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Forums - Sony - PS4.5/PS4K Is Codenamed 'NEO' And More Info

antigin on 19 April 2016

What do you think about infinite generation theory?

2013-PS4 [obligate support by devs is 6 years, Sony will support online services for 9 years. Indie devs can publish games for 9 years for example] ///plays PS4 games
2016-PS4NEO (I will mark it PS4b) [support politics as PS4's. Obligate support 6 years] ///plays PS4 and PS4b games.
2019-PS4c [support 6-9 ys] ///plays PS4b and PS4c games /PS4 support is now optional
2022-PS4d ///plays PS4c and PS4d games /PS4 support is cancelled, PS4b support is now optional
etc

And then we get:
- lifetime of every console is 6 years
- constantly high install-base (resetless install-base, then no pain for devs, no pain for Sony, no pain for community waiting new games on new gen console etc)
- low specs problem is now solved (enthusiasts now can upgrade consoles every 3 years for 400bucks)

Is it good or bad? Your thoughts?



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potato_hamster on 19 April 2016
AnthonyW86 said:
potato_hamster said:

How does it increase the PS4's install base? It would only increase the install base if the people who are buying it are people that wouldn't have otherwise have bought a PS4. What are the odds there's going to be many of those people? If they weren't interested in a PS4 at $400 four years ago why would they suddenly be interested in a PS4K at $400 now? If the specs are correct, the gap between the average gaming PC and the PS4 in 2013 is smaller than the gap between the average  gaming PC, and the PS4K now. There is no reason to expect this group to me more than a small fraction of PS4 owners, or even PS4K owners.

Anyone who "upgrades" their PS4 or Xbox One was just as likely to buy my game in the first place, so that's not an additional sale.

Aside from that, even if I make a game just for the OG PS4, whoes to say that those new PS4K owners wouldn't buy my game anyways?

So really the only people who make the investment in developing specifically for the PS4K worth it are those that otherwise wouldn't have bought a PS4 if the PS4K didn't exist, and of those the people wouldn't have bought my game unless it was made for the PS4K. You're talking about a fraction of a fraction of PS4 owners.

You are forgetting the people who will upgrade to PS4K, they will sell their current PS4 off to other people. So every single PS4K sold increases the install base(regardless of already owning a PS4 or not), aside from sales of the original PS4 system wich will likely go down to $299.

This is a mid-gen upgrade, so the PS4 will get software support for years. That means that every PS4 out there is part of the active user base, unlike many PS3's collecting dust shortly after PS4 released. PS4 and PS4K add together to create one large install base. And not just for games, also for PS Plus.

Or they keep their existing PS4 and just buy a new PS4K.

It's still irrelevant, you haven't tied how the PS4K increases the PS4 userbase even larger than the PS4 would have without it. You can't just simply look at the PS4K numbers sold and think "well there's your answer" because 90-95% of them might have bought or kept their PS4 otherwise, or the people that bought thier used PS4 planned on buying a PS4 anyways and was just waiting for another price drop.

Most third party developers are going to look at the PS4K, and just as they decided with the  Sega CD, Sega 32x, N64 expansion pak, PSP hardware revisions, and New 3DS, they're going to think "not worth it", and just make PS4 games.

This is a waste of time and money for everyone involved. This is so astroundingly dumb. I really thought Sony wasn't that stupid.



Soundwave on 19 April 2016
potato_hamster said:
AnthonyW86 said:

You are forgetting the people who will upgrade to PS4K, they will sell their current PS4 off to other people. So every single PS4K sold increases the install base(regardless of already owning a PS4 or not), aside from sales of the original PS4 system wich will likely go down to $299.

This is a mid-gen upgrade, so the PS4 will get software support for years. That means that every PS4 out there is part of the active user base, unlike many PS3's collecting dust shortly after PS4 released. PS4 and PS4K add together to create one large install base. And not just for games, also for PS Plus.

Or they keep their existing PS4 and just buy a new PS4K.

It's still irrelevant, you haven't tied how the PS4K increases the PS4 userbase even larger than the PS4 would have without it. You can't just simply look at the PS4K numbers sold and think "well there's your answer" because 90-95% of them might have bought or kept their PS4 otherwise, or the people that bought thier used PS4 planned on buying a PS4 anyways and was just waiting for another price drop.

Most third party developers are going to look at the PS4K, and just as they decided with the  Sega CD, Sega 32x, N64 expansion pak, PSP hardware revisions, and New 3DS, they're going to think "not worth it", and just make PS4 games.

This is a waste of time and money for everyone involved. This is so astroundingly dumb. I really thought Sony wasn't that stupid.

More likely PS4.5 becomes the lead PS model from here on out. Given a choice between a 1.8 TFLOP console at $299 versus a 4+ TFLOP console at $399 ... I think most consumers going forward will choose the 4TFLOP one. 

The N64 RAM pak actually had fairly decent support, 32X and Sega CD sold very poorly. 



potato_hamster on 19 April 2016
antigin said:

What do you think about infinite generation theory?

