that is extremely poor and the middle class. They say here that 1% of the population controls around 30% of all the money. 

There is unequality, but on the 1% rich it isn't that much different from other countries as you may believe... it's more like a thing the progressist try to sell.

They care more that a portion of the population earns 1M each versus another portion earning 10k than if both earned 5k. They only care about the gap, not about the quality.

It's good to have very rich people employing and moving the economy, don't be jealous on them.

Swordmasterman said:
Slimebeast said:
Wasn't Brazil's economy booming in the years before 2008 (or whenever it was the global financial crysis hit your country)? Or am I rong?

I fink you hade a nice 5% GDP yearly growf and wages went up. But the crysis has gone on for much longer in Brazil than it did in the West.

 Is GDP the money that each citizen gets / by the number of citizens of the country ?

Brazil wasn't affected by the global financial crysis, but now it is being affected. From 2009 to 2014 the only time Brazil was down on GDP was  by 0.1-1% in 2009, but was up by 3-7% every year from 2010 to 2014. Those are the actual numbers for the country.

Here on Brazil the people are really one sided and majority  isn't aware of the true situation of the country, even a lot of newspapers are misleading. The problem is that half of the country is one sided for one thing while the other is for the other thing. The Last elections were 54 Millions of votes against 52-53 Millions of votes (in the last part, which only had 2 candidates). The 2 had very different opnions.

One wanted to sell everything, even a lot of healthy public companies, and take responsibility away from the state. Like Culture, Healthy and Education, make everything private to lower the costs of the government. Indeed, they sold a very  good public mineration company, Vale do Rio Doce, for a low price when they had a  President in the 90s. And is because of that President that now, on Brazil, a President can be eligible for 2 elections in a row. In each one they can stay for 4 years if they win.

 

The other one want to make everything without  making nothing private, cancelling social programs or cancelling the payment of retiree and pensioners. The Government can't afford all of that. She was the one who was elected as President in  2014

 

You need to see official documents because it is very hard even for the press because of how one sided things are. One focus on healthy programs, like taking doctors from other countries to Brazil, and Social programs, like paying some money for people and making houses. While the other program take away the higher tax for transactions, the ones that rich people usually pay. And, more recently, after they changed the President. They took away some benefits of the workers and raised the number of hours worked per week by more than 50%.

To make it short. The "battle" here is between a popular program that need to be tied with unpopular candidates in order to be elected and thus have a half-sided government. Against a un-popular government that focus on making everything private, despite how well the company or thing is, and will focus on banks and this kind of thing. The only difference is that one candidate, the one who was the president, is tied because of campaign deals that she made in order to be elected, while the other  have the "unpopular thing" from the start, as an intention.

One more thing, the "unpopular" one is the leader of the Senate and every other thing of the genre.

Brazil when on growth from 2000-2008 was growing average 3% versus world average 5% and BRICs 7% so we were growing slow.

I would say more than 90% of the population have very little knowledge of what is really happening. And Just to remember considering people that didn't vote, and non valid votes the elected president got like less than 40% of the votes.

On the selling of everything public, not only it reduces the cost of the government (because guess what, those companies aren't really profitable in the government hands, if they where then selling them would increase the government cost) but it also improves the companie itself. When we had public telephonic company a landline costed as much as a car and had big waiting to buy and install, after privatization it got dirty cheap (in comparison) to have your landline and cellphone (which is still one of the costier on earth because the government rigs the competition so there isn't new entries to compete and reduce the price). So selling the other government assets and using the money wisely would be good for the country.

The other wants the government paying for everything but seems to forget that the ones that pay the governement are ourselves, and in this case we are mandated to pay even if we don't use.

And you are very wrong on the increase of 50% on the weekly working ours... what happened is that the daily limit raised from 10 to 12 hours, but the weekly limit would still be 44h with 4 extra hours allowed. We have seem time and time again how bad government uses our money and how they return it and how innefective it's to tax riches, or actualy how much bad taxing does in the end.

