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Forums - Microsoft - Phil Spencer: Fewer 3rd party exclusives, focus is on 1st party

Mr Puggsly said:
S.T.A.G.E. said:


True...Sony bought a lot of companies and invested in them creating their own development style. Notice how sonys developers make games in different genres but follow a similar art style? Also naughty dog never made the games they made with sony before they were with sony. Sony changed their direction and restructured naughty dog. Now they've split naughty dog into two teams.

Lets admit a studio becoming successful is also luck (such as acquiring the right talent) and not just Sony's brilliance.

Sony has closed numerous studios because they werent making hits. They even sold one not long ago.


It's not luck. It's called having qualities most studios on their level of budget don't have.



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S.T.A.G.E. said:
EspadaGrim said:
I guess that people seem to forget that almost all of Sony's big studios were bought Naughty Dog, Guerrilla, Sucker Punch and Media Molecule.


True...Sony bought a lot of companies and invested in them creating their own development style. Notice how sonys developers make games in different genres but follow a similar art style? Also naughty dog never made the games they made with sony before they were with sony. Sony changed their direction and restructured naughty dog. Now they've split naughty dog into two teams.

"similar art style"? What does that even mean?

Killzone games do not follow the same art style as Uncharted.

LittleBigPlanet games do not have the same art style as Infamous.

God of War and Last of Us have very different art styles.

Most of Sony's "artsy" games aren't even made by Sony but are just funded by Sony. Which is fine.

Just put it bluntly and honestly. Sony bought a lot of their studios after they proved themselves to be talented. Nothing wrong with that. They also bought some that didn't pan out, just like MS.



sasquatchmontana said:
EspadaGrim said:
sasquatchmontana said:

They're not doing that anymore.
Naughty Dog's Bruce Straley says "we've brainstormed ideas for new games, but all of that is put on ice right now while we work on Uncharted 4"

So the second team is pretty much an incubation team.

I don't know. They could have 100 teams, if they're only spitting out 1 new game every 2-3 years it really doesn't matter how many teams you have, the question should be "how many games are you finishing in the next 2 years?"


Sony is finished  with uncharted naughty dog will be working on two games now. One is the last of us and after uncharted is finished a new ip will form.



LudicrousSpeed said:
S.T.A.G.E. said:
EspadaGrim said:
I guess that people seem to forget that almost all of Sony's big studios were bought Naughty Dog, Guerrilla, Sucker Punch and Media Molecule.


True...Sony bought a lot of companies and invested in them creating their own development style. Notice how sonys developers make games in different genres but follow a similar art style? Also naughty dog never made the games they made with sony before they were with sony. Sony changed their direction and restructured naughty dog. Now they've split naughty dog into two teams.

"similar art style"? What does that even mean?

Killzone games do not follow the same art style as Uncharted.

LittleBigPlanet games do not have the same art style as Infamous.

God of War and Last of Us have very different art styles.

Most of Sony's "artsy" games aren't even made by Sony but are just funded by Sony. Which is fine.

Just put it bluntly and honestly. Sony bought a lot of their studios after they proved themselves to be talented. Nothing wrong with that. They also bought some that didn't pan out, just like MS.


Then sony should have the failure rate in development  of microsoft. They are not the same. Microsoft has no sony Santamonica even a sony Japan that they build from scratch but sony has their own turn ten in polyphony. Sony has always had an idea of what they want to make. Getting talented teams to work with is obvious but you have the edge when you have a goal for yourself and the talent internally tomake it happen. Today microsoft has more developers than sony and still petitions third party to make their first party ips more than sony. This gives sony the edge and sony will  continue to out develop microsoft until microsoft learns how to develop key aaa first party from the inside. If Nintendo could get their act straight with third party and build relationship with third party like Sony or microsoft it would be evident that Microsoft is the weakest link because if you add up development by all parties involved the longevity is strong in the ones who have all parties working  on key content, rather than  just everyone else.

 

As for sonys development  style. They tend to focus on making games borderline cinematic action games, with tight camera movement and have a strong sense of western storytelling. They are big on immersion and wanting a game to be an experience and not just a typical game. Sometimes they go too far like ready at dawn whom has been working for them for a while now. That game is definitely sonys style in the order but it went way off the handle with the cinematics. As I said sony has various genres  but they bring it all together with cinematic direction.



I think it's funny that there are people saying that this is what Sony did last generation but yet somehow Microsoft is now getting criticized for it.

I also find it funny that in a thread about Microsoft wanting to focus more on first party games people are still trying hard to make up any negatives for this. 



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ArchangelMadzz said:

I was under the impression we were talking about opinions. If in your opinion saying 'we want co op' makes it a collaborative effort than that's fine.

I didn't, i'm just suggesting how a relatively minor push on a system feature could have been the defiining element of a gaming series. I said it would difficult to define where the publisher and developer contribution ends and begins and if you did want to state MS din't have any involvement in it (aside from the money) then you would need to prove it.

ArchangelMadzz said:

I didn't say it was flagship, I'm saying it counts as new IP created by a Sony studio

And you could only think of Forza on Xbox?

ArchangelMadzz said:

Driveclub just announced that it sold 2 million units, if it was bundled with every PS4 then obviously I wouldn't count it

What about just 1.5 Million PS4's? Is 2 million the baseline for flagship IP on Playstation?

ArchangelMadzz said:

You're actually trying to make strawmen aren't you? You KNOW I'm talking about being bundled with EVERY 360 with Kinect. Not just a 'bundle'. But you felt the need to make a fake point to waste your and my time?

