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Forums - Politics Discussion - Are You Pro Or Anti-Abortion?

eva01beserk on 25 May 2015
DonFerrari said:
eva01beserk said:

Dont think anybody ever claim that.  There should always be consequenses. But there are thigs that are out of our hands, even using protection pregnancy can happen. Driving safely can also involve you on an accident. A war will still kille inocent civilians. But if there is a chance some thiings can be avoided and we can learn from our mistakes withought sufering cripeling consequenses then thats fine too.

Agree with you in all 3 cases.

On the first, a child is not a disease nor the end of the world so there is no necessity to kill it because contraception didn't work (and several times it was badly done or absent but the person won't accept the guilty... but in the case of my family I was born from a 2 days without pill, but brother was from intra-uterin dispositve we call DIU in brazil, my niece from clipped tromps, etc... none were aborted), all very happy and functional.

2. if you drive safely it's accident, if you are imprudent it isn't.

3. Yes, unfortunately sometimes the idiocity of others bring harms to inocent (like aborting, use of drugs that affect others because of accident drug war, etc)

I still can't see how crippling a real conception is... if someone says having 10 child is problematic, I'll agree, but the option was to abort 10? If you have no parents and still got pregnant and claim no support, well there were several issues before the pregnancy itself.

 A child could very well be worst than a disease if your unprepared for it. It dosent just mess up a kids life but also the paretns. Some people cant even handle one kid.



It takes genuine talent to see greatness in yourself despite your absence of genuine talent.

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DonFerrari on 25 May 2015
ArchangelMadzz said:
DonFerrari said:

You were very disrespectful on 2 occasions on calling me ineducated on the matter and talking shovel. So yes you regard yourself superior.

Yes there were cases of less than 22 weeks, so your argument that life is just after 24 weeks because that is when it can live in the outside world is lost or should retract (and keep retracting while science advances to support birth at even younger age). There is no such thing as not suffering at all from 80 years smoking, you can say they hadn't cancer or anything like that, but show a clean lungue from someone that smoke for 80 years (really smoked, not one cigar every blue moon). And cigars only affect the idiot smoking, so it's a completely different matter.


Ineducated on the matter of abortion based on your descriptions which is a justifiable observation doesn't mean I regard myself as superior to you. That would require far more testing ;) I kid but you see my point.


You fail to understand, I said it's around 24 weeks, biology isn't set in stone. If I say, girls reach puberty at around the age 11 and a girl reaches it at 5 doesn't mean that I should say girls reach puberty at around the age of 5.

Fetus' develop at different rates , 24 weeks isn't said because it HAS to be 24 weeks it just means it's reached its independant state of development. Which USUALLY takes 24 weeks. If it reaches it at 22 weeks it is LIFE. 

But you knew that, you just felt like making a point right?

If you say the body reaches puberty when it have determined body chemistry and hormones, the age wouldn't mater and you would be probably right. Althought emotionaly and psicologically you would be probably wrong.

Because you said science have proven it's around 24. And I said science is often changing... and defining life at that pointing a age or situation isn't proving, is defining. You can't prove 1+1=2, you define it... so no I won't accept science proved life is only when it reaches independent state, if that was the case you would only  be able to say that it's after it's born...

But anyway I said my point, for me it's murder on any situation, but it's the parents choice to do so.



duduspace11 "Well, since we are estimating costs, Pokemon Red/Blue did cost Nintendo about $50m to make back in 1996"

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=8808363

Mr Puggsly: "Hehe, I said good profit. You said big profit. Frankly, not losing money is what I meant by good. Don't get hung up on semantics"

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=9008994

Azzanation: "PS5 wouldn't sold out at launch without scalpers."

eva01beserk on 25 May 2015
DonFerrari said:
eva01beserk said:

Thats if you consider it murder. But this fetus is not alive yet. You are depriving a future kid a life, but thats almost the same as saying masturbation is mass murder cuz it could had been a million babys.

The entire human nature is finding the easy way out on life. Does not mean that you have to face either the easy way or the hard way, if its a choice not harming anyone else, then by all means I will choose the easy way out.


That is only not harming another being because you chose to decide a fetus isn't a life.

sperm isn't life, it lacks half the DNA of a human being.

Its not me deciding, science has decided that after a certain time it is life. In some parts the goverment has also decided that is also not a life. Again this is where people keep saying that choice comes in. Not forcing anybody to belive like I am, but people like you are trying to force your belive on others.



It takes genuine talent to see greatness in yourself despite your absence of genuine talent.

DonFerrari on 25 May 2015
ArchangelMadzz said:
DonFerrari said:

Your first post on drugs were like people accidentely get addicted and shouldn't be burden by it... but now that you voiced it better I'm ok with it.


My first post literally said " I don't understand putting heroin addicts in prison and turning them into hard criminals when they leave instead of just giving them help because addiction fucking sucks and no one chooses addiction?"

That's the same thing what I said above?


first, you were saying against the consequence (not limiting that you are only against prison) and second you say no one chooses addiction, when you try something with like 90% of addiction potential, you are very much choosing to be addicted.



duduspace11 "Well, since we are estimating costs, Pokemon Red/Blue did cost Nintendo about $50m to make back in 1996"

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=8808363

Mr Puggsly: "Hehe, I said good profit. You said big profit. Frankly, not losing money is what I meant by good. Don't get hung up on semantics"

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=9008994

Azzanation: "PS5 wouldn't sold out at launch without scalpers."

ArchangelMadzz on 25 May 2015

I'd love to see the pro life gentleman destroy their body for 9 months for a child they don't want, go through 20 hours of extreme pain to just give it away because it's immoral to terminate a small collection of cells.



