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Forums - Gaming Discussion - The mobile market shows the danger of parity

VanceIX on 12 July 2014
Jizz_Beard_thePirate said:

With that being said, I do think there is some backhanding and lazyness going on in the console Gaming scene however so I do still worry but I don't think mobile is the best example

You are probably right about mobile not being the best example, but there are games on mobile that are gimped to be playable across all devices, so that was kinda what I wanted to push.

Although I do agree, most mobile games are just shitty in general.



                                                                                                               You're Gonna Carry That Weight.

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oldschoolfool on 12 July 2014
VanceIX said:
ikki5 said:

See, the thing is about phones though, is people don't buy them for games. Games on them are just extras. I see a lot of posts how so many more people have phones but lets face it, only a fraction of those are people that actually go to play games on them regularily. People get phones for communication where as the handhelds are for gaming and if people want a handheld, they will probably look to the handhelds over the phones. This may change and it may inhibit the handhelds currently but I doubt phones will take over the handheld gaming sector in the near future.

You'd be surprised about just how much game revenue phones provide. Sure, people don't neccessarily buy  for games, but for most people the only gaming they do is on their phones.

yea,you mean most non gamers only game on there phones. When I can find a massive multiplayer game on a phone are an 100 hr rpg,then give me a call. 



gergroy on 12 July 2014
VanceIX said:
Intrinsic said:
I think your post, while meaning well is also disingenuous. This is cause of how much you seem to know about what you are saying and then the somewhat strange conclusion you arrived at.

Two things, first. No developer "gimps" a game for parity. Its kinda impossible to do when you think about it. Cause to accomplish it would mean that you would have to put in extra work to make the game run worse. This misconception is based off gullible people either believing what they see of games either in bullshots or extremely early in development footage or footage running off industrial grade hardware.

Secondly, this isn't all some sort of conspiracy. Its really straight forward. When a developer sets out to make a game, they always have a target in their head (this part you touched on and i agree with). If a deveoper is making a multiplatform game, then what they would do is simply try and optimize the game for weakest hardware. Simply cause if they get it running on the weakest hardware then everything else can run it.

What consoles represent to PCs is the minimum best standard, cause as console hardware become more similar to PCs, developers can just focus on the console knowing that PCs would be able to run them just fine. But no one sets out to gimp a game in the name of parity.

Watch Dogs for PC was very much gimped. Modders even found the original graphics in the game files, and found that the game not only looked better but even ran better with those.

Also, Destiny is being gimped on the PS4 due to Bungie wanting the same experience across all platforms, including last-gen. It could easily his 60fps, but is locked to 30.


PC is a TERRIBLE example to use.  Are you saying that PC games should be optimized for only the high end systems?  That would eliminate like 80% of the pc gaming market.  Developers are smart to keep their requirements lower on PC's, it doesnt really have anything to do with consoles at all...



VanceIX on 12 July 2014
oldschoolfool said:
VanceIX said:
ikki5 said:

See, the thing is about phones though, is people don't buy them for games. Games on them are just extras. I see a lot of posts how so many more people have phones but lets face it, only a fraction of those are people that actually go to play games on them regularily. People get phones for communication where as the handhelds are for gaming and if people want a handheld, they will probably look to the handhelds over the phones. This may change and it may inhibit the handhelds currently but I doubt phones will take over the handheld gaming sector in the near future.

You'd be surprised about just how much game revenue phones provide. Sure, people don't neccessarily buy  for games, but for most people the only gaming they do is on their phones.

yea,you mean most non gamers only game on there phones. When I can find a massive multiplayer game on a phone are an 100 hr rpg,then give me a call. 

I'm not saying mobile games are as good as console, so I don't know what you're talking about?

All I'm saying is that developers are gimping console games by not bothering to optimise for the most powerful hardware. PS4/One games are consistently being held back by PS3/360 games because devs are developing for all the platforms, while not bothering to use the newer consoles' full potentials. It's even worse on PC.



                                                                                                               You're Gonna Carry That Weight.

Xbox One - PS4 - Wii U - PC

VanceIX on 12 July 2014
gergroy said:
VanceIX said:
Intrinsic said:
I think your post, while meaning well is also disingenuous. This is cause of how much you seem to know about what you are saying and then the somewhat strange conclusion you arrived at.

Two things, first. No developer "gimps" a game for parity. Its kinda impossible to do when you think about it. Cause to accomplish it would mean that you would have to put in extra work to make the game run worse. This misconception is based off gullible people either believing what they see of games either in bullshots or extremely early in development footage or footage running off industrial grade hardware.

Secondly, this isn't all some sort of conspiracy. Its really straight forward. When a developer sets out to make a game, they always have a target in their head (this part you touched on and i agree with). If a deveoper is making a multiplatform game, then what they would do is simply try and optimize the game for weakest hardware. Simply cause if they get it running on the weakest hardware then everything else can run it.

What consoles represent to PCs is the minimum best standard, cause as console hardware become more similar to PCs, developers can just focus on the console knowing that PCs would be able to run them just fine. But no one sets out to gimp a game in the name of parity.

Watch Dogs for PC was very much gimped. Modders even found the original graphics in the game files, and found that the game not only looked better but even ran better with those.

Also, Destiny is being gimped on the PS4 due to Bungie wanting the same experience across all platforms, including last-gen. It could easily his 60fps, but is locked to 30.