No I'm just confused that you seem to demerit Kinect Adventures because it was a bad game or bundled a lot. but also listed bad PS IPs or not so bads ones that had been bundled a lot.



Goatseye said:
twintail said:
so basically they can't afford the 3rd party games like they used to because if ps4 sales.

good to invest in 1st party but this is being done because there is no alternate .

They began investing $1 billion dollars in video games in 2013.

Rethink your sentence again.


Just because they can afford it doesn't mean it's cost effective. Which is really what twintail is alluding to. With PS4 basically dominating the console market and third party sales (check out the numbers for Batman AK for a quick reference) there is no way it is cost effective for MS nor the developers to take the money to make a title exclusive.

There really is no alternative and that's actually okay. In fact I'd say it is great. Perhaps we'll see more diversity from MS beyond the Halo/Gears/Forza rehash going forward and that can only be a good thing for the Xbox brand.



S.T.A.G.E. said:
Mr Puggsly said:

Lets admit a studio becoming successful is also luck (such as acquiring the right talent) and not just Sony's brilliance.

Sony has closed numerous studios because they werent making hits. They even sold one not long ago.


It's not luck. It's called having qualities most studios on their level of budget don't have.

Would you say Driveclub is indicitive of a quality most racing studios didn't have and if so, could you explain why it scored much less then it's contemporaries, despite being delayed a year?



sasquatchmontana said:

ArchangelMadzz said:

I was under the impression we were talking about opinions. If in your opinion saying 'we want co op' makes it a collaborative effort than that's fine.

I didn't, i'm just suggesting how a relatively minor push on a system feature could have been the defiining element of a gaming series. I said it would difficult to define where the publisher and developer contribution ends and begins and if you did want to state MS din't have any involvement in it (aside from the money) then you would need to prove it.

ArchangelMadzz said:

I didn't say it was flagship, I'm saying it counts as new IP created by a Sony studio

And you could only think of Forza on Xbox?

ArchangelMadzz said:

Driveclub just announced that it sold 2 million units, if it was bundled with every PS4 then obviously I wouldn't count it

What about just 1.5 Million PS4's? Is 2 million the baseline for flagship IP on Playstation?

ArchangelMadzz said:

You're actually trying to make strawmen aren't you? You KNOW I'm talking about being bundled with EVERY 360 with Kinect. Not just a 'bundle'. But you felt the need to make a fake point to waste your and my time?

No I'm just confused that you seem to demerit Kinect Adventures because it was a bad game or bundled a lot. but also listed bad PS IPs or not so bads ones that had been bundled a lot.


Again, I'm not the one making the claim that Microsoft had Tonnes of involvement. I was given an example that in my opinion meant nothing. I need evidence to confirm that Microsoft made such huge contributions that lead to the commercial and critical success of the gears franchise. 

Can you think of a big franchise that was created by a microsoft studio other than Forza? 

No, I never said it was the baseline. I'm saying it was announced to have sold 2 million which makes it a success. Despite it's unforgivable launch issues it's actually a really good game aswell. 

Kinect Adventures wasn't just bundles a lot, it came with every 360 with Kinect. It's like counting Knack Japanese sales, it came with every PS4. I'm not going to say Knack is a big successful IP because it sold 300k units day one. I named bad IP's? Like what? Driveclub? Day 1 sure, but now? Some websites have even taken the liberty of re-reviewing it as it's a completely different game http://www.gamesradar.com/driveclub-review/

But please tell me all the bad PS IP I named.



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ArchangelMadzz said:

Again, I'm not the one making the claim that Microsoft had Tonnes of involvement. I was given an example that in my opinion meant nothing. I need evidence to confirm that Microsoft made such huge contributions that lead to the commercial and critical success of the gears franchise. 

I never said they had tonnes of involvement (although clearly, they did) I'm just saying if you want to prove something, you'll need evidence. You can't just say there's no evidence to suggest otherwise.  Commercial? They published and advertised it. Pretty much all they needed to do. Critical? You admitted, Epic games took Microsofts money....soo....

ArchangelMadzz said:

Can you think of a big franchise that was created by a microsoft studio other than Forza? 

So now it's a big franchise, and not just an ip from an internal studio. Just to confirm though, said franchise needs to have bigger commercial presence then Driveclub? And as DC is from a Studio that was purchased, nor built from scratch:

Viva Pinata, Kameo, Kinect Sports, Project Spark, Halo by Bungie, Halo by Ensemble, Halo by 343 , Forza. Kinect Adventures.  Mechwarrior.

ArchangelMadzz said:

Day 1 sure, but now? Some websites have even taken the liberty of re-reviewing it as it's a completely different game http://www.gamesradar.com/driveclub-review/

Well if they wanted a better reception, they clearly should not have released it in that state. Lots of games improve with patches, they don't get re-reviewed. This is the world we live in.

ArchangelMadzz said:

I'm saying it was announced to have sold 2 million which makes it a success.

Unless you can tell us (and prove) the what apportion were bundles, all you can say is that there's 2 million copies in existance. I think Sony wouldn't have decimated the studio if it were successful.

ArchangelMadzz said:

I named bad IP's? Like what? Driveclub? Day 1 sure, but now? Some websites have even taken the liberty of re-reviewing it as it's a completely different game http://www.gamesradar.com/driveclub-review/

But please tell me all the bad PS IP I named.

Driveclub and Killzone.