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Forums - Movies & TV - Star Wars 7.. What du you think now.?

FromDK said:
JWeinCom said:

The galaxy wasn't under the dark force control.  The First Order is basically a terrorist organization.  

Think about what happens in the real world when you take out a dictator like Sadaam Hussein.  Things don't just magically become fixed.  Other organizations try to fill the power vacuum.  That's what the new order is.  It's never stated or even implied that they control the galaxy.  They were operating beneath the radar while they built their weapon, then once they had it, they began more overt aggresion.

As for Rey being stronger than Kylo... she's really not.  We see her out-Jedi him twice.  The first time is when he was trying to read her mind.  She doesn't win the mental power because she's a better jedi, she wins it because Kylo is insecure and conflicted.  

The second time is when they get all lightsabery.  Two things to keep in mind here.  First off, Kylo just killed his dad.  He's going through some shit, and he's an emotional dude.  He's probably not emotionally 100%.  He's not physically 100% either.  The movie makes a point of establishing that Chewbacca's bowcaster fucks shit up.  It is basically a grenade launcher that directly hit Kylo, at a moment when he was especially vulnerable.  Then, Finn wore him down a bit.

Rey wasn't a match for Kylo, and she would have been murdered in a straight up fight.  That's why the deck had to be stacked.



I'm actually not a huge fan of the movie.  I saw it, I enjoyed it, but I have no desire to see it again.  That being said, people keep claiming there are plotholes and I'm just not seeing them.

I love Star wars so I tryed hard to think that way about first order.. Just think they are to big and to "known" for my tast.. whitout more info as to how they became such a big "force" (but you do have a point)

And i'm also one of thoose that think Rey was to "strong" Not only defeting Kylo.. Manipulate a stormtropper.. Fly Millennium Falcon almost as good as Han, first time she flies it.. (imo) all theeese things would make sense in the next movie.. I would have like if she was more at the level of Luke in new hope in this.

(do you wanna have a plothole.. :) Its mayby not a plothole that Kylo has Superior than Vader.. mindreading/interrogation skills.. that could somehow be explained by Snoke has tought him that.. BUT in the movie First order gets the locations of the The Resistance by tracking a space ship.. why would Kylo not just get Poe to tell it, when he "forced" him)


If you think that the First Order is too known, think of Nazi Germany or the Taliban.  These were organizations that people knew about and that certain people were  very concerned about, yet those in power didn't act.  So it's really not such a stretch to think an organization like the New Order could come to power.  

I sort of agree with you on Rey, but at the same time I don't think it would have worked if she was on Luke's level in New Hope.  That was when we first knew about Jedi, so even basic things would make the character look good.  By now, we've seen so much Jedi stuff that if Rey was just a good pilot, it would come off as kind of weak.  Also, consider their backgrounds.  Luke grew up as a farmer.  It seems Rey had a much harsher upbringing that required her to learn to fight.  As for being a good pilot, that's a trait of most force sensitives.  Luke and Annakin were amazing pilots without any real special training.  If Rey is a skywalker, then it would further explain why she would be so awesome at it.

As for the plot hole, I don't remember the scene exactly.  But, if they had the technology, it seems just as easy to track the ship as to force information out of Poe.  Just a choice.  Besides, they had Poe in captivity, so if the tracker failed they had a plan B.



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It was a good movie, lots of fun, interesting characters. Let's be real here, it is much better than the older trilogies. Empire Strikes Back was particularly disappointing after all the hype it got as being the best Star wars movie. It is really boring to watch these days..

I think people blatantly disregard all of the glaring issues of the older movies simply because they're old: bad acting, poor pacing, bad special effects, poor dialogue script, etc... Star Wars 7 is much better in all respects. Even though it is a remake of what was already a formulaic film, it did it much much better. Star Wars episode 7 is watchable, Star Wars (first one) is not watchable in 2016..



I describe myself as a little dose of toxic masculinity.

I haven't watched it a second time, so my evaluation of the movie still is that it's full of plot holes and frankly dumb story and dialogue writing

the dark side be like " our plan to subjugate the galaxy with our all-powerful but unfortunately highly vulnerable by design planet destroyer weapon has failed, twice .. let's use decades to build a bigger one with pretty much the same design flaws somebody can uncover in a ~2 minute strategy meeting"

Kylo be like "I can freeze blaster shots in mid air, but I'm still the first ever jedi/sith to get hit by one.. and after decades of jedi/sith training I lose in mind and light sword battles to a girl that didn't even know the force was real a few days ago"

Luke be like "one of my disciples went nuts, killed the rest and went to the dark side - better hide somewhere under some dumb pretext (but hey, atleast I plotted out exactly where I was going to go in my "search" years in advance and stored it in my droid)"

billions of people on the republics planets (afaik including the capital planet) be like "ARRGHH ----", while everyone else is like *shrug*

atleast it was fun watching it and it's fun ripping it now



LOVED it. Upon watching it the first time I had a few issues, mostly with Starkiller station. I felt the blowing up of that was a little tacked on and "same old star wars". I would have rather they end it with rescuing Rey, the saber duel and leave Starkiller as a bit of a mystery. Maybe they save her from there, she escapes thinking she's on a station but reaches the surface and has a WTF? moment finding she's on a planet. Then resistance fighters come back to attack and the station is gone and unexplained. Something like that without any planets blown up. Build it up for a later episode.

But anyway, those talking about plot holes simply don't understand the narrative. There are gaps in background that are purposely left out for the sake of creating mystery. It's like Episode 4 where audiences didn't know what Tatooine was, what the Rebels were or the empire, or even what Vader was. This is the opening chapter in a new series and there is meant to be a feeling of confusion as you watch. If you read a little expanded material and watch it a second time, it becomes more clear. I actually enjoyed the movie much more in the second watch through.