PC is a TERRIBLE example to use.  Are you saying that PC games should be optimized for only the high end systems?  That would eliminate like 80% of the pc gaming market.  Developers are smart to keep their requirements lower on PC's, it doesnt really have anything to do with consoles at all...

Where did I say that? PCs have multiple settings for a reason, I hope you realize. Yes, devs should optimise for the best hardware, and then allow the visual quality to be downgraded BY THE USER if the user is unable to play the highest setting on their PC. 



                                                                                                               You're Gonna Carry That Weight.

Xbox One - PS4 - Wii U - PC

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small44 on 12 July 2014
VanceIX said:
ikki5 said:

See, the thing is about phones though, is people don't buy them for games. Games on them are just extras. I see a lot of posts how so many more people have phones but lets face it, only a fraction of those are people that actually go to play games on them regularily. People get phones for communication where as the handhelds are for gaming and if people want a handheld, they will probably look to the handhelds over the phones. This may change and it may inhibit the handhelds currently but I doubt phones will take over the handheld gaming sector in the near future.

You'd be surprised about just how much game revenue phones provide. Sure, people don't neccessarily buy  for games, but for most people the only gaming they do is on their phones.

98% of revenue are from f2p  game with great graphics mean bigger budget mean more expensive games and Smartphone gamers won't pay more then 1$ for a game



PS4 - over 100 millions let's say 120m
Xbox One - 70m
Wii U - 25m

Vita - 15m if it will not get Final Fantasy Kingdoms Heart and Monster Hunter 20m otherwise
3DS - 80m

VanceIX on 12 July 2014
small44 said:
VanceIX said:
ikki5 said:

See, the thing is about phones though, is people don't buy them for games. Games on them are just extras. I see a lot of posts how so many more people have phones but lets face it, only a fraction of those are people that actually go to play games on them regularily. People get phones for communication where as the handhelds are for gaming and if people want a handheld, they will probably look to the handhelds over the phones. This may change and it may inhibit the handhelds currently but I doubt phones will take over the handheld gaming sector in the near future.

You'd be surprised about just how much game revenue phones provide. Sure, people don't neccessarily buy  for games, but for most people the only gaming they do is on their phones.

98% of revenue are from f2p  game with great graphics mean bigger budget mean more expensive games and Smartphone gamers won't pay more then 1$ for a game

Really? Last I checked, Minecraft, Final Fantasy 3/4/5/6, Chaos Rings I/II, Grand Theft Auto III/SA/VC, and Dragon Quest 8 were all doing amazingly well, and they are all paid games.



                                                                                                               You're Gonna Carry That Weight.

Xbox One - PS4 - Wii U - PC

gergroy on 12 July 2014
VanceIX said:
gergroy said:

PC is a TERRIBLE example to use.  Are you saying that PC games should be optimized for only the high end systems?  That would eliminate like 80% of the pc gaming market.  Developers are smart to keep their requirements lower on PC's, it doesnt really have anything to do with consoles at all...

Where did I say that? PCs have multiple settings for a reason, I hope you realize. Yes, devs should optimise for the best hardware, and then allow the visual quality to be downgraded BY THE USER if the user is unable to play the highest setting on their PC. 

Basically meaning that the majority of the pc gaming community would have to settle of an unoptimized piece of garbage with all the settings turned down at the expense of the minority.  



VanceIX on 12 July 2014
gergroy said:
VanceIX said:
gergroy said:

PC is a TERRIBLE example to use.  Are you saying that PC games should be optimized for only the high end systems?  That would eliminate like 80% of the pc gaming market.  Developers are smart to keep their requirements lower on PC's, it doesnt really have anything to do with consoles at all...

Where did I say that? PCs have multiple settings for a reason, I hope you realize. Yes, devs should optimise for the best hardware, and then allow the visual quality to be downgraded BY THE USER if the user is unable to play the highest setting on their PC. 

Basically meaning that the majority of the pc gaming community would have to settle of an unoptimized piece of garbage with all the settings turned down at the expense of the minority.  

Do you own a gaming PC? When you downgrade, of course it looks worse, what do you expect? That doesn't mean it looks like a mess. A recent example is Star Citizen. Optimised for high-end cards, but looks and plays just fine on medium-specced cards on lower settings. When you lower the quality, you don't magically lose optimisation, you just make it look like what it would on consoles, or what your hardware is capable of.



                                                                                                               You're Gonna Carry That Weight.

Xbox One - PS4 - Wii U - PC

Intrinsic on 12 July 2014
Smear-Gel said:
There's no way to remedy this because sales of a game on one platform will be greatly affected by people thinking the experience is too different.

The Wii U isn't all that weaker than other 8th Gen consoles and 3rd party sales are still cannibalized by differing experiences. Widening that gap will affect sales for every console.

The answer would be to have more exclusive games on each system to push hardware but that also has problems. People only like exclusives when it's on the console they own and companies like widening the install base.

I generally agree with all you said with exception to the part I bolded. The wiiU is really that much weaker when compared to other 8th gen consoles in every single sense of the word. Ths isn't even a discussion, there isn't one single minute hardware detail that the wiiU does better than any of the other 8th gen consoles, and where it pales it pales by a lot. What the wiiU has got oing for it is that majority of its games are exclusives so its never in those situations where direct comparisons can be made between it and other 8th gen consoles. There is a certain level of IQ you will see on the PS4/XB1 that you will just never see on the wiiU. And anyone that thinks this isn't true, probably only has a wiiU and not the other 8th gen consoles.