By using this site, you agree to our Privacy Policy and our Terms of Use. Close

Forums - Sales Discussion - PS4's total software sales surpass those of Wii U

 

Cool! 326 73.26%
 
Not cool... 119 26.74%
 
Total:445
DarkRPGamer007 said:
Kerotan said:
DarkRPGamer007 said:
Kerotan said:
DarkRPGamer007 said:
Well PS4 also has a large amount of games, whereas Wii U has games by Nintendo selling, and occasionally a Sonic or Skylanders game that sells well


have we not been told for the last 10 months that the PS4 and X1 have no games? Which is it lol 

They do have games, none worth buying a console for though other than inFamous and maybe Titanfall. What's the point of upgrading when everything is practically the same on your last gen console?

i disagree. i've a big game library and play it every single day. this xmas i won't be getting all the games i like because i'm getting enough as it is. 

edit: the wii u to most people has no games worth getting it for. hench why people are not buying it in big numbers. if i was to generalize and say which has no games i'd say the wii u. just depends what you're into and it just so happens most people are into the nice games library the ps4/x1 has and will continue to have. 

I respect your opinion but seriously everything on the PS4 is just a prettier version of a PS360 game. But even if you buy a PS4 it makes more sense than an XB1. The console performs worse than PS4 and has no exclusives yet it still seems to be doing good. Wii U has some killer games like Mario Kart 8, Pikmin 3, 3D World, WindWaker HD, and even more to look forward to.

obviously not otherwise those systems wouldnt be blowing WIi U out the water



Around the Network

i love how some people are trying to spin it. Whats funny is they arent making WIi U look better in some cases they are actually making it look worse



Dr.Henry_Killinger said:
QuintonMcLeod said:

I'll reply to what you've bolded. The rest is just your honest opinion. 

1) What do you suppose Nintendo should do besides pay off 3rd parties? This was my original question that no one could answer outside of "pay them"

2) You're not spouting facts, I know that.

3) I can admit Nintendo's mistakes. I do so all the time. I think you have me confused for somebody else.  First off, the Wii U is a horrible name for the console. Nintendo dropped the ball by not releasing a steady stream of software for their system, they constantly gave preferable treatment to the 3DS over the Wii U, even though they KNEW the Wii U was struggling. Nintendo hardly ever advertised their games. In fact, they had to lose money for them to realize that they needed to advertise their games. I can go on and on and on.

4) Nintendo is already addressing the problem. Its just a shame it took so long for them to do so.

5) Cheerleading? You're confusing me for somebody else.

The difference between opinion and fact is that fact is a provable statement irregardless of its truth value. An opinion is not provable because it is subjective.  So whether or not investing in 3rd parties is good for buisness is subjective. However, it is a fact that money that is not used to purchase more capital or in other words invest does not and cannot contribute to the continued profit of an entity. Once, it is cashed, it is out of the system.

As for 1). Nintendo is at fault for putting them in this situation. They didn't invest in software, they didn't invest in userbase, they didn't invest in relations, so they have no choice but to invest directly. The Wii was in the exact same situation as the Wii U with the sole difference being that its userbase was strong enough to convince 3rd parties to even try.

2. It doesn't matter what you know or beleive, that's what constitutes a fact. A fact is a fact because it is objective, not because it might be true or false. And FYI, my facts are true. 

3. You seem to think that I give a damn about any other activity on this forum outside of this thread. I don't. I'm addressing you not anyone else. I do not care what you personally believe about the Wii U. I do not care that you have the opinion that PS4 only has more software sales because Sony was willing to sell more. What I disagree with is you attempting to use "factual evidence" to show how investing in 3rd parties constitues a loss greater than the gain, which is completely untrue. Also making further allegations, that Sony and Microsoft are paying for access to 3rd parties, and this is partly the reason why Wii U is lacking in that department, despite the fact that this is completely unsubstantiated at best and "Some sort of sick wishful thinking" at worst.

