I don't think I'm being optimistic, just using information available to see what seems logical and see whether a rumor could have some legitimacy too it.

That rumored handheld, with performance close to XB1 requires what Polaris is able to offer on the GPU side. An AMD Puma CPU, scaled down to 14nm would also offer the necessary CPU performance to match XB1 in that form factor, but since AMD aren't scaling Puma down to 14nm and Zen as far as I'm aware is also 14nm. It's not really wrong to say that Zen would offer better than 2X the performance of Puma per watt, because new architecture, made on the 14nm node, compared to 28nm.

As for your points on console profit margins, well there's money to be made there, it's still pretty big business, otherwise AMD wouldn't have got into it.

Nintendo doesn't have to make much from hardware on launch models, since the console business model has always been about making profit from software. A potential Nintendo handheld is way more likely to sell big numbers than a console will.

The console business isn't going to hinder the PC market for graphics cards, CPUs or SOCs/APUs that AMD will sell themselves, because the two audiences are not in competition with each other. Console and Handheld gamers aren't PC customers really, they're their own thing and by targeting the dedicated gaming console/handheld business AMD increases their own sales. It actually makes perfect sense to provide products for this area of the market.

As for costs per chip, well as I've said before it's about what's required from a performance to energy perspective. AMD have even said themselves that their launch Polaris 10 product is aiming at a price of under $349 for a graphics card with performance comparable to an R9 290 (I previously remembered it at a 290x, but I was wrong about that, still the point stands though). Nintendo doesn't need something that big for this hypothetical handheld unit, they need a cut down version of the demo unit they used to show the architecture off at the AMD reveal.

Nintendo would be using more chips from a single wafer, so you have to know how many you can make from a 14nm wafer to say whether it's cost effective for AMD or whoever.

Finally for the record I'm just trying to see whether this rumor made any sense, more from a technical perspective (performance and power consumption, ability for a handheld power source to handle it).

For the record a Carrizo style APU could also fit the bill, the 15 watt was able to have 8 compute units, so it's not far from Xbox One levels of performance, 4 extra CUs, some more CPU cores could still fit the power envelope needed, although the rumor doesn't say that this hypothetical NX handheld was in the exact same power level as XB1, just that it was closest to XB1, which as I said before fits either half the power of XB1 or half way between XB1 and PS4. The latter doesn't really make sense for Carrizo, since the power requirements would put it above what a notebook level battery could handle.

Getting close to XB1 would be important if Nintendo wanted to have really easy porting of 3rd party games to NX handheld. To prevent cut down versions of those games you need something at least on XB1's level.

This is all speculation anyway right now, I was just bringing one of the rumors to the thread and explaining how it could work in reality.

Maybe I haven't explained it as well as I could (I'm having a headache so bear with me).

What I meant with "hinder their PC business for Nintendo" wasn't that NX and PC would compete in the market, but that shifting their limited 14nm production to satisfy Nintendo's needs instead of focusing on their own desktop and laptop parts would give them less money... and they aren't in a situation where they can afford that.

But I agree that it's all speculation from our side. That's the "fun" side of not knowing what's going on .

Personally, and leaving the CPU aside because I don't even know if they'll go with x86 or ARM (or keep with PowerPC), I'd be very, very surprised if Nintendo goes with something newer/better than Tonga, the chip inside R9 285/R9 380. Maybe, just maybe, they'll go with the XT version of the 380X, but I doubt it.

Isn't it essentially though? PS4 is pretty much the same thing as PS3, hence just the number change. Nintendo however has had its console hardware in eras. There was the NES era with NES and SNES. Then the 3D era with 64 and GC, then it had its gameplay changing era with Wii and Wii U.

Then Nintendo had said they are moving away from the Wii formula to try something different, but it doesn't seem that way. Based on everything we heard, it seems like Wii U 2.0, and PS4 being PS3 2.0 is kind of the perfect example.

the infos about shipping 20 millions NX units by the end of 2016 fiscal year are confirmed? are there a source?
who it came from?

btw, nice thread!

So how about some more rumours

-Dev in question will have his game out in December-seems to be a port, it's already out already, an RPG

-I posted a rumour a while back and someone asked him about it, he said-"A lot seems to be right mixed up with some very obvious bullshit to throw people off, I imagine. I can tell you this, the name is not what that post says it is."

-It's a more traditional console, no 'new' way to play. His devkit comes with a standard controller and a a controller with a screen(screen is capacitive)-he describes it as -"The touch screen one is a bit harder to describe- imagine, like, a Wii U Pro, but stretched, and with a small screen embedded in the middle".

-Nintendo is pushing online more than before

-It's not x86, porting could be difficult, but it is easy to develop for, no obvious bottlenecks.

- "there is no single metric where the console is weaker than the PS4. At worst it matches it. Development is extremely easy,"

-There are scrolling buttons-the L and R buttons(are clickable, can be depressed). The triggers are analog

-Knows nothing about the handheld. He speculates Nintendo might have some AR gimmicks, but not the central point of the console he thinks.

-Says the controller with the screen doesn't seem to be as expensive as the WIi U controller, no guidelines for remote play. He speculates they could sell it as two SKUs, one with the screen and one without. He thinks embedded remote play could be the selling point of the former.

