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Forums - Gaming - Apple has a $200 billion war chest, should it buy Nintendo and Sega?

Roderic_Blackwood said:
Soleron said:

It already is a duopoly. Nintendo still exist but the games they make no longer appeal to 20m+ people per title. They have no cultural impact any more; they've let the perception of gaming be dominated by GTA, CoD and Minecraft through inaction.

A buyout or major change of strategy could provide the catalyst for a return to relevance.

I completely disagree with you, it seems that you have forgotten that the Wii (still alive) has a lot of games with not only 20 million + but 30 m+ and 40m+ sold copies! The Wii U also has an impressive attach rate and I haven't seen anPS4 or XBOne game that surpass the 10m+, just in PS360 but in Wii as well and those systems are selling better than the Wii U so Nintendo sells more First Party software than Sony and Microsoft togheter,  and no one has reached the 3DS, the best selling system in this generation (and a lot of people seems to forget this), so duopoly? I don't think so, unless you said that there's a duopoly selling the same specs, same graphics, same old same stuff which yes, you're a correct. And it's funy: No cultural impact? LOL , maybe you haven't seen Smash Bros. or Pokémon or Zelda or Mario, icons of the videogame inustry and pop culture. I have no idea what's the name of the GTA V main character, I even know the entire Watch Dogs crew! And I do acknowledge GTA V success but it sells on the PS3, 360, PC, XBOne, PS4, 5 platforms against Nintendo, fighting on its own and doing fine right now.

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^excellent point Roderic why can't most people understand this ...very valid points ...that is why Sony's PlayStation head said he wants Sony to sell more first party software ...that is where the money is at (first party no middleman) straight profit



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It might be a good move for Apple to broaden their horizons. However, I do not see them being able to purchase Nintendo or Sega. Both companies have conservative management and quite conservative shareholders that will not accept a buyout or takeover offer by a foreign company. In addition, there is a high chance that the Japanese government would intervene (they have a history of doing so, especially when it comes to symbolic and/or historical businesses) even a takeover was agreed to by the management and/or shareholders.

Apple's best chance with Sega and Nintendo would probably be to form a partnership with them that makes them exclusive developers for their platform. With that being said though, Apple might be better off looking to acquire Western companies because there are far fewer barriers that they would have to deal with.



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kowenicki said:
Teeqoz said:

I just gave you a link to Apple's balance sheet. It's compiled information from Apple's latest Form 10-Q report to the SEC commitee. They can't lie there.

Beat me to it. I was about to post the balance sheet too, but I fear it would be ponitless.

This thread is just cringe-worthy on an entirely different level.



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LurkerJ said:
kowenicki said:

Beat me to it. I was about to post the balance sheet too, but I fear it would be ponitless.

The discussion started out with a silly trollish proposal and it didn't rise to a factual level. Haven't we all stooped to his level and thrown back juvenile proposals? We are being too simplistic for no particular reason other than fitting in. Ofc the 200b aren't ready to be spent but Apple still has enough cash, cash investments, marketable securities to afford major buyouts. 

Not Microsoft though...



CGI-Quality said:
Soundwave said:
They might not be able to buy MS just quite yet ... but they're getting there. 

They are? Does anyone has sources for this? I've asked once already, but based on what, do they have enough to buy MS? Do people REALLY believe that Apple could, one day, buy MS? Really?

Apple has $16.7b in cash, $21.4b in short term investments, $24.6b in receivables, and $177.7b in long term investments.  For the sake of argument, if they were to use all of that, that would give them $240.4b.

Microsoft's market capitalization is $393b.  To buy a controlling share in Microsoft, you would need to buy 50% + 1 shares, or roughly $200b worth.  Generally, when you do you do a buyout, you have to do it at a premium.  A 20% premium would be $240b.  So technically, Apple has enough available to buy Microsoft, even without resorting to a stock swap.  

Having said that, this approach is not really possible, as Apple most likely doesn't have easy access to those long term investments (or they may come at a penalty if they are cashed out early).  Apple could do a cash + stock deal, where they spend $30b in cash and $210b in stock (where eash MS investor would get 1 Apple share per 2 MS shares, using today's rates).  Apple would need to convince their shareholders that this is a good deal, as $210b is just under half the value of Apple.

