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Forums - Gaming Discussion - Gen 9 powerwise: how will it be?

fatslob-:O on 22 December 2014

jonathanalis said:

So i im starting to agreeing with DerpSandwich, and also JustBeingReal. This gen will last until 2022+, and the jump will be massive due the new technologies.Nintendo would release a console at 17/18, but will be powered near to ps4 power.

Doubt it, unless ofcourse Nintendo wants to deal with a $599 or higher price tag like the PS3 did ...



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fatslob-:O on 22 December 2014

As per everything itself, I expect that the new consoles will get a minimum of 64GB and be above 15+ Tflops ...



JustBeingReal on 22 December 2014
Hiku said:
JustBeingReal said:

Universal Memory is right around the corner, next year there is a company that will begin production of this tech and it's basically an SSD that can be used like RAM, fast access comparable to GDDR5, with all the benefits of big storage, so capacity by 2018/19 will be ridiculously huge compared to what it is now, forget 128GB, we're talking Terabytes worth of accessible memory, even if the platform holders limit how much is useable by devs they could easily have 512GBs just for game use, not that they'd need it, but he options will be there.

But then like SSD's, this new memory will deteroirate in the same way? In that entire blocks have to be erased every time you write something to it, even if that data is smaller than the block size. And the more you keep erasing and writing, it starts to deteriorate and becomes slower, or even unusuable.
SSD's work well for harddrives when you only use them for the operative system and apps, and don't constantly save other smaller files on it. But I can imagine that as RAM it would be quite busy performing a lot of erasing and writing all the time.
Haven't read about this, but that makes me wonder how viable this will be.


Crossbar's RRAM is apparently 10X better than NAND for endurance, although with further development Crossbar says it's possible to achieve 100X that, while it's a long ways off of DRAM, it's a lot better than the current best SSD technologies. Apparently it can be made in the same facilities as NAND is currently and Crossbar has already secured $50M in funding and are apparently only one stage away from production.

As for the way it writes I think it's a lot more specific, not dealt with in blocks, it's Byte addressable.

Here's a link to a recent article about the technology:

http://www.theregister.co.uk/2014/12/18/crossbar_jumps_over_higher_rram_bar/



regin2005 on 22 December 2014

Wow, already giving up on gen 8, huh?



Generation 8 Predictions so far.....(as of 9/2013)

Console that will sell most: Nintendo Wii U

Who will sell more consoles between Microsoft/SONY: SONY

 

aLkaLiNE on 22 December 2014
JustBeingReal said:
jonathanalis said:

Hello!

I was wandering how will be the power of the 9th gen consoles, PS5 and Xbox 2. And we have to considers things like:

-We have always seen almost the same size of jumps to the next gen: 8x to 16x more memory, more and more processors power, teraflops, etc. Always folowing the moore law.

-But, meanwhile( and because of that), games are becaming each time more and more expensive to develop.

-Other thing to consider is that we are reaching visuals almost as rich as the real life! at some moment, someday, more power wont lead to more realistic visuals than we will achieve.

-And we are reaching a bottle neck in the size of transistors, using silicon, we wont be able to keep the same proportion of hardware power increase and proce drop due the transistor size limitation. So, soon we can throw moore law away. But it is starting.

Considering all these statements, how do you think that will be the ps5 and xbox 2 specs? we can expect 128 Gb ram memory consoles? one of the components wont be able to improve to follow the other?if so,what will be the bottle neck, the processor, bandwidth? If the jump wont be as bigger as we expect, it can help nintendo(that usually dont go full specs)?

I would really like hardware experts opinions.


Universal Memory is right around the corner, next year there is a company that will begin production of this tech and it's basically an SSD that can be used like RAM, fast access comparable to GDDR5, with all the benefits of big storage, so capacity by 2018/19 will be ridiculously huge compared to what it is now, forget 128GB, we're talking Terabytes worth of accessible memory, even if the platform holders limit how much is useable by devs they could easily have 512GBs just for game use, not that they'd need it, but he options will be there.

