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Mr Puggsly on 13 March 2016
Thunderbird77 said:
Mr Puggsly said:

No, PS360 succeeded where Wii failed. 3rd party core games. Thats why PS360 stayed relevant longer.

ps3 and 360 took took longer to decline because they kept getting games while wii support nearly stopped starting 2012. But ultimately wii sold more hardware and almost as much software even with less titles available. Wii didn't fail at anything, it succeeded far more than ps3 and 360.

They kept getting games because they kept selling them well.

You seem to think its a coincidence Wii stopped getting support in spite of a massive userbase.

Wii was a success, but it failed at the core market. Wii U arguably made a mistake by chasing the core market.



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JWeinCom on 13 March 2016
Mr Puggsly said:
JWeinCom said:

Not to mention that the Wii sold a lot more in its early days.  The more you sell one year, the smaller your potential audience is next year. 

Wii sold less after a few years because the library wasnt great. Support went away because core software wasnt selling.

PS4 has had record breaking years, so I guess X1 is gonna outsell it anually in a few years? I doubt it.

You are actually trying to dispute that market saturation effects sales O_o..?



Mr Puggsly on 13 March 2016
JWeinCom said:
Mr Puggsly said:

Wii sold less after a few years because the library wasnt great. Support went away because core software wasnt selling.

PS4 has had record breaking years, so I guess X1 is gonna outsell it anually in a few years? I doubt it.

You are actually trying to dispute that market saturation effects sales O_o..?

I'm arguing many popular consoles arent affected by your saturation theory. The 7th gen was unique because the market leader Wii slowed down in sales to the point both 360 and PS3 were outselling it anually. They both even overtook Wii in software sales.

So again, the saturation thing seems to be a unique problem the Wii had. Also, the decline between Wii and Wii U is unique in the home console arena.



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Thunderbird77 on 13 March 2016
JWeinCom said:
Thunderbird77 said:

ps3 and 360 took took longer to decline because they kept getting games while wii support nearly stopped starting 2012. But ultimately wii sold more hardware and almost as much software even with less titles available. Wii didn't fail at anything, it succeeded far more than ps3 and 360.

Not to mention that the Wii sold a lot more in its early days.  The more you sell one year, the smaller your potential audience is next year. 

And we can even argue ps3 and 360 had such slow starts that their true first years were 2007/2008.



Thunderbird77 on 13 March 2016
Mr Puggsly said:
JWeinCom said:

Not to mention that the Wii sold a lot more in its early days.  The more you sell one year, the smaller your potential audience is next year. 

Wii sold less after a few years because the library wasnt great. Support went away because core software wasnt selling.

PS4 has had record breaking years, so I guess X1 is gonna outsell it anually in a few years? I doubt it.

wii's library was great, so much that it's biggest software still sold millions even after hardware sales slowed down.

third party support didn't went away because it was almost never there. treatment was better than N64 but nothing great. Nintendo support went away when they started working on wii u games, natural course.

Mr Puggsly said:
Thunderbird77 said:

ps3 and 360 took took longer to decline because they kept getting games while wii support nearly stopped starting 2012. But ultimately wii sold more hardware and almost as much software even with less titles available. Wii didn't fail at anything, it succeeded far more than ps3 and 360.

They kept getting games because they kept selling them well.

You seem to think its a coincidence Wii stopped getting support in spite of a massive userbase.

Wii was a success, but it failed at the core market. Wii U arguably made a mistake by chasing the core market.

ps360 kept getting games mostly out of necessity from third parties.

Again, wii didn't have much third party support to begin with.

wii was bought and played by the "core market", it was a success there. you're again making things as if the wii wasn't competing for the same market.

Mr Puggsly said:
JWeinCom said:

You are actually trying to dispute that market saturation effects sales O_o..?

I'm arguing many popular consoles arent affected by your saturation theory. The 7th gen was unique because the market leader Wii slowed down in sales to the point both 360 and PS3 were outselling it anually. They both even overtook Wii in software sales.

So again, the saturation thing seems to be a unique problem the Wii had. Also, the decline between Wii and Wii U is unique in the home console arena.

How could ps3 and 360 get saturated before their bases were higher? they started slower, peaked late.

Of course it was unique to wii in the 7th gen, when you sell 80m+ in 4 years, sales are bound to slow down. The decline between wii and wii u isn't relevant to this discussion.



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Mr Puggsly on 13 March 2016

@Thunderbird77

 

The thing is the saturation argument is bullshit. PS2 and DS sidnt suffer from that, they just kept selling.

Instead a massive audience went to PS360 because Wii's library was stale.



