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Forums - Gaming - "We will make you buy your favorite PS2 games that you already own" - Sony

Puppyroach said:
bananaking21 said:
"i already own a game, yet im bitching about to have to repurchase it on another platform. even though i own it and can play it"


sheesh. if you own then, then just fucking play it and stop bitching.

Or one could make the argument that if fans have bought their games once and actually helped Sony reach success, they shouldn't have to fork out cash once more just because they are dedicated to the brand. You can argue either way, it all depends on where you're coming from.

By that logic one could say that Sony should give me the Last of US remastered because I already own the PS3 version, obviously we can agree that that is unreasonable because the remaster had some work done to it to enhance it, but why can't the same logic be applied to these PS2 games, it's clear some work went into making the PS2 emulator, not only to enhance resolution but to also add trophy support and make sure it performs well, which means some sort of QA for each game. So although these PS2 game on PS4 was significantly cheaper to release than porting it to PS4, it still cost time and money. We don't even know if it's a full emulator or one that has to be customized per game.

Another thing to consider is the complexity and task of attempting a full scale emulator that people want, the PS2 has around 4000 games in it's library, even the best PS2 emulator out their,  PCSX2, still has graphical glitches and other issues which people report on their forums, it was even worse when the emulator was starting out, I hardly think Sony would release such a glitchy mess just to claim they have backwards compatibility even if it could play 50% just fine, people would not be impressed and would be rather annoyed if the emulator was that hit and miss, it's why I think they've taken the more controlled method they have, choose games people may like and get the emulator up to scratch and then release it. Over time and through customer feeback they could definitely build a very capable PS2 emulator in a quick time frame, so their could be a possibility one day of an actual disc based emulator, but they'd probably sell the emulator for maybe $30-$60 to get some return on investment.

On the other hand, if they could just copy paste their old PS3 emulator across to PS4, that would cost them almost nothing, in this case yeah of course they would of given disc based emulation, they probably wouldn't have bothered with trophies, just simple cost effective ISO dumps to the Store, no harm no foul for those playing using their discs, great public relations to combat Microsoft backwards compatibility....but that's clearly not the case, it looks like they may have to have re-writtent the emulator from scratch to work on the PS4 different architecture, they would of also been able to estimate the cost of building and emulator from scratch based on how much money and time they spent building one on the PS3, so maybe the way things have worked out were the only option to make PS2 games on PS4 a thing...that's my educated guess at least.



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Viktor said:
SuperNova said:

I can understand no support for disc-based backwards compartibility, as amazing and consumer friendly as that would have been, with getting the little enhancements the emulated games offer to boot. What I cannot understand is having to repay for a digital purchase made on the ps3. Those should carry over. They should be unified.
It wasn't cool that Nintendo made you repay for virtual console games (albeit at a dicounted price) on the WiiU (I hope they don't drop the ball like that on their next system) and this isn't either.


You could still play and re-download any WiiWare and VirtualConsole game bought on Wii on WiiU without paying a cent. If you wanted new WiiU features it was a different thing.

Yes, thats true, and while having them all on one console is way more convinient than having to keep the Wii around, you still have to go into the Wii mode of the console and can't just launch them from the WiiU menu. I know that's sort of a miniscule complaint, but having to dig out my Wii remotes just to realize the batterys have drained in the meantime, every time I want to play a virtual console game is sort of annoying. I personally 'upgraded' mainly to be able to start them from the main menu.

Like I said, I hope that with Nintendo account a more truly unified and consumer friendly system, with crossbuy, crosssave and convinient digital bc comes along.



Mr_No said:
bananaking21 said:
"i already own a game, yet im bitching about to have to repurchase it on another platform. even though i own it and can play it"


sheesh. if you own then, then just fucking play it and stop bitching.

What about those, like me, who have a considerable library of PS2 games but their PS2 doesn't work? Do I need to buy another PS2?

Just look on the back of your dvd cases. There is explained which hardware you need to run these games (f.e. a PS2 with the right region code). That's what was promised, nothing else:

Every other compatible system is just a free bonus.



jake_the_fake1 said:

By that logic one could say that Sony should give me the Last of US remastered because I already own the PS3 version, obviously we can agree that that is unreasonable because the remaster had some work done to it to enhance it, but why can't the same logic be applied to these PS2 games, it's clear some work went into making the PS2 emulator, not only to enhance resolution but to also add trophy support and make sure it performs well, which means some sort of QA for each game. So although these PS2 game on PS4 was significantly cheaper to release than porting it to PS4, it still cost time and money. We don't even know if it's a full emulator or one that has to be customized per game.