-Nintendo plans a Q2 reveal of the console, he's been told to have a trailer and demo build ready, to be deployed at a short notice anytime starting April. -I'm guessing April Direct and Nintendo Treehouse intervies and demos maybe?-

-Specs wise
"It is more powerful than the PS4 by any sensible metric. Overall, it is at least slightly more powerful
12GB on ours. A substantial portion may not be available to games (we can only go as high as 6GB right now)
1TB embedded HDD, pretty sure this is not the case for the consumer version, though
I'll tell you it's not x86 (but you can probably guess what it is)"

-It aims for connectivity with mobile devices

-About Online
"The online is definitely far better this time around. In general, it seems like we can 'plug in' (so to speak) loads of online features into our games without having to worrying about whether the backend even supports them, that we never could on Nintendo systems before. There's not much online functionality in our game, but even basic features that were missing before are present here."
"From a features perspective, however, I can confirm they are on par with the competition this time =)"

-This post seems to be accurate to him
https://www.reddit.com/r/NintendoNX/comments/4c1ji6/before_april_fools_rolls_around_i_want_to_clear/

-You are extremely unlikely to get any photo leaks before the NX is announced officially by Nintendo. The studios (that I know of) that are building / porting to NX only have access to software. Some of these are not particularly small studios either.
Based on the length of development cycles / porting time - if the NX launches this year, then most third party games will not be available until early - mid 2017. Software / frameworks are great to get a head start, but they won't even consider finalizing a game until it's been fully tested on hardware.
Developers who claim to have signed an NDA with Nintendo are most probably lying. The studio will be under NDA with Nintendo and the developers/designers will be under some form of NDA from their studio (not Nintendo). The only exception would be small indie developers and it's very unlikely Nintendo would provide them with a development kit until after the reveal.
NX games will be able to share information across multiple devices. I am not 100% sure what type of information this will be, but the functionality is (apparently) available to third party developers.

-On the OS
"The OS seems to be fully accessible while the game is running. I can confirm that multitasking is a thing. The devkit can interact with Android and iOS tablets and phones, as well as PCs and Macs (I specifically tested for a Mac). From what I have been able to gather- and this part is strictly speculation- I think that the console will be able to construct a full profile for you by having you just pair up with a smartphone or tablet or PC, without you having to set one up."
"You can do this with games, although obviously, you need to have the other device programmed to be able to communicate with the console. In simple terms, games with smartphone apps will be able to instantly connect with their apps on phones or tablets, without nonsensical logins and pairings and synchronizations, and what not."
It resembles Android the most, a very bloated OS, in its current form. OS reserves 6GB, seems to run mostly fine.

-On the console and its relation to its other versions and other console hardware
"I think this version of the game is definitive, at least on consoles. It looks the best, performs the best, and has extra content included."
"It is a powerful, flexible traditional console, with very minor gimmicks that don't get in the way. Very unlike Nintendo, at least the Nintendo of the last 15 years."
:Uh, I'll make this my last answer for now: if the PS4.5 is real, I think it and the NX should be reasonably matched."

Keep in mind however, his game is a port and is already out on PS4 and XBO, and he likely has not had hands on the PS4.5.

-The EXT port interests him, has no idea what it is for, Nintendo is mum on it-it reminds him of the port on the bottom of a GC-. He has never worked on Nintendo console before.

-Disc is 25GB, dual layered discs are specified in the documentation

-Has HDMI 2.0a, USB 3.0, SD card slots and a LAN port, well his devkit has one anyway, but he doesn't think it will be on the final console.

-No backwards compatibility with Wii U or 3DS hardware

-"It is not a true hybrid. Looking into it, a lot of Geno's information seems to be false. As for whether or not this will be a flop- I can't predict that. I think it should do well. It is a well designed, good console, powerful, and Nintendo's third party outreach seems to be better this time around. I guess as long as Nintendo markets it well, it should do better than Wii U or Gamecube."

-His game has been in development since October, the first couple of months were on a software kit.

-He thinks the price will come in at $399, he thinks $250 seems unlikely, $300 maybe more likely.

-Maybe no OS level achievements? Interactive achievements are a thing, more like challenges or missions, but his dev team are implementing them as achievements.

-He says the name is 'marketable', says the Wii U was a terrible name.




Yah that's it. Like my previous post with that leaker, take with a mount fuji of salt. Keep in mind too he also says some things are wrong about the other guy's stuff.

EDIT: Bah forgot to include link, https://www.reddit.com/r/NintendoNX/comments/4cnkr8/i_am_a_developer_working_on_an_rpg_for_the_nx_ask/?sort=confidence

So, the most solid NX leak is the one that says virtually nothing about the NX?

I normally don't put too much faith in any leak, but for those that will appear this week (and specially tomorrow) I'd be extremely skeptical.  But

The underlined part seems to suggest an ARM based console, at least that's the impression it gives me.

The bolded part... well, Q2 goes from from April to June, so that "reveal" can be in the rumored April Direct or in June at E3 . Who knows?

Lastly, about the italics part, the tech specs one, there is a rule that says that dev kits usually have twice the amount of RAM of the actual console. But that rule comes from a time where the total memory was a lot lower, something that is no longer the case. We should expect a minimum of 6GB of usable RAM. That's an important remark as neither the PS4 or X1 devs have access to the full 8GB, but something more like 5-6GB.

They could lower it.  I didn't put it there, but he said the 6GB was restrictive and wish they had access to more.  He said the OS footprint is very big, bigger than the PS4.

This is what he said about it;

"It's not x86, while the other consoles are. So there's a bit of an adjustment period, though it's nothing too major. The other thing is that we have a lot of RAM in the devkit... but we can't use about half of it. Which isn't difficult (the portion we can use is still more than on other consoles) but it is frustrating."

If it does have actual multitasking as he says, I wouldn't expect it to get larger than that.

Bingo!

Every developer always asks for more. You could give them a Titan X and 12GB and they would still say "if only I had a bit more power" or "with a little more RAM I could do this or that". Don't worry about those complains

The thing to consider is that they can use more RAM than with the other consoles.