4. Notice, I have never accused Nintendo of not addressing the problem, at least in this thread. Which should be and is the only scope, I am considering in this discussion. I am addressing you, and I am responding to you, because this " Well, a business exists to make money, does it not? If Nintendo is paying off exclusives, they aren't making money. Both Sony and Microsoft can attest to this." is an extremely naive way of understanding how any buisness operates, and upon further thought completely wrong and biased interpretation of the situation. Buisness do not create Money out of thin air.

5. To continue off of 4, the statement: " Well, a business exists to make money, does it not? If Nintendo is paying off exclusives, they aren't making money. Both Sony and Microsoft can attest to this."

Is clearly biased and cheerleading for Nintendo. Let me explain how.

The first preposition "a business exists to make money" is a self affirming proposition citing a colloqualism that is not a fact but an opinion. It is an opinion because it is subjective. From person A's point of view, it might be the case that it holds true, but person A can rationally argue that the formation of a buisness was for another reason entirely. Some buisness exist to hold money, some to save money, launder funds, transport resources, consolidate other entities (such as holding companies), etc. Thus this proposition that you have based your statement on can be both true and false, therefore its not a fact.

The following bi-conditional: "If Nintendo is paying off exclusives, {then}they aren't making money. " or in other words p -> q, where p is the hypothesis, the condition of Nintendo paying off exclusives, and q is the conclusion, money being lost, is riddled with subjective undefined terms.

What is "paying off exclusives" defined as? Can you rationally prove that for instance providing finacial support to Platinum in their development of Bayonetta 2 is not paying off exclusives? No, you can't because finacial support was provided and exclusive support was returned. This means there is already one counterexample, which already renders the antecdent/hypothesis false.

"they aren't making money. " assumes that any loss is equivalent to overall loss. This is also false because loss does not include profit while overall loss does namely: l(q) =/= f(q), f(q) == p(q), where l(q) is any arbitrary loss of the subset of Expenses, f(q) is overall loss and p(q) is actual profit. Notice overall loss is equivalent to profit, they are the same thing. Which means your conclusion is also false.

Hell we can also disprove it by contradiction:

Assume your proposition is true that "If Nintendo is paying off exclusives, {then}they aren't making money. ", essentially says if money is lost, then money is not gained. Consider that employee buys a 5$ coffee from Starbucks causing the company to suffer a 5$ expense. Therefore, the company makes no profit because it has a loss. In reality, whether or not the company profits or not is unrelated to the 5$ coffee expense.

Lastly, the statement "Both Sony and Microsoft can attest to this." assumes the former reasoning to imply the conclusion that Sony and Microsoft are not making money, because they have expenses {paying off exclusives} or rather the contrapositive of the statement p -> q, which is !q -> !p read as not Q implies not P. 

Not only that but you are completely ignoring, the fact that Nintendo has at least one occurence of doing the exact same thing you seem to chastise its competitors for doing. This is biased, because you are treating Nintendo differently then the other two companies for whatever reason.

Realize, that yes these are different companies, but they are all amoral because they are companies, an downplaying an objective fact such as the title, by suggesting a false biased claim that the various reasons such a fact is true is because money was lost to do so is ridiculous.

1) No one is debating that. You were suggesting that paying off 3rd parties is a way to invest in increased capital. Yes, it's an option, but it's not a profitable one. You disagree. Great! That's your opinion.

 

2) (you mark this as #1) Yes, it's Nintendo's fault for the situation they're in now with the Wii U. Throwing money at 3rd parties won't help their situation any.

 

3) LOL. No. Screaming that what you're saying is fact, doesn't make it any more of a fact nor any less of your opinion. If it's a fact, you present evidence. This is how it works, kiddo.

 

4) You seem to think you understand my opinion on topics that exist outside of this thread, and you do not. A lot of what you're saying are just assumptions. Also, you keep saying my opinion is untrue, but you do not provide sources which could back up your claims. I shared an opinion that Iwata from Nintendo also shares. I've also provided data that showcased Sony's money draining problem. You've presented nothing. At least my claims aren't unsubstantiated as yours.