Another thing to consider is the complexity and task of attempting a full scale emulator that people want, the PS2 has around 4000 games in it's library, even the best PS2 emulator out their,  PCSX2, still has graphical glitches and other issues which people report on their forums, it was even worse when the emulator was starting out, I hardly think Sony would release such a glitchy mess just to claim they have backwards compatibility even if it could play 50% just fine, people would not be impressed and would be rather annoyed if the emulator was that hit and miss, it's why I think they've taken the more controlled method they have, choose games people may like and get the emulator up to scratch and then release it. Over time and through customer feeback they could definitely build a very capable PS2 emulator in a quick time frame, so their could be a possibility one day of an actual disc based emulator, but they'd probably sell the emulator for maybe $30-$60 to get some return on investment.

On the other hand, if they could just copy paste their old PS3 emulator across to PS4, that would cost them almost nothing, in this case yeah of course they would of given disc based emulation, they probably wouldn't have bothered with trophies, just simple cost effective ISO dumps to the Store, no harm no foul for those playing using their discs, great public relations to combat Microsoft backwards compatibility....but that's clearly not the case, it looks like they may have to have re-writtent the emulator from scratch to work on the PS4 different architecture, they would of also been able to estimate the cost of building and emulator from scratch based on how much money and time they spent building one on the PS3, so maybe the way things have worked out were the only option to make PS2 games on PS4 a thing...that's my educated guess at least.

My point was that you could argue either way, and noone is really more valid than the other in my view since both sides have strong arguments either way. As far as I know, TLOU was rebuilt from the ground up, just like Halo 1 and 2 in their remasters. I do support the argument in that case that those who bought the original games digitally should get a significant discount. Or do something like what MS did with the GoW 1 remaster.

I´m not to sure Sony has been working that hard to emulate PS2 on PS4, my guess would be that it is at the same level as "Bleem!" for Dreamcast, an emulator that increases resolution and sharpens the image and main work goes into adding trophy support. I´m not taking anything away from the effort, because it is a great fan service, but I don´t think it took an enormous amount of work to accomplish.



mornelithe said:
Mr_No said:
mornelithe said:

Yes, there are plenty of people out there who have considerable libraries of X, that at some point in time become useless due to a hardware failure.  Usually what those people do is replace said piece of hardware in order to continue enjoying said library.  After the PS3 gen, people gamer's (other than myself, I bought a launch 60g) made it clear that BC wasn't a priority.  If it'd been that important, more people should've gotten the launch PS3, and maybe Sony would've put some effort into ensuring BC.  That didn't happen, so Sony's clearly not going to risk profit by adding something into their hardware architecture that increases costs, that nobody (or few people) cares about. 

With PS Now, they can at least leverage their libraries to individuals who may not be interested in having a gaming console, but are interested from time to time, with playing games.  PS Now was never for people who own hardware, it was always going to be for everyone else.

I'm not asking for every PS2 games for free. I'm just saying why isn't disc-based emulation is not an alternative? I mean, I own a copy of the game. I'm not even complaining about PS Now, which could've been a better alternative than a PS2 Classic at a $15 pricepoint. I doubt it'll happen, but I'm hopeful they might consider it in the future.

Very likely for the same reason that BC on PS3 was so costly, it required putting a PS2 on the circuit board.   But that's a guess, I've no technical idea about it.  Would probably need someone like Tachikoma to explain.

Yeah, I remember they had the PS2 Emotion Engine on the early PS3 consoles and how pricey it turned out for them, hence the removal from future SKUs. I'm not an expert either, but those PS2 classics on PS4... they run via software emulation, right? Like on the Xbox One? A disc check that allows you to play those the PS2 games would suffice, if I'm not wrong.



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please Persona 4 and Persona 3, the best jrpgs!



Well my PS2 is dead and the majority of my PS2 games have been lost or stolen. I wouldn't mind buying the games again BUT not at that $15 price range. I can accept $10. ^^



My only problem is that it's expensive and don't have the games I want... but you can always wait for the game you want to reach the right price... and also play the game on the HW it was intended or go emulator on PC... no need to be offended by the offer.



duduspace11 "Well, since we are estimating costs, Pokemon Red/Blue did cost Nintendo about $50m to make back in 1996"

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=8808363

Mr Puggsly: "Hehe, I said good profit. You said big profit. Frankly, not losing money is what I meant by good. Don't get hung up on semantics"

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=9008994

Azzanation: "PS5 wouldn't sold out at launch without scalpers."

tiffac said:
Well my PS2 is dead and the majority of my PS2 games have been lost or stolen. I wouldn't mind buying the games again BUT not at that $15 price range. I can accept $10. ^^


I hope we get more games on the 5-10 range =]



duduspace11 "Well, since we are estimating costs, Pokemon Red/Blue did cost Nintendo about $50m to make back in 1996"

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=8808363

Mr Puggsly: "Hehe, I said good profit. You said big profit. Frankly, not losing money is what I meant by good. Don't get hung up on semantics"

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=9008994

Azzanation: "PS5 wouldn't sold out at launch without scalpers."

Well Sony is quite right. I just bought Final Fantasy 7 on PSN for PS4 just now, and i have every version already available.