Dilma's period was the richiest period for banks, so the idea that Temer was included to attend bank interest is very silly. And actually most of Dilma's action after elected was what she said the rival would do.

invetedlotus123 said:
Swordmasterman said:

You know that this is the most ridiculous thing to compare the living cost of a country by taking the $ needed to live in the most expensive region of the old Imperial city. The place that only lose in price per square meter to the country's biggest city, which generates, in the state, 32% of the country's money against 12-14% that the second biggest state.

It is like using the price to live in the Montaigne in France as  the standart price.

If you want to have a castle in France and don't mind living  under a rock in the middle of nowhere, of course that it will be cheaper than purchasing a smaller house in one of the most rich  residential regions of the country. But if you want to live in  one of France's better locations, Just the rent price will be bigger than purchasing  a house of the same size on Brazil.

Yeah, but Rio is nothing but hype. That city is just a very big mess with islands of extreme wealthy. And the cariocas are the most deluded people I ever met, the city is fallen apart and they are " But this is Rio, it`s ok, let`s enjoy what`s good". And the problems is the entire city got expensive based on the hype of World Cup and Olympics, my friends that lives there says the price of everything skyrocketed for World Cup but never came down again. Quality of life there is nothing to brag about either. I wouldn't choose Rio over Brasilia anyday, Brasilia is one of the most ambitious engineer projects of the 20st century and don`t get the recognizement it deserves, it`s a shame everything that happens in Brazil is centered in Rio. I would love the Olympics to have happened in Brasilia or even Sao Paulo, it would help break the stereotype of Brazil party country.

The prices skyrocked in the whole country, don't think only Rio have it.

Everything is centered in Rio because it's the touristic center on the country with enough structure for it (and even so, very poor), Brasilia doesn't have structure and isn't touristic, northeast doesn't have structure and São Paulo isn't touristic.

jonathanalis said:
Yeah, i know.
Cars are a good example.
Cars that are mounted here are much more expensive than the same cars exported for Chile.
Doesnt make any sense.

Im considering moving to Canada...

Cars are very expensive to buy for two reasons, first is that buyers buy them even at those high prices, the second is that the government heavy taxes imported so the "cartel" in Brazil can keep high prices with no concern (besides being heavily taxed as well).

Valdney said:
Funny that as shitty as Brazil is, it has a decent health care system if you can afford private health insurance. For me it is more than affordable since get paid in US dollars which is worth more than 3x as much. I live in the US and I have health insurance in Brazil. I pay about 70 dollars a month and I going to Brazil in a month or 2, to have a knee surgery. It will be the second time I do that. Only this time I'll have surgery on my right knee. D.

USA health care system is pretty inflated.



duduspace11 "Well, since we are estimating costs, Pokemon Red/Blue did cost Nintendo about $50m to make back in 1996"

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=8808363

Mr Puggsly: "Hehe, I said good profit. You said big profit. Frankly, not losing money is what I meant by good. Don't get hung up on semantics"

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=9008994

Azzanation: "PS5 wouldn't sold out at launch without scalpers."

DonFerrari said:

invetedlotus123 said:

It really depends on the person use. I myself is a pretty heavy user. I download steam games and do loads of streaming. Once I get a 4k TV 200 gb will be nothing to stream 4k content. 

If you want to use more you have to pay more it's quite simple.

Do you think two people, one using 10 Gb and one using 1 Tb should pay the same for the service or they should have the option to pay how much they evaluate worth?

invetedlotus123 said:

It becomes low because here there's a huge unequally division of riches. There are a part of the population that is obscenely rich and a huge amount that is extremely poor and the middle class. They say here that 1% of the population controls around 30% of all the money. 

There is unequality, but on the 1% rich it isn't that much different from other countries as you may believe... it's more like a thing the progressist try to sell.

They care more that a portion of the population earns 1M each versus another portion earning 10k than if both earned 5k. They only care about the gap, not about the quality.

