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Forums - Sony - Legend of Dragoon

Acevil said:
LuckyTrouble said:
Acevil said:
Ruler said:


Well they could make their own kickstarter site and integrading it into the playstation store and ecosystem


I would support that, since it will help out smaller indies as well. However them using kickstarter itself sends a bad message. 

How does confirming consumer interest in the easiest possible way send a bad message? I'm not saying I like the Kickstarter campaign stuff, but at the same time, I get it. It's smart. It's a new way of gauging consumer interest that has been proven to work with other video game projects, two very significantly in just the past month. Kickstarter has proven itself as a viable platform for pitching projects. I get the complaints and fears, but I feel they're relatively unfounded right now. If we start seeing recent AAA title sequels end up in the Kickstarter box, I think some worry is warranted, but that will never happen.


Because a large company doesn't need kickstarter to know consumer interest, they have research abilities and other resources. They are also not strapped for cash on small kickstarter projects. 

You're fixated on the money amount, but it isn't about the money amount. Once a developer backs the project, as has been stated, whatever the project got from the Kickstarter will be a drop in the bucket. There is literally not a more reliable way of gauging consumer interest than by having them prove it with their wallets. I don't think it was possible to know just how much people wanted Shenmue 3, for instance, until the Kickstarter. I mean, I barely even see the series get mentioned, and then suddenly the Kickstarter comes up and people are willing to pour millions in. That beats any estimates a research team would have come up with, I can guarantee, in terms of consumer response to the project.



 

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LuckyTrouble said:
Acevil said:
LuckyTrouble said:
Acevil said:
Ruler said:


Well they could make their own kickstarter site and integrading it into the playstation store and ecosystem


I would support that, since it will help out smaller indies as well. However them using kickstarter itself sends a bad message. 

How does confirming consumer interest in the easiest possible way send a bad message? I'm not saying I like the Kickstarter campaign stuff, but at the same time, I get it. It's smart. It's a new way of gauging consumer interest that has been proven to work with other video game projects, two very significantly in just the past month. Kickstarter has proven itself as a viable platform for pitching projects. I get the complaints and fears, but I feel they're relatively unfounded right now. If we start seeing recent AAA title sequels end up in the Kickstarter box, I think some worry is warranted, but that will never happen.


Because a large company doesn't need kickstarter to know consumer interest, they have research abilities and other resources. They are also not strapped for cash on small kickstarter projects. 

You're fixated on the money amount, but it isn't about the money amount. Once a developer backs the project, as has been stated, whatever the project got from the Kickstarter will be a drop in the bucket. There is literally not a more reliable way of gauging consumer interest than by having them prove it with their wallets. I don't think it was possible to know just how much people wanted Shenmue 3, for instance, until the Kickstarter. I mean, I barely even see the series get mentioned, and then suddenly the Kickstarter comes up and people are willing to pour millions in. That beats any estimates a research team would have come up with, I can guarantee, in terms of consumer response to the project.

Shenmue is a unique beast, and honestly speaking I don't know how to feel about it. Given I don't know the details of the partnership or Sega and Sony involvement. 

Also I said two things, the money is the second. Even if you were to just have kickstarted goal of $1, and just to gage interest (which would be the way I would go about if I was large company and I truly had to do a kickstarter). 

Large companies if they are truly successful ones, do usually have a division designed on knowning demand and the cost of filling out that demand. This is exactly why you have yet to see a large company use a funding website yet. 



 

Cloudman said:
LuckyTrouble said:
Cloudman said:
No guys, don't do it... : ( Is this how you want to get games jumpstarted in the future?

If it can get cult classic titles the attention they deserve, and classic series the modern revival they need, I don't see the problem with it. It's a good way to truly gauge the commitment of gamers to these games. As has been said, anybody can say "I want this game", but it's something else entirely to put your money where your mouth is. Developers speak in dollar signs, not gamer desires.

