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Forums - Nintendo Discussion - So, 13 seconds footage for Zelda HD during 2015...

 

Is that enough footage?

Yes 96 26.52%
 
No 266 73.48%
 
Total:362
freebs2 on 28 December 2015
curl-6 said:
freebs2 said:
curl-6 said:

Nobody says they have to stop making games like Splatoon and Mario Kart, but these games alone cannot carry a console to mainstream success in today's market. An lineup composed almost entirely of E-rated cartoon games doesn't cut it in 2015.

I undersrtand what you mean, I'm all in for variety but "hardcore" games like Xenoblade or Metroid (unfortunately) will never move a huge amount of consoles for Nintendo; their purpose is to serve top users and generate goodwill from the media - but those top users have likely bought the 3DS or the WiiU anyway. It's not really a matter of M-rated VS E-rated games, its more a matter of consistency between the target, the console's market offering and the content.

To make an example, take New Super Mario Bros Wii vs New Super Mario Bros U

The Wii's market offering can be summarized as: local multplayer that is affordable and for everyone.

Nintendo knew that, in fact they have turned an historically single player game into 4-player platform/party game. It was an instant success, beacuse for the market it was clear what the Wii was offering and NSMBU perfectly realized that promise: in fact it was a local multiplayer, that everyone was familiar with and could easily understand and it was also affordable (in bundle with the console).

Now firstly the WiiU's market offering can't be easily determined (and that is probably its main problem) but it's clearly different form the Wii. Since the gamepad is its main innovation it's hard to say the console is designed for local multiplayer (you can only use one). Is it affordable? no, it still costs more than Wii on day one. Is it for everyone? Hardly since the main goal of the gamepad is to add depht and that is not an easy concept to understand.

New Super Mario Bros U which is exactly the same game as its predecessor, it perfectly includes the values of Wii but completely uncoherent to what the WiiU was offering. Of course a user that bought the WiiU on day one was expecting a game to utilize the controller in a meaningfull way and was also expecting a graphical improvement, since he had paid more for the better hardware. So this explains why NSMBU underperformed.

You could do the same "exercise" with Metroid Prime to tell why the 1st entry in the series sold more on 20m userbase than the 3rd entry on a 5 five times larger one.

A game like UC/TLoU would push more units only if Nintendo designed a console aimed the same target and with the same features as Ps4/XB One but at the same time, a console like that would weaken the potential of many core IPs like Mario, Mario Kart, Pokemon, etc.

That's the thing though, the audience who buy games like Uncharted are the majority now, hence why PS4 is doing so well by catering primarily to this demographic.

The market for a console geared primarily for the likes of Mario is shrinking, hence Wii U's poor sales.

The demographics are still the same as 5 year ago. Actually the audience who buys Minecraft, plays F2P games on PC and smarphones are the majority now. The way is see it, is Sony is doing so well becuase they had a clear idea of the target and they designed a console and content that was consistent with their expectations. Nintendo on the other hand didn't have a clear idea of which target they wanted to cater to, hence they made 2 consoles that didn't look too distant from their predecessor but added something, trying to attract more "hardcore" fanbases (a DS with 3D, a Wii with improved graphics and an exotic controller). As a result the target they were serving previously is looking elswere right now, but its not like poeple suddently started hating Mario.





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curl-6 on 28 December 2015
freebs2 said:

The demographics are still the same as 5 year ago. Actually the audience who buys Minecraft, plays F2P games on PC and smarphones are the majority now. The way is see it, is Sony is doing so well becuase they had a clear idea of the target and they designed a console and content that was consistent with their expectations. Nintendo on the other hand didn't have a clear idea of which target they wanted to cater to, hence they made 2 consoles that didn't look too distant from their predecessor but added something, trying to attract more "hardcore" fanbases (a DS with 3D, a Wii with improved graphics and an exotic controller). As a result the target they were serving previously is looking elswere right now, but its not like poeple suddently started hating Mario.

The audience lost to F2P and phones are gone for good though, so the type of customers available to console sellers have changed.

In the console space, the crowd PS4 targets are the majority, and without that demographic, you cannot have a successful console.



freebs2 on 28 December 2015
curl-6 said:
freebs2 said:

The demographics are still the same as 5 year ago. Actually the audience who buys Minecraft, plays F2P games on PC and smarphones are the majority now. The way is see it, is Sony is doing so well becuase they had a clear idea of the target and they designed a console and content that was consistent with their expectations. Nintendo on the other hand didn't have a clear idea of which target they wanted to cater to, hence they made 2 consoles that didn't look too distant from their predecessor but added something, trying to attract more "hardcore" fanbases (a DS with 3D, a Wii with improved graphics and an exotic controller). As a result the target they were serving previously is looking elswere right now, but its not like poeple suddently started hating Mario.

The audience lost to F2P and phones are gone for good though, so the type of customers available to console sellers have changed.

In the console space, the crowd PS4 targets are the majority, and without that demographic, you cannot have a successful console.

There are no basis to say that the F2P crowd is "lost for good", at least not everyone. Of course I'm not expecting people who only played Brain Training on DS to buy another console anytime soon. But it is wrong to assume that anyone under the "casual" label has the same taste and acts the same way. The world is not black and white.

Also, it is wrong to assume that targets in the market are mutually exclusive one to another. A lot of people who plays Minecraft also plays games like call of duty as well as people who play on consoles also frequently play on smarphones as well.

