By using this site, you agree to our Privacy Policy and our Terms of Use. Close

Forums - Nintendo - When will Bayonetta 2 hit a million? Weighing the risk vs the reward.

RolStoppable said:
vivster said:

Well the unknown component here are the console companies. No one can predict how long they will be willing to pay for low selling IPs. The chances of Platnim having steady work in the next 7 years and them getting shut down and bought up in the next 2 years is 50/50.

If they do get bought up I believe a lot of the employees will keept heir jobs and we will see a number of their franchises to be continued. So really the employees of Platinum do not have much risk. It's not them who are losing money.

The problem with your line of logic is that publishers can already dictate what Platinum Games makes. So if the point comes where no company wants to invest in them anymore, then there will also be nobody to buy them up because there's zero point in buying a studio and permanently pay its employees when you have the option to pay them only for as long as it takes them to finish one game.

So if nobody wants to fund Platinum Games titles anymore, then the studio either has to turn to mobile or shut down altogether.

I'm sure there are assets worth purchasing. And it's not like Platinum has unskilled developers either to scoop up.

Shutting down means in most cases being bought up. Look at Sony and MS. There are worse developers they picked up fulltime^^



If you demand respect or gratitude for your volunteer work, you're doing volunteering wrong.

Around the Network
the_dengle said:
S.T.A.G.E. said:

If two million in sales isn't enough for Sega...then how is 450k good enough for Nintendo when Bayonetta 2 obviously had a much larger budget?

Citation needed? Bayonetta 1 had an almost 3-year development period across two platforms. Bayonetta 2 was developed in close to two years for a single platform. Being first-party, Nintendo also gets a slightly larger slice of the profits with Bayo 2 than Sega got with either version of Bayo 1. And, of course, Bayo 1 was made from scratch while Bayo 2 had existing assets to pull from.

I wouldn't be surprised if Bayo 2 was less expensive to make than the first game.

Oh, and while I don't have access to the price history of Bayo 1, I'd take a wild guess that Bayo 2 will stay at full price longer than the first game did.


Citation needed for what specifically? This an opinion piece based on the numbers we have on this site and also a request for other opinions on the situation. I don't know if Bayonetta 2 was made in two years. Bayonetta 2 was revealed in 2012..which means...it was most likely in development since 2011 which still means...three years. Also, Bayonetta is not first party...it is a comissioned second party. Nintendo does not own the IP nor do they own Platinum Games. Sega still owns Bayonetta, but they are allowing Nintendo to publish the second game. They are being compensated by Nintendo, just like Platinum is for developing the title. 

Bayo 2 from the looks it seems like more developmental cost went into it, seeing that it was revealed only two years after Bayonetta 1 was released. Also Nintendo is a more capable publisher than Sega was...but the problem is...the title being exclusive to a platform the inadvertantly sabotaged for non-first party. 

Speaking of capable publishers, Microsoft is also publishing a Platinum title in Scalebound. That game is most likely going to be Platinums biggest yet with Microsoft dollars behind it. Difference between Microsoft and Nintendo is...if the game doesn't profit it doesn't get a sequel...because even though MS has more money than Nintendo......they dont play with money.



RolStoppable said:
S.T.A.G.E. said:

(...)

If two million in sales isn't enough for Sega...then how is 450k good enough for Nintendo when Bayonetta 2 obviously had a much larger budget?

First off, you need to consider how those two million came to be:

1. The game quickly landed in the bargain bin, attaining most of its sales at a low to very low price.
2. Unless Sega has provided shipment numbers at some point, we can't really be sure if VGC's numbers are even remotely correct. Games that do not chart on trackers like NPD and GfK led historically to a high margin of error for VGC's tracking.

Leaving that aside though, it's pretty clear that Bayonetta 2 is a flop. For the sake of argument and using simple numbers, let's say Nintendo loses $10m on Bayonetta 2. That's a small one-time loss for a company as big as Nintendo and as such it doesn't carry any weight for Nintendo as a whole; the only consequence is that Nintendo won't fund another Platinum Games title in the future.