Rather than ask fans to pitch in money, why don't they just revive old titles like that again? It's been done before with games like Kid Icarus and Tomb Raider. I can't stop you all, but this seems like a slippery slope to go down...


It isn't like the fans are getting nothing for the money they put in.  They usually get a copy of the game for less then it would cost them to buy it normally.  It is essentially a preorder.  There is nothing wrong with using kickstarter to jumpstart old franchises.  



LuckyTrouble said:
Cloudman said:
LuckyTrouble said:
Cloudman said:
No guys, don't do it... : ( Is this how you want to get games jumpstarted in the future?

If it can get cult classic titles the attention they deserve, and classic series the modern revival they need, I don't see the problem with it. It's a good way to truly gauge the commitment of gamers to these games. As has been said, anybody can say "I want this game", but it's something else entirely to put your money where your mouth is. Developers speak in dollar signs, not gamer desires.

Rather than ask fans to pitch in money, why don't they just revive old titles like that again? It's been done before with games like Kid Icarus and Tomb Raider. I can't stop you all, but this seems like a slippery slope to go down...

Revivals are risky. Super risky. Especially if a series has been dormant for a decade or more. Tomb Raider only worked because Uncharted and Far Cry worked. They saw popular styles that could effectively be replicated and hopped on it. That's not a bad thing by any means, but that isn't possible with absolutely everything that could do with a legitimate sequel, remake, or revival.

To me, this isn't a slippery slope. Rather, this is a way to get games we may never see again otherwise. It helps the business side of things figure out the risk versus reward. Everybody groaning about contributing to the funding of the game: you aren't. The way Kickstarter is used, what you're giving, that $2 million or even $5 million is a drop in the bucket compared to what companies like Sony will contribute if the consumer support is there. Kickstarter is effectively a marketing campaign, and a pretty efficient one at that when properly used (see: Bloodstained and Yooka-Laylee).

I agree with what you are saying, but tomb raider is a bad example as it was never a dormant franchise...



gergroy said:
Cloudman said:
LuckyTrouble said:
Cloudman said:
No guys, don't do it... : ( Is this how you want to get games jumpstarted in the future?

If it can get cult classic titles the attention they deserve, and classic series the modern revival they need, I don't see the problem with it. It's a good way to truly gauge the commitment of gamers to these games. As has been said, anybody can say "I want this game", but it's something else entirely to put your money where your mouth is. Developers speak in dollar signs, not gamer desires.

Rather than ask fans to pitch in money, why don't they just revive old titles like that again? It's been done before with games like Kid Icarus and Tomb Raider. I can't stop you all, but this seems like a slippery slope to go down...


It isn't like the fans are getting nothing for the money they put in.  They usually get a copy of the game for less then it would cost them to buy it normally.  It is essentially a preorder.  There is nothing wrong with using kickstarter to jumpstart old franchises.  

Hmm, you do have a point there. Though I am not very fond of the idea of using kickstarter to gauge interest in reviving old IPs. Kickstarter looks like a way for small teams to raise funds for a game they would otherwise would not be able to, and not for companies to test the waters....



 

              

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The Official Art Thread      -      The Official Manga Thread      -      The Official Starbound Thread

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Cloudman said:
gergroy said:
Cloudman said:

Rather than ask fans to pitch in money, why don't they just revive old titles like that again? It's been done before with games like Kid Icarus and Tomb Raider. I can't stop you all, but this seems like a slippery slope to go down...


It isn't like the fans are getting nothing for the money they put in.  They usually get a copy of the game for less then it would cost them to buy it normally.  It is essentially a preorder.  There is nothing wrong with using kickstarter to jumpstart old franchises.  

Hmm, you do have a point there. Though I am not very fond of the idea of using kickstarter to gauge interest in reviving old IPs. Kickstarter looks like a way for small teams to raise funds for a game they would otherwise would not be able to, and not for companies to test the waters....

it not being used for the intended purpose doesn't mean then end result can't still be amazing.  If kickstarter is going to maintain and thrive, then it will need to grow and adapt.  Big companies testing the waters like this will make it even easier for small studios to find funding as more people will be drawn to using kickstarter and funding projects.  There is literally no downside to big companies using kickstarter like this, only positives.