2013-PS4 [obligate support by devs is 6 years, Sony will support online services for 9 years. Indie devs can publish games for 9 years for example] ///plays PS4 games
2016-PS4NEO (I will mark it PS4b) [support politics as PS4's. Obligate support 6 years] ///plays PS4 and PS4b games.
2019-PS4c [support 6-9 ys] ///plays PS4b and PS4c games /PS4 support is now optional
2022-PS4d ///plays PS4c and PS4d games /PS4 support is cancelled, PS4b support is now optional
etc

And then we get:
- lifetime of every console is 6 years
- constantly high install-base (resetless install-base, then no pain for devs, no pain for Sony, no pain for community waiting new games on new gen console etc)
- low specs problem is now solved (enthusiasts now can upgrade consoles every 3 years for 400bucks)

Is it good or bad? Your thoughts?

This is completely horriffic.

I'm as loyal of a Sony Playstation fan as they get. I own every one of their consoles including an imported PSX from Japan. If Sony tries this shit I will abandon them in a heartbeat, and just go to playing games on PC, since I already deal with this shit on PC anyways.

I love consoles for their simplicity, their ease of use, the idea that I can walk into a store and buy any game I want with "PS3" written on it and know it will work on my console. This concept spits in the face of all of it and makes the idea of consoles completely and utterly pointless.



potato_hamster on 19 April 2016
Soundwave said:
potato_hamster said:

Or they keep their existing PS4 and just buy a new PS4K.

It's still irrelevant, you haven't tied how the PS4K increases the PS4 userbase even larger than the PS4 would have without it. You can't just simply look at the PS4K numbers sold and think "well there's your answer" because 90-95% of them might have bought or kept their PS4 otherwise, or the people that bought thier used PS4 planned on buying a PS4 anyways and was just waiting for another price drop.

Most third party developers are going to look at the PS4K, and just as they decided with the  Sega CD, Sega 32x, N64 expansion pak, PSP hardware revisions, and New 3DS, they're going to think "not worth it", and just make PS4 games.

This is a waste of time and money for everyone involved. This is so astroundingly dumb. I really thought Sony wasn't that stupid.

More likely PS4.5 becomes the lead PS model from here on out. Given a choice between a 1.8 TFLOP console at $299 versus a 4+ TFLOP console at $399 ... I think most consumers going forward will choose the 4TFLOP one. 

The N64 RAM pak actually had fairly decent support, 32X and Sega CD sold very poorly. 

TIL that less than 30% of games supporting an add-on is "decent support".



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Soundwave on 19 April 2016
potato_hamster said:
Soundwave said:

More likely PS4.5 becomes the lead PS model from here on out. Given a choice between a 1.8 TFLOP console at $299 versus a 4+ TFLOP console at $399 ... I think most consumers going forward will choose the 4TFLOP one. 

The N64 RAM pak actually had fairly decent support, 32X and Sega CD sold very poorly. 

TIL that less than 30% of games supporting an add-on is "decent support".

Truth is I think the 4.5 model will phase out the regular PS4 eventually outright. You won't be able to but the regular "gimped" PS4 in a few years they'll just make the 4.5 model. 



potato_hamster on 19 April 2016
Soundwave said:
potato_hamster said:

TIL that less than 30% of games supporting an add-on is "decent support".

Truth is I think the 4.5 model will phase out the regular PS4 eventually outright. You won't be able to but the regular "gimped" PS4 in a few years they'll just make the 4.5 model. 

That's the day Sony loses me as a customer if they pull crap like this. I'm not buying a new console every 3 years just to ensure that I get the version of the game the developers put most of their effort into.



Zombie9ers on 19 April 2016

......but will the controller have buttons????



ZahaDoom on 19 April 2016
potato_hamster said:
Soundwave said:

Truth is I think the 4.5 model will phase out the regular PS4 eventually outright. You won't be able to but the regular "gimped" PS4 in a few years they'll just make the 4.5 model. 

That's the day Sony loses me as a customer if they pull crap like this. I'm not buying a new console every 3 years just to ensure that I get the version of the game the developers put most of their effort into.

 I hear you, I'm not sure why ANY gamer would want this , but there's a whole bunch of them here in this thread that seem to. 

 

 I just want to point to the mistakes Microsoft made launching the Xbox one, I'm sure they didn't think they were making any mistakes either but history proves otherwise.

 This is another move by someone in corporate telling people what they want instead of listening to what they want.



mutantsushi on 19 April 2016
Intrinsic said:
mutantsushi said:


But let's get real: The "required parity" clause for devs, forcing them to offer 4.0 and 4.5 compatable games, will not last forever.

Thats the one major part of your enitr post I disagree with. 

in 10 years from now, devs should be allowed to make a game for the the PS5.5, that would still ... run on the current PS4 even if it's at 720p@30fps@low settings. 

Well thanks for the response...
To your disagreement, I just say that "allowed to make x-gen game" and "required to make x-gen game" are different beasts.
No doubt, for many games accomodating previous (half) gen is no big deal that won't limit inherent game play, so: WIN/WIN, sure.
Other games simply can't be fit into previous (half) gen scope... CERTAINLY NOT if forced to equally support VR/Morpheus.
(IMHO "full peripheral parity" clause will drop first, just because VR is so marginal on PS4, with 60 fps expectations especially)
While devs will no doubt be ALLOWED to make x-gen games for as long as they want, REQUIREMENT will undoubtedly drop at one point,
if nothing else when PS4.0 goes out of production, right?  (IMHO before that actual point, if Sony keeps it in production for long time, as prev gens have)