Targets can be trasversal form one to another. If Nintendo wants to stay relevant they should aim to be trasversal, to offer something different that a certain % of console users, f2p players and former handheld users can find attractive.





curl-6 on 28 December 2015
freebs2 said:
curl-6 said:

The audience lost to F2P and phones are gone for good though, so the type of customers available to console sellers have changed.

In the console space, the crowd PS4 targets are the majority, and without that demographic, you cannot have a successful console.

There are no basis to say that the F2P crowd is "lost for good", at least not everyone. Of course I'm not expecting people who only played Brain Training on DS to buy another console anytime soon. But it is wrong to assume that anyone under the "casual" label has the same taste and acts the same way. The world is not black and white.

Also, it is wrong to assume that targets in the market are mutually exclusive one to another. A lot of people who plays Minecraft also plays games like call of duty as well as people who play on consoles also frequently play on smarphones as well.

Targets can be trasversal form one to another. If Nintendo wants to stay relevant they should aim to be trasversal, to offer something different that a certain % of console users, f2p players and former handheld users can find attractive.

The F2P crowd have no incentive to re-enter the console space when their phone fills all their gaming needs, and they've been conditioned to paying low prices that a console ecosystem cannot survive on. The kind of games they want to play they can get for 99c or for free on a device they already own, why would they pay hundreds of dollars for an extra piece of hardware then $60 on top of that per game?



fatslob-:O on 29 December 2015
curl-6 said:

The F2P crowd have no incentive to re-enter the console space when their phone fills all their gaming needs, and they've been conditioned to paying low prices that a console ecosystem cannot survive on. The kind of games they want to play they can get for 99c or for free on a device they already own, why would they pay hundreds of dollars for an extra piece of hardware then $60 on top of that per game?

Some of them are doing just that on the PS4 ... 

As for why, quality games maybe ? 



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curl-6 on 29 December 2015
fatslob-:O said:
curl-6 said:

The F2P crowd have no incentive to re-enter the console space when their phone fills all their gaming needs, and they've been conditioned to paying low prices that a console ecosystem cannot survive on. The kind of games they want to play they can get for 99c or for free on a device they already own, why would they pay hundreds of dollars for an extra piece of hardware then $60 on top of that per game?

Some of them are doing just that on the PS4 ... 

As for why, quality games maybe ? 

That's not the audience I'm talking about. I'm talking about the blue ocean crowd that made the Wii such a massive success. They've moved on to mobile and the like, not to PS4.



fatslob-:O on 29 December 2015
curl-6 said:

That's not the audience I'm talking about. I'm talking about the blue ocean crowd that made the Wii such a massive success. They've moved on to mobile and the like, not to PS4.

Have they ? Is there any proof for this ? PS4 definitely got some of the crowds from the WII though ... 

Also I could've just made the claim they went to PC to play flash games ...



curl-6 on 29 December 2015
fatslob-:O said:
curl-6 said:

That's not the audience I'm talking about. I'm talking about the blue ocean crowd that made the Wii such a massive success. They've moved on to mobile and the like, not to PS4.

Have they ? Is there any proof for this ? PS4 definitely got some of the crowds from the WII though ... 

Also I could've just made the claim they went to PC to play flash games ...

I have no doubt some Wii owners went to PS4. But the kind of games that attracted these people to Wii are now on mobile for 99c, that's logically where they would have moved to, since they obviously did not transition to Wii U, and PS4 does not really offer those kind of games.



freebs2 on 29 December 2015
curl-6 said:
fatslob-:O said:
curl-6 said:

The F2P crowd have no incentive to re-enter the console space when their phone fills all their gaming needs, and they've been conditioned to paying low prices that a console ecosystem cannot survive on. The kind of games they want to play they can get for 99c or for free on a device they already own, why would they pay hundreds of dollars for an extra piece of hardware then $60 on top of that per game?

Some of them are doing just that on the PS4 ... 

As for why, quality games maybe ? 

That's not the audience I'm talking about. I'm talking about the blue ocean crowd that made the Wii such a massive success. They've moved on to mobile and the like, not to PS4.

That's what I was talking about, targets are not mutually exclusive. The Wii target was not only core nintendo fans and the "blue ocean" also a lot of Ps3 and X360 bought a Wii during its lifetime, also you have to consider generations: a lot of Wii users were kids who played on consoles for the first time - and this is not only my opinion, Sony was aware of that http://ps4daily.com/2014/07/sony-aims-to-win-over-some-wii-owners-with-playstation-4/ .

The same way the actual F2P crowd is not only the Wii's "blue ocean". It's a group of different mainstream and non gamers, with different tastes and preferences playing F2P for a specific purpose, as a very brief diversion on the go.



curl-6 on 29 December 2015
freebs2 said:

That's what I was talking about, targets are not mutually exclusive. The Wii target was not only core nintendo fans and the "blue ocean" also a lot of Ps3 and X360 bought a Wii during its lifetime, also you have to consider generations: a lot of Wii users were kids who played on consoles for the first time - and this is not only my opinion, Sony was aware of that http://ps4daily.com/2014/07/sony-aims-to-win-over-some-wii-owners-with-playstation-4/ .

The same way the actual F2P crowd is not only the Wii's "blue ocean". It's a group of different mainstream and non gamers, with different tastes and preferences playing F2P for a specific purpose, as a very brief diversion on the go.

So you think Nintendo would be better off chasing the F2P crowd than today's mainstream console gamer?