In Sega's case the reason they shied away from making a sequel is not because they didn't make a profit , but more to do with with  answers to questions like  is it capable of becoming a franchise , would we be better placed spending the money elsewhere , of the total sales what percentage was sold at full retail and how does this compare with other games that had good  onward growth , what kind of sales does this genre generate and is it in decline or on the upswing , these types of questions and the Ip not being owned come into play.

In todays climate it's all about building mega franchises and even if you have a nice profitable game that sells a million or two , questions will be asked about why it didn't sell more and why isn't it capable of being like AC , COD ,  GTA etc , it happened with tombraider where they projected 5million plus sales on a franchise that historically sold half that , and it was seen has some kind of failure not on the profit's it made but on the projected profits it didn't.



Research shows Video games  help make you smarter, so why am I an idiot

IT's pretty normal for the big three to publish games that aren't profitable. I believe Sony said a while back that 7 of 10 games they publish don't break even.



Teeqoz said:
IT's pretty normal for the big three to publish games that aren't profitable. I believe Sony said a while back that 7 of 10 games they publish don't break even.


Yes..but some learn quicker than others that certain developers titles dont profit on their platform. I know how Nintendo can fix it...but paying for exclusives isn't it. If it is about perception to them, then they need to change the perception legitimately.



Around the Network
S.T.A.G.E. said:
Teeqoz said:
IT's pretty normal for the big three to publish games that aren't profitable. I believe Sony said a while back that 7 of 10 games they publish don't break even.


Yes..but some learn quicker than others that certain developers titles dont profit on their platform. I know how Nintendo can fix it...but paying for exclusives isn't it. If it is about perception to them, then they need to change the perception legitimately.


I think you're trying to make something that isn't a problem into a problem.

All of the big three will keep on funding games that won't break even. It's a way to build up an attractive library. The loss they get from those is easily made back by the big titles that make a lot of money (Uncharted, God of War, Gran Turismo, TLOU for Sony,    Halo, Gears of War, Forza for MS,    Zelda, Pokemon, Marios, Mario Kart, SSB for Nintendo.)

 

It's a strategy that will continue for a long time.



I kind of doubt it is going to make a million, although it has still done rather well on the console considering the console is at roughly 8 million and it has sold just under half a million. I'm not really sure what people expected of this game, it doesn't have a very broad appeal. By Nintendo encouraging games like this on the platform, it will encourage more people that like these kinds of games to get the platform, especially when they are exclusive. If they didn't encourage this, it would pidgeon hole them into only a certain genre and demographic. Many people try to encourage that enough without Nintendo doing it to themselves. The idea of a business is to always try to expand their customer base, not cut more out of it. 



Gotta figure out how to set these up lol.

I'm confident that it will reach 1m, or at least get relatively close, by the end of the generation. Even though Bayo 2 is a niche game, the Wii U is a niche console, so almost everyone who buys one has researched the games on the platform. Bayonetta 2 is a highly publicized and critically acclaimed game for the U, so I don't think it will be overlooked by too many people.

Of course, that's just speculation. Bayonetta 1 sold barely 2 million with a combined install base of over 160m, so it's hard to tell how the sequel will ultimately perform in comparison. I think 800k+ will ultimately be a success for both Platinum and Nintendo.



Official Tokyo Mirage Sessions #FE Thread

                                      

I dont think it will ever hit a million. VGC has it at 450k, lets hope it can even hit 500k.



I doubt it, its not even at half a million yet. Shame really, but I should get it. Anything that gets a 10/10 from Edge is a must buy



Xbox Series, PS5 and Switch (+ Many Retro Consoles)

'When the people are being beaten with a stick, they are not much happier if it is called the people's stick'- Mikhail Bakunin

Prediction: Switch 2 will outsell the PS5 by 2030