Recently Completed: 
River City: Rival Showdown for 3DS (3/5) - River City: Tokyo Rumble for 3DS (4/5) - Zelda: BotW for Wii U (5/5) - Zelda: BotW for Switch (5/5) - Zelda: Link's Awakening for Switch (4/5) - Rage 2 for X1X (4/5) - Rage for 360 (3/5) - Streets of Rage 4 for X1/PC (4/5) - Gears 5 for X1X (5/5) - Mortal Kombat 11 for X1X (5/5) - Doom 64 for N64 (emulator) (3/5) - Crackdown 3 for X1S/X1X (4/5) - Infinity Blade III - for iPad 4 (3/5) - Infinity Blade II - for iPad 4 (4/5) - Infinity Blade - for iPad 4 (4/5) - Wolfenstein: The Old Blood for X1 (3/5) - Assassin's Creed: Origins for X1 (3/5) - Uncharted: Lost Legacy for PS4 (4/5) - EA UFC 3 for X1 (4/5) - Doom for X1 (4/5) - Titanfall 2 for X1 (4/5) - Super Mario 3D World for Wii U (4/5) - South Park: The Stick of Truth for X1 BC (4/5) - Call of Duty: WWII for X1 (4/5) -Wolfenstein II for X1 - (4/5) - Dead or Alive: Dimensions for 3DS (4/5) - Marvel vs Capcom: Infinite for X1 (3/5) - Halo Wars 2 for X1/PC (4/5) - Halo Wars: DE for X1 (4/5) - Tekken 7 for X1 (4/5) - Injustice 2 for X1 (4/5) - Yakuza 5 for PS3 (3/5) - Battlefield 1 (Campaign) for X1 (3/5) - Assassin's Creed: Syndicate for X1 (4/5) - Call of Duty: Infinite Warfare for X1 (4/5) - Call of Duty: MW Remastered for X1 (4/5) - Donkey Kong Country Returns for 3DS (4/5) - Forza Horizon 3 for X1 (5/5)

JWeinCom on 13 March 2016
Mr Puggsly said:
JWeinCom said:

You are actually trying to dispute that market saturation effects sales O_o..?

I'm arguing many popular consoles arent affected by your saturation theory. The 7th gen was unique because the market leader Wii slowed down in sales to the point both 360 and PS3 were outselling it anually. They both even overtook Wii in software sales.

So again, the saturation thing seems to be a unique problem the Wii had. Also, the decline between Wii and Wii U is unique in the home console arena.

If you're arguing that many popular consoles aren't affected by market satuaration, you are dead wrong.

First off, this is not "my saturation theory".  This is a well known issue in marketing.  It's really not even debateable that this occurs.  It's flat out common sense and math.  The more people you sell to, the less people left to sell to.  This is marketing 101.

Secondly, this is not an uncommon problem to the Wii.  The PS2 peaked at 23 million in 2003, and went downhill afterwards.  PS3 sales peaked in 2010, then slid from then on.  360 sales peaked in 2010-2011, then went down from there.  DS sales peaked in 2009 and then went down.  3DS sales peaked in 2013 then started to go down.  PSP sales peaked in 2008 and then went down.  

This is not a unique problem the Wii had, and it's not even a problem.  It is the curve that literally every major system we have data for followed.  The only difference is that the Wii U launched a year ealier than the PS4, so the largest drop happened a year earlier, and that when you are 40 million units ahead of your rivals (as the Wii was at the end of 2010) your market is smaller.

And, saying the XBox 360 and PS3 outsold the Wii anually is half true at best.  The XBox 360 and PS3 outsold the Wii precisely one year before the Wii U was released.  

It's a sales site.  The data is readily available to you, so actually take a look at it.  The Wii sold well until the Wii U came out and Nintendo pulled marketing and game development.  That's simply a fact.



Thunderbird77 on 13 March 2016
Mr Puggsly said:

@Thunderbird77

 

The thing is the saturation argument is bullshit. PS2 and DS sidnt suffer from that, they just kept selling.

Instead a massive audience went to PS360 because Wii's library was stale.

Yeah, ps2 and ds kept selling... untill they declined. And most of ps2's legs after the 100m mark were from emergent markets anyway so wii's saturation point is in line with ps2.

It's still just your word that wii owners moved to ps3 and 360. Hardware and software data says otherwise.



JWeinCom on 13 March 2016
Mr Puggsly said:

@Thunderbird77

 

The thing is the saturation argument is bullshit. PS2 and DS sidnt suffer from that, they just kept selling.

Instead a massive audience went to PS360 because Wii's library was stale.

DS sales 2009- 27 million.

2010-  20 million

2011- 8.7 million

2012- 3 million

2013-818,000

Yeah... it just kept selling...

http://www.investopedia.com/terms/m/marketsaturation.asp

You're arguing against basic economics at this point...



etking on 13 March 2016

No, but the Wii U would have been much more successful if it could play Wii games in HD like the Dolphin emulator.