LuckyTrouble said:
Cloudman said:

Rather than ask fans to pitch in money, why don't they just revive old titles like that again? It's been done before with games like Kid Icarus and Tomb Raider. I can't stop you all, but this seems like a slippery slope to go down...

Revivals are risky. Super risky. Especially if a series has been dormant for a decade or more. Tomb Raider only worked because Uncharted and Far Cry worked. They saw popular styles that could effectively be replicated and hopped on it. That's not a bad thing by any means, but that isn't possible with absolutely everything that could do with a legitimate sequel, remake, or revival.

To me, this isn't a slippery slope. Rather, this is a way to get games we may never see again otherwise. It helps the business side of things figure out the risk versus reward. Everybody groaning about contributing to the funding of the game: you aren't. The way Kickstarter is used, what you're giving, that $2 million or even $5 million is a drop in the bucket compared to what companies like Sony will contribute if the consumer support is there. Kickstarter is effectively a marketing campaign, and a pretty efficient one at that when properly used (see: Bloodstained and Yooka-Laylee).

The thing is though, games like yookah-laylee and Mighty No.9 were not games tied to any sort of marketing, but games that the creators just wanted to make, but didn't have a publisher, or didn't want one with risks of altering their vision. Bloodstained was one of them to do this, which sort of cast some suspision with me, but I heard that was mostly for distributing purposes, or something of the sort. Kickstarter as a means to gauge interest is something I don't think I would want to get behind...



 

              

Dance my pretties!

The Official Art Thread      -      The Official Manga Thread      -      The Official Starbound Thread

Acevil said:
So a major company like Sony will use Kickstarter . . .Yep Sony looks like small budget indie company that needs help making games.

Its nonsesne like this that we don't need!

SO how come non of the BIG budget companies didn't fund Shenmue? They've had 15 years. Why didn't Microsoft or Nintendo?



gergroy said:
Cloudman said:
gergroy said:
Cloudman said:

Rather than ask fans to pitch in money, why don't they just revive old titles like that again? It's been done before with games like Kid Icarus and Tomb Raider. I can't stop you all, but this seems like a slippery slope to go down...


It isn't like the fans are getting nothing for the money they put in.  They usually get a copy of the game for less then it would cost them to buy it normally.  It is essentially a preorder.  There is nothing wrong with using kickstarter to jumpstart old franchises.  

Hmm, you do have a point there. Though I am not very fond of the idea of using kickstarter to gauge interest in reviving old IPs. Kickstarter looks like a way for small teams to raise funds for a game they would otherwise would not be able to, and not for companies to test the waters....

it not being used for the intended purpose doesn't mean then end result can't still be amazing.  If kickstarter is going to maintain and thrive, then it will need to grow and adapt.  Big companies testing the waters like this will make it even easier for small studios to find funding as more people will be drawn to using kickstarter and funding projects.  There is literally no downside to big companies using kickstarter like this, only positives.

It seems like a good move for companies, but not for consumers. This seems as if consumers will have to back money into new games or reviving old IPs just for a shot for those games to be made, and with little idea if that game will turn out well or not. It feels more consumers would have to pitch in and hope for the best. I don't really like that idea...



 

              

Dance my pretties!

The Official Art Thread      -      The Official Manga Thread      -      The Official Starbound Thread

Ashadian said:
Acevil said:
So a major company like Sony will use Kickstarter . . .Yep Sony looks like small budget indie company that needs help making games.

Its nonsesne like this that we don't need!

SO how come non of the BIG budget companies didn't fund Shenmue? They've had 15 years. Why didn't Microsoft or Nintendo?

Sorry? I was talking about Legend of Dragoon not Shenmue. One is a Sony IP and the other isn't.