It's good to have very rich people employing and moving the economy, don't be jealous on them.


invetedlotus123 said:

Yeah, but Rio is nothing but hype. That city is just a very big mess with islands of extreme wealthy. And the cariocas are the most deluded people I ever met, the city is fallen apart and they are " But this is Rio, it`s ok, let`s enjoy what`s good". And the problems is the entire city got expensive based on the hype of World Cup and Olympics, my friends that lives there says the price of everything skyrocketed for World Cup but never came down again. Quality of life there is nothing to brag about either. I wouldn't choose Rio over Brasilia anyday, Brasilia is one of the most ambitious engineer projects of the 20st century and don`t get the recognizement it deserves, it`s a shame everything that happens in Brazil is centered in Rio. I would love the Olympics to have happened in Brasilia or even Sao Paulo, it would help break the stereotype of Brazil party country.

The prices skyrocked in the whole country, don't think only Rio have it.

Everything is centered in Rio because it's the touristic center on the country with enough structure for it (and even so, very poor), Brasilia doesn't have structure and isn't touristic, northeast doesn't have structure and São Paulo isn't touristic.

Cars are very expensive to buy for two reasons, first is that buyers buy them even at those high prices, the second is that the government heavy taxes imported so the "cartel" in Brazil can keep high prices with no concern (besides being heavily taxed as well).


First and foremost, Data Caps are ridiculous because they don`t have no reason to be, mainly in Wired internet. the costs of a person that uses 10 gb or 1tb is pretty much the same for the telecoms, since the maintance costs are pretty much the same for both, what is expensive is to build the infrastructure to serve the clients, after that the costs are the same.

Second, Brazillian super riches are all self made and make a lot of money because they have business that employee many people, but no. Brazillian super riches are most of them somehow milking the government in some way, be it with the 500 billion BRL the federal governemnt pays every year in interest alone or those shady contracts to sell, build or provide services for the government. They are actually spoilling the population with a bizarre tax system that takes money from the poor and middle class and gives it to the super riches. And even, farmers mostly use high tech machinary to produce and those who don`t use modern slave labor in their farms.  Even Eike Batista that was the richest man of Brazil didn`t do nothing but rely on his connections in the government to grab public money and make financial scams with companies that never produced nothing but stock value frenzy.

About Rio, yeah, but Rio is a bad stereotype of Brazil in my opinion. It sells to the world the image of Brazil Party People and that here is a place tourists can make whatever they want like having sex with loads of men and women, even underage, use any kind of drugs they want for a much lower price than at their home countries and than go home like nothing happened. Sao Paulo and Brasilia sells a image of a much more serious country that have high ambitions for the future. And Brasilia is the freaking capital, it`s time to move from the Rio being the center of everything, they aren't capital anymore, and from a cultural point of view it has a lot to offer for tourists, the city is eye candy everyhwere and it`s touristic attractions are great, Itamaraty is a piece of modern art as a building.



I heard Russia is a great place... Just don't play Pokemon Go in churches.



                
       ---Member of the official Squeezol Fanclub---

invetedlotus123 said:
DonFerrari said:

If you want to use more you have to pay more it's quite simple.

Do you think two people, one using 10 Gb and one using 1 Tb should pay the same for the service or they should have the option to pay how much they evaluate worth?

There is unequality, but on the 1% rich it isn't that much different from other countries as you may believe... it's more like a thing the progressist try to sell.

They care more that a portion of the population earns 1M each versus another portion earning 10k than if both earned 5k. They only care about the gap, not about the quality.

It's good to have very rich people employing and moving the economy, don't be jealous on them.


The prices skyrocked in the whole country, don't think only Rio have it.

Everything is centered in Rio because it's the touristic center on the country with enough structure for it (and even so, very poor), Brasilia doesn't have structure and isn't touristic, northeast doesn't have structure and São Paulo isn't touristic.