This whole thing would also have to get approval from the SEC, and considering that both Apple and MS make operating systems, this would essentially give Apple a monopoly.  The SEC would most likely block this from ever happening.

And no, I honestly think this will not happen.



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DM235 said:
CGI-Quality said:

They are? Does anyone has sources for this? I've asked once already, but based on what, do they have enough to buy MS? Do people REALLY believe that Apple could, one day, buy MS? Really?

Apple has $16.7b in cash, $21.4b in short term investments, $24.6b in receivables, and $177.7b in long term investments.  For the sake of argument, if they were to use all of that, that would give them $240.4b.

Microsoft's market capitalization is $393b.  To buy a controlling share in Microsoft, you would need to buy 50% + 1 shares, or roughly $200b worth.  Generally, when you do you do a buyout, you have to do it at a premium.  A 20% premium would be $240b.  So technically, Apple has enough available to buy Microsoft, even without resorting to a stock swap.  

Having said that, this approach is not really possible, as Apple most likely doesn't have easy access to those long term investments (or they may come at a penalty if they are cashed out early).  Apple could do a cash + stock deal, where they spend $30b in cash and $210b in stock (where eash MS investor would get 1 Apple share per 2 MS shares, using today's rates).  Apple would need to convince their shareholders that this is a good deal, as $210b is just under half the value of Apple.

This whole thing would also have to get approval from the SEC, and considering that both Apple and MS make operating systems, this would essentially give Apple a monopoly.  The SEC would most likely block this from ever happening.

And no, I honestly think this will not happen.

Good post. But it does show it's not impossible, especially if MS' market cap dropped, but you're right the SEC would likely block any type of move like this on the grounds of it being a monopoly. 

Sony could buy Nintendo or Sony fairly easily, it's just not worth it to them. Video game console sales are piddly compared to the iPhone sales they're used to. 

A hugely successful, usually market leading console sells maybe 100 million units in 5-6 years and low profit margin (sometimes a net loss). The iPhone sells 74-75 million units in *three months* sometimes (a quarter) at a huge profit margin.

Sony isn't exactly that attractive outside of the a few divisions. Nintendo just does video games. 

Not really worth it. If Apple really wanted to make a game console they easily could do so themselves and probably sell 40-60 million fairly easily if they took it seriously. They would get a ton of third party support. 

If they wanted to get into the game business I'd reccomend to them to buy a third party company like a Square-Enix for about $3-$4 billion, which would much cheaper than buying a Nintendo. An Apple console with S-E exclusive and lots of third party support, competent hardware, and lots of marketing would be a far cheaper way for Apple to get into the console biz if that's what they want, but I don't think they want that. It's just not lucrative enough of a business for them to care. 



CGI-Quality said:
Soundwave said:

Good post. But it does show it's not impossible, especially if MS' market cap dropped, but you're right the SEC would likely block any type of move like this on the grounds of it being a monopoly. 

Sony could buy Nintendo or Sony fairly easily, it's just not worth it to them. Video game console sales are piddly compared to the iPhone sales they're used to. 

A hugely successful, usually market leading console sells maybe 100 million units in 5-6 years and low profit margin (sometimes a net loss). The iPhone sells 74-75 million units in *three months* sometimes (a quarter) at a huge profit margin.

Sony isn't exactly that attractive outside of the a few divisions. Nintendo just does video games. 

Not really worth it. If Apple really wanted to make a game console they easily could do so themselves and probably sell 40-60 million fairly easily if they took it seriously. They would get a ton of third party support. 

If they wanted to get into the game business I'd reccomend to them to buy a third party company like a Square-Enix for about $3-$4 billion, which would much cheaper than buying a Nintendo. An Apple console with S-E exclusive and lots of third party support, competent hardware, and lots of marketing would be a far cheaper way for Apple to get into the console biz if that's what they want, but I don't think they want that. It's just not lucrative enough of a business for them to care. 

Your argument was also that they could buy MS. Do you see now how that's not so clear cut?

And yes, DM235, excellent post! Couldn't have put it better.

Actually that shows it's *possible* especially if MS' market cap drops and Apple's cash pile continues to rise (likely). I never said it would be easy.