The movie is well-acted and very well produced. There is the inherent flaw in that it's a sequel - an addition story to the original plot by different authors - and as such it will never quite match the original's originality. We still don't know who Rey is and why she is so strong in the force, but that's part of the fun and at least she's super hot. The authors knew they couldn't out-vader Vader, so Kylo is meant to be the anti-vader: Weaker, spoiled, insecure. He's a great villain, but in a different way. He's more like Joeffrey. He's not cool, you just hate him. I'm sure we'll learn more about Snoke as we learn about Luke's recent wearabouts.



My feelings are the same as when I first saw it. It sucked and still sucks. Essentially a carbon copy of A New Hope. Brings absolutely nothing new to the lore.



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Lafiel said:

I haven't watched it a second time, so my evaluation of the movie still is that it's full of plot holes and frankly dumb story and dialogue writing

the dark side be like " our plan to subjugate the galaxy with our all-powerful but unfortunately highly vulnerable by design planet destroyer weapon has failed, twice .. let's use decades to build a bigger one with pretty much the same design flaws somebody can uncover in a ~2 minute strategy meeting"

Kylo be like "I can freeze blaster shots in mid air, but I'm still the first ever jedi/sith to get hit by one.. and after decades of jedi/sith training I lose in mind and light sword battles to a girl that didn't even know the force was real a few days ago"

Luke be like "one of my disciples went nuts, killed the rest and went to the dark side - better hide somewhere under some dumb pretext (but hey, atleast I plotted out exactly where I was going to go in my "search" years in advance and stored it in my droid)"

billions of people on the republics planets (afaik including the capital planet) be like "ARRGHH ----", while everyone else is like *shrug*

atleast it was fun watching it and it's fun ripping it now

Your ripping is flawed.  Well the first one isn't, the whole Starkiller station aspect is kinda lame.  But on the others:

-Kylo was distracted when he was shot.  And again, he was shot, but a crossbow that insta-kills anyone else.  He was bleeding out while sword fighting and still beat Fin and almost beat Rey until she had some special force moment.  We don't know where she gets her power, but it's obviously special and perhaps stronger then Ren's.  She's also established as very agile, nimble and uses melee weapons (her staff) for her entire life.  And the Force has shown before it can do the impossible even for those untrained, such as Luke being able to hit an impossible target without guidence or Aanakin winning a race.

-Luke probably didn't go to hide, he probably went to find out what went wrong and if there is a way he can stop the dark side in himself and his family.  His nephew just turned on him, he needs to stop it.  He most likely went seeking old knowledge from the first Jedis to learn the source of the Dark Side.  He didn't hide the location in his droid, his fellow researcher - the old guy from the begining - knew where he had gone and kept it secret.  Poe hid the location in BB.  R2, with his vast astromech data, was able to piece the map to Luke with the rest of the known galaxy.  Kylo said his people would have been able to do the same.

-All kinds of people are killed in Syria and other countries every day.  The rest of us shrug.  The New Republic fancied themselves a new Galactic Government.  Since only 5 planets were members, they obviously hadn't won the favor of everyone else.  I can't imagine others were too worked up.  But maybe they didn't even know.  We didn't see the reaction of any other planets.



twintail said:
Kylo ren is still a substandard and non threatening villain.

That's the point.



Seriously starting to believe I saw a different movie. Good acting? Good script? Good story?



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DevilRising said:

Instead, what we're left with, is a huge mess. I want to believe that maybe Ep 8 and 9 will be better, will be okay, especially since Abrams will not be doing them. But....honestly? The foundation Ep. 7 already set is SO bad, SUCH a mess....that I have very little hope or faith. And there is not a doubt in my mind that Lucas' original stories for this trilogy, and Lucas being there as a consultant telling them "yes this would happen" or "no that's dumb", would have resulted in a FAR better movie. I would love to be wrong. I would love for Ep. 8 and 9 to somehow save the trilogy, and I could just chalk Ep 7 up to Abrams being one of the worst things to happen to film. But as it stands now, the entire things is likely going to, sadly, awful. And for all their faults, yes, the Prequel Trilogy will stand out as having been far better films, let alone Star Wars films. People can have their gripes with them, and with Lucas, all they want, but at least the prequels were original, told the story they needed to, and managed to do their job, which was filling out more of the Star Wars universe and it's back-story.

Fine to say liking characters is subjective, I liked them so I have far more hope for this cast than I did for the Phantom Menace cast.  After episode 1, I remember thinking how I didn't care or feel invested in anyone.  That didn't change as the prequels went on, they just felt soulless to me and I never believed the relationships, either romantic or platonic. I felt Finn and Poe had more of a connection already than Annakin and Obi-Wan ever had and hoping they build that friendship in VIII.

My favorite character in VII is Rey. I liked her scavenging and living in the walker working for food rations and having to be self reliant and working on machines and being able to defend herself.  She was fun for me to watch and I do think Daisy Ridley will go on to have a good career.  I want to see her story unfold and where she'll go and what she'll do.  Maybe it will underwhelm, but the promise is there for me to have some fun and enjoy a story in a Star Wars movie again.

We watch movies for different reasons.  I like characters in a world.  No world draws me in if I don't care about anyone that populates it.  Can argue that is flawed or wrong, I just see it as a different perspective and value place in stories.



Lawlight said:

That doesn't make up for the terrible characters. I think they should reboot this mess and make a more grounded, mature Star Wars movie.

I'll be curious about the tone of Rogue One given we know how dark the base of that story is.