There's only 2 races: White and 'Political Agenda'
2 Genders: Male and 'Political Agenda'
2 Hairstyles for female characters: Long and 'Political Agenda'
2 Sexualities: Straight and 'Political Agenda'

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DonFerrari on 25 May 2015
eva01beserk said:
DonFerrari said:

Agree with you in all 3 cases.

On the first, a child is not a disease nor the end of the world so there is no necessity to kill it because contraception didn't work (and several times it was badly done or absent but the person won't accept the guilty... but in the case of my family I was born from a 2 days without pill, but brother was from intra-uterin dispositve we call DIU in brazil, my niece from clipped tromps, etc... none were aborted), all very happy and functional.

2. if you drive safely it's accident, if you are imprudent it isn't.

3. Yes, unfortunately sometimes the idiocity of others bring harms to inocent (like aborting, use of drugs that affect others because of accident drug war, etc)

I still can't see how crippling a real conception is... if someone says having 10 child is problematic, I'll agree, but the option was to abort 10? If you have no parents and still got pregnant and claim no support, well there were several issues before the pregnancy itself.

 A child could very well be worst than a disease if your unprepared for it. It dosent just mess up a kids life but also the paretns. Some people cant even handle one kid.


Not very good to think a child is worst than a disease man. If you can't handle a kid you shouldn't be having sex.



duduspace11 "Well, since we are estimating costs, Pokemon Red/Blue did cost Nintendo about $50m to make back in 1996"

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=8808363

Mr Puggsly: "Hehe, I said good profit. You said big profit. Frankly, not losing money is what I meant by good. Don't get hung up on semantics"

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=9008994

Azzanation: "PS5 wouldn't sold out at launch without scalpers."

ArchangelMadzz on 25 May 2015
DonFerrari said:
ArchangelMadzz said:


My first post literally said " I don't understand putting heroin addicts in prison and turning them into hard criminals when they leave instead of just giving them help because addiction fucking sucks and no one chooses addiction?"

That's the same thing what I said above?


first, you were saying against the consequence (not limiting that you are only against prison) and second you say no one chooses addiction, when you try something with like 90% of addiction potential, you are very much choosing to be addicted.


I never mentioned anything other than prison? If I say "I don't like putting people in prison for X" then I'm only talking about X. 

We're literally having this conversation again, people are stupid and don't think they will.



There's only 2 races: White and 'Political Agenda'
2 Genders: Male and 'Political Agenda'
2 Hairstyles for female characters: Long and 'Political Agenda'
2 Sexualities: Straight and 'Political Agenda'

ArchangelMadzz on 25 May 2015
DonFerrari said:
eva01beserk said:

 A child could very well be worst than a disease if your unprepared for it. It dosent just mess up a kids life but also the paretns. Some people cant even handle one kid.


Not very good to think a child is worst than a disease man. If you can't handle a kid you shouldn't be having sex.


If you can't handle a plane crash you shouldn't go on holiday.



There's only 2 races: White and 'Political Agenda'
2 Genders: Male and 'Political Agenda'
2 Hairstyles for female characters: Long and 'Political Agenda'
2 Sexualities: Straight and 'Political Agenda'

DonFerrari on 25 May 2015
eva01beserk said:
DonFerrari said:


That is only not harming another being because you chose to decide a fetus isn't a life.

sperm isn't life, it lacks half the DNA of a human being.

Its not me deciding, science has decided that after a certain time it is life. In some parts the goverment has also decided that is also not a life. Again this is where people keep saying that choice comes in. Not forcing anybody to belive like I am, but people like you are trying to force your belive on others.


Science or government definition doesn't mean proof, just definition.

Which view have I forced? That people should be able to decide what to do, a rigid control must be existent so abuses are prevented and both parents must have equal rights (unless it is rape)... how horrible of me right?

Will you allow me to believe a murder is a murder even if it's one I don't think should be prosecuted, punished or humiliating the parents? Or that is too much to ask?



duduspace11 "Well, since we are estimating costs, Pokemon Red/Blue did cost Nintendo about $50m to make back in 1996"

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=8808363

Mr Puggsly: "Hehe, I said good profit. You said big profit. Frankly, not losing money is what I meant by good. Don't get hung up on semantics"

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=9008994

Azzanation: "PS5 wouldn't sold out at launch without scalpers."

SanAndreasX on 25 May 2015
eva01beserk said:
SanAndreasX said:


Sorry, but when your biological involvement is 5-25 minutes with no medical risk, compared to 9 months will 100% of the medical risk for the other party, you don't exactly have a strong leg to stand on. The man wasn't "forced" in either situation.  Medical risk trumps financial risk in this case.

So the entire life of the baby only invoves the 9 months in the mothers woumb? We have to think what also happens after the kid is born and the father is almost as involve in raising a kid as the mother. The life people keep claiming thats being denied with an abortin starts after the baby is born and the father is a prime member of the family. A family could be good without one, but as studies show, its not recomended.

I was talking about the fact that only the woman carries the baby, and the woman assumes 100% of the risk for pre-eclampsia/eclampsia, gestational diabetes, pregnancy-induced hypertension, hyperemesis gravidarium, and a host of other medical problems, while the man's biological involvement in a pregnancy ends with "oh baby I'm gonna COME!" and he assumes zero risk of the medical problems I just listed. For the record I'm all for the dad being involved in raising a baby once it's born. I raised two girls myself.

Also for the record, I would never have an abortion. That is a meaningless sentiment as I am male. Neither would my wife. She chose to carry to term. I am not about to use the bludgeon of the law to make that choice for a pregnant woman, and neither is she.