Cars are very expensive to buy for two reasons, first is that buyers buy them even at those high prices, the second is that the government heavy taxes imported so the "cartel" in Brazil can keep high prices with no concern (besides being heavily taxed as well).


First and foremost, Data Caps are ridiculous because they don`t have no reason to be, mainly in Wired internet. the costs of a person that uses 10 gb or 1tb is pretty much the same for the telecoms, since the maintance costs are pretty much the same for both, what is expensive is to build the infrastructure to serve the clients, after that the costs are the same.

Second, Brazillian super riches are all self made and make a lot of money because they have business that employee many people, but no. Brazillian super riches are most of them somehow milking the government in some way, be it with the 500 billion BRL the federal governemnt pays every year in interest alone or those shady contracts to sell, build or provide services for the government. They are actually spoilling the population with a bizarre tax system that takes money from the poor and middle class and gives it to the super riches. And even, farmers mostly use high tech machinary to produce and those who don`t use modern slave labor in their farms.  Even Eike Batista that was the richest man of Brazil didn`t do nothing but rely on his connections in the government to grab public money and make financial scams with companies that never produced nothing but stock value frenzy.

About Rio, yeah, but Rio is a bad stereotype of Brazil in my opinion. It sells to the world the image of Brazil Party People and that here is a place tourists can make whatever they want like having sex with loads of men and women, even underage, use any kind of drugs they want for a much lower price than at their home countries and than go home like nothing happened. Sao Paulo and Brasilia sells a image of a much more serious country that have high ambitions for the future. And Brasilia is the freaking capital, it`s time to move from the Rio being the center of everything, they aren't capital anymore, and from a cultural point of view it has a lot to offer for tourists, the city is eye candy everyhwere and it`s touristic attractions are great, Itamaraty is a piece of modern art as a building.

A car of 7k or of 1M gets you from place A to B... several cars have similar price to build but have very big MSRP. So no, it isn't ridiculous, don't confound Cost with Value. You value speed and big data cap, so a company that provide you this service should be allowed to charge you for this. If you think the amount of data isn't worth them you don't sign.

There are a lot of self made entrepeneur in Brazil. In fact a lot of the bilionaires not only in Brazil but in the rest of the world aren't from inheritance, so stop thinking that all money is only won through shady business and inheritance.

When presented with the option to stop complaining and opening your business you only complained about how hard it is, but doesn't regard the ones that have balls to do it, you just say they earn their money illicitily. And sure the government is milked with shady contracts and paybacks, but you don't need to do it to suceed, and in fact when you ask for government to intervene on data cap issue that is what you are asking for they to regulate the market and open the doors to corruption.

Brasilia is the freaking capital for bulshit reasons, it doesn't generate almost anything. Housing is a joke with the plano piloto limiting the height you can build and making prices very high for small apartments. The reason Brasilia even have money is because they suck from the rest of the country, flush it to the politicians and friends pockets and that pour into local economy. So instead of bad mouthing Rio because of your prejudice go there see for yourself. No one wants to go to Brasilia for Tourism, even brazilians, so why would you force international to go there only because it's the place you live and think is good?

And about the steriotype of Rio and Brazilians, unfortunately it's mostly deserved. Brazilians like to party all around, are sex oriented and very unpolite. And if the tourists want that they shall go to were it's. Some go to neatherlands, belgium and other countries because of pot being legal, will you complain that they don't go for europe cities that doesn't enable sex and drugs? It's their live, so it doesn't concern you.



duduspace11 "Well, since we are estimating costs, Pokemon Red/Blue did cost Nintendo about $50m to make back in 1996"

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=8808363

Mr Puggsly: "Hehe, I said good profit. You said big profit. Frankly, not losing money is what I meant by good. Don't get hung up on semantics"

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=9008994

Azzanation: "PS5 wouldn't sold out at launch without scalpers."

AZWification said:

I heard Russia is a great place... Just don't play Pokemon Go in churches.

I heard that it is the biggest country in the World. But I'm not sure.