 

5) You got off subject here. You said, "And regardless of what you think, the fact is "PS4's total software sales surpass those of the Wii U", there is no rationale way one could concieve this as a good thing for the Wii U. Rather than defending the Wii U by saying oh, they are doing buisness better because they are keeping their investments low, you could address the problem." But this was something I've already addressed, so I felt the need to also explain that Nintendo is also addressing these problems both you and I can see. Then you started talking about how businesses work and something about not being able to make money out of thin air. This is a strawman that no one has argued. I suppose this further displays how much you don't understand.

 

6) (this would your #5) How is "A business exists to make money" colloqualism? If you want to be technical, then Nintendo is a corporation, and a corporation (such as Nintendo) is in the business of making money. They provide a service or product in exchange of revenue. Most corporations in a capitialist society operate this way. This isn't an opinion. It's a fact:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Corporation

 

7) The paying off exclusives bit is a bit much for you. This isn't a very hard concept to understand, and it doesn't require to you pull out a calculator (lol). Besides, you can't just assign mathematical values to a statement that you do not understand nor agree with. Listen, Nintendo refuses to give financial incentives to 3rd parties, because it means Nintendo gains less money. Investing in a game without first knowing whether that game will sell is akin to gambling. That business model is simply not sustainable. This is pretty plain to see if you take a look at how the competition is fairing. They are not posting profits. You could argue that the Playstation division is earning a profit (and I have doubts about the numbers Sony presents), but Sony as a whole is losing billions upon billions of dollars every year.

 

The rest of what you're saying is silly and you wasted your time writing it.



Mods are refusing to do something about quinton and his derailing of this topic. Just look at those walls of text!!



Dr.Henry_Killinger said:




I am Torgo, I take care of the place while the master is away.

"Hes the clown that makes the dark side fun.. Torgo!"

Ha.. i won my bet, but i wasnt around to gloat because im on a better forum!  See ya guys on Viz

Around the Network
bubblegamer said:
Mods are refusing to do something about quinton and his derailing of this topic. Just look at those walls of text!!


What are you talking about? We're still on topic.



Conina said:

If these minor adjustments count as "changes in the game mechanics", then inFamous: Second Son (totally different "powers"), Dead Rising 3 (more open world, changed focus to more use of vehicles), and most other third or first party game have them too.


I didn't argue against other games at any point in this, so why are you bringing that up? I was clarifying that the currently releases have had mechanics added or revamped, there's, afterall, only so many ways to change a racer before it stops being a racer. I think the usual problem levied against things like I:SS is that, compared to its predecessors, its simply inferior in many ways: broken good/evil system, criminally short, and repetitive, for example. In this sort of scenario, even with changed up mechanics, one could argue for style over substances, and pushing the "new coat of paint" over gameplay.



Vena said:
Conina said:

If these minor adjustments count as "changes in the game mechanics", then inFamous: Second Son (totally different "powers"), Dead Rising 3 (more open world, changed focus to more use of vehicles), and most other third or first party game have them too.


I didn't argue against other games at any point in this, so why are you bringing that up?

DarkRPGamer started this part of the discussion with "... seriously everything on the PS4 is just a prettier version of a PS360 game."

I'm pretty sure you are aware of that claim.



QuintonMcLeod said:
bubblegamer said:
Mods are refusing to do something about quinton and his derailing of this topic. Just look at those walls of text!!


What are you talking about? We're still on topic.

Preaching is not the topic. And that was not the only complaint. Not surprised you try to simplify it though.



Conina said:

DarkRPGamer started this part of the discussion with "... seriously everything on the PS4 is just a prettier version of a PS360 game."

I'm pretty sure you are aware of that claim.


Maywell have but he's not me. :P And, as you've seen, I have added and addendum in reference to what I believe people mean when they say that the new games been "just prettier versions" because, as per the example, I:SS is a lot "smaller" than its predecessors.