For VRAM there will also be HBM built onto the AMD APU die, likely a few GBs connected using an interposer and bandwidth for that could be several TB/s.

 

A stage of memory usage will be gone, so latency improves massively.

If we stay at 200 watts then CPU and GPU performance will jump up like it has in past generations, so 20X the power of the current platforms is feasible, but having Universal Memory means even more of that extra performance is usable and less is wasted.

We end up having fewer bottlenecks because of Universal Memory.

 

IMO the jump will be pretty huge, 4K will be useable for sure, 120FPS too, huge improvements in image quality, a very likely night and day jump beyond what we'll be seeing by the end of this generation.


I like this guy. Make that Sony. Make it dammit!



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JustBeingReal on 22 December 2014
jonathanalis said:
one think is what is possible to do, and other is what they would do.
here in brazil, there is no need for 4k displays, not even 1080p.Now the TVs are starting to show HD images, only netflix uses 1080p.
If 4k TVs wont be popularized in the next gen times, they wont deliver 4k on consoles. But it that happens, there will be no need for a generation leap.
So i im starting to agreeing with DerpSandwich, and also JustBeingReal. This gen will last until 2022+, and the jump will be massive due the new technologies.Nintendo would release a console at 17/18, but will be powered near to ps4 power.

I never said this generation would last until 2022, it won't because there won't be a need for that to happen, AMD's Zen CPU core tech comes in early 2016, along with a new smaller mobile core, they're stacking High Bandwidth Memory on their R9 390X GPU's die in 2015 and Crossbar can go into production with their RRAM tech in late 2015.

3 years from now this technology will have evolved, making vast improvements and actually become very mature.

Nintendo can very well be the first platform holder to use it in 2018, with it being cost effective and their system would be much more powerful than PS4.



garretslarrity on 22 December 2014

I am shocked to see some people saying 1080p60fps is to be expected from gen 9 systems. We should expect far more than that! 1080/60 was achieved way back in gen 7! This is gen 9 we're talking about! I can understand if you don't think 4k at 60 fps will be the standard, but I think it's safe to say that the ninth gen systems will be able to produce resolutions above 1080p.



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tripenfall on 23 December 2014
platformmaster918 said:
tripenfall said:
Its very difficult to predict, as Sony and Microsoft will be probably hoping for a 6-7 year cycle with their current consoles, making it 2019-2020 before the new tech arrives. Nintendo however favour a 5-6 year cycle and are 2 years along so they may release new hardware in 2017-2018. This will be very interesting if this happens. Even the big N realizes that the main obstacle that they currently face with 3rd party support is the fact that PS4/PC/Xbone games cant be easily ported over to Wii U and devs don't want to take the risk.
Could it be that Nintendo launch something significantly more powerful than Sony/Microsoft 2 years before the competition are ready to upgrade?
If you really want to know what the next consoles will perform like look to what the very best PC's are doing today and that's about right.
One things for sure, if I have to endure a 3rd generation in a row where 1080p/60fps isn't standard I am going to shit a chicken.

isn't this the 8th straight gen where 1080p 60fps isn't the standard?

ha ha! I still remember PS3 promising 1080HD visuals so PS5 had better deliver. As for 4K, no chance IMO



AZWification on 23 December 2014

Oh, come on! The 8th gen has barely started! I think it's a bit early to make these threads..



                
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Squeezol on 23 December 2014
garretslarrity said:
I am shocked to see some people saying 1080p60fps is to be expected from gen 9 systems. We should expect far more than that! 1080/60 was achieved way back in gen 7! This is gen 9 we're talking about! I can understand if you don't think 4k at 60 fps will be the standard, but I think it's safe to say that the ninth gen systems will be able to produce resolutions above 1080p.

They will be able to produce them, yes, but the question is if the developers want to sacrifice resolution for better graphics just like this gen.