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Forums - Movies & TV - Godzilla '14: Good, But Sadly Disappointing (Spoilers, Duh)

I thought the movie was a little average, some really terrible acting at times. Some of the US military stuff was really cringeworthy and some god aweful huge story and plot holes, would also have liked to see a little more of Godzilla in action. But it had enough of the more traditional zilla flick stuff to be enjoyable and the CGI was excellent and it was many times better than some of the hollywoods more recent trash attempts in this area like the 98 version or that piece of dog excrement Pacific Rim.



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foodfather said:
curl-6 said:
foodfather said:
Godzilla barely has 5 minutes of relevant screen time. 

Not true. 

According to IMDb there are over 300 effects shots of Godzilla; for him to be on screen for 5 mins, the average shot would have to be under a second, which is clearly not the case.


It clearly is the case.

Close ups of flares dropping next to Godzilla, shots of Godzilla fins underwater, shots of Godzilla tail, shots of Godzilla though helicopter news reports does not count as relevant screen time. 

The only time you get a good look at Godzilla, is the 2 minute sequence on the bridge and the 3 minute fight scene at the end. The only other time you get a good look at Godzilla, is after he ''wakes up'' from fainting and the couple of time you see Godzilla roar into the camera (nothing more than trailer shots). Its probably even less that five miniutes with the constant cutting to kick ass or olsen. 

"3 minute fight"? Uh, you must have dozed off man, cos it was a lot more than three minutes.



curl-6 said:
adriane23 said:

I didn't misunderstand anything. It sounds like you took Ken Watanabe's character too literally when he described how nature balances itself out. That balance he was speaking about is the predator/prey relationship. Godzilla did not represent nature itself, he represented half of the relationship.

In theory, that isn't impossible with an animal that size, actually. Blue whales can communicate up to 1000 miles disregarding noise pollution. Even if you take into consideration the speed at which sound travels through water as opposed to air, the MUTOs could've been communicating wih sound over that large of a distance seeing as how the smaller MUTO was 2-3 times larger than a blue whale. An EMP powerful enough to travel that far would disrupt eletronics everytime they tried to communicate. A low energy EMP wouldn't make it that far, and an EMP strong enough to travel that far is essentially a nuclear explosion each time.

It's not just about Ken Watanabe's line. Since his birth in the 1954 film, Godzilla has represented nature biting back, whether it be punishing man for our nuclear sins, or in this case neutralizing a monster we awoke. It is well established in canon across 60 years and dozens of films. It's not just a throwaway line, it's a reference to a core element of the character that has been well established in series lore.

And this being a giant monster movie, perfect realism is out the window from the start. But the pulses the male emits before birth are concluded by the characters to be communication with the female; they only become a weapon after the male notices that what was presumably a cry for help conveniently disables his tormentors. 

Now you're basically just repeating yourself. Just like you say that perfect realism is out the window in a monster movie, so is coherence in a franchise that's lasted this long. It makes absolutely no sense that a predator shows up just to fight other big monsters and not see them primarily as a food source. It's just ridiculous and a plot point like that would actually make the movie complete garbage, so why do you believe in it so much?. It's 2014, not 1954. That kind of plot just doesn't fly anymore, especially for a serious movie. In this movie, Godzilla is the predator and the MUTOs are his prey. That was specifically said and I really don't understand why this basic facet of the plot bothers you so much.

The pulses before birth were concluded to be a method of echolocation, yes. They were not EMP blasts as the electrical equipment didn't get shut down until the monster started to hatch or until the military tried to kill it (I forgot which happened first). Which goes back to my first point. To be able to communicate that far of a distance with EMPs would disrupt electrical equipment for several miles each time the monster wanted to say hello. But you know what, maybe the people that made this movie were that dumb in not understanding how EMPs work, even though they were trying to bring some semblance of realism to this genre of movies. That's entirely a possiblility, but I don't think it's likely.

This has to be the most pointless argument I've had in my life. Reply if you want, I don't care anymore.



I am the Playstation Avenger.

   

adriane23 said:

Now you're basically just repeating yourself. Just like you say that perfect realism is out the window in a monster movie, so is coherence in a franchise that's lasted this long. It makes absolutely no sense that a predator shows up just to fight other big monsters and not see them primarily as a food source. It's just ridiculous and a plot point like that would actually make the movie complete garbage, so why do you believe in it so much?. It's 2014, not 1954. That kind of plot just doesn't fly anymore, especially for a serious movie. In this movie, Godzilla is the predator and the MUTOs are his prey. That was specifically said and I really don't understand why this basic facet of the plot bothers you so much.

The pulses before birth were concluded to be a method of echolocation, yes. They were not EMP blasts as the electrical equipment didn't get shut down until the monster started to hatch or until the military tried to kill it (I forgot which happened first). Which goes back to my first point. To be able to communicate that far of a distance with EMPs would disrupt electrical equipment for several miles each time the monster wanted to say hello. But you know what, maybe the people that made this movie were that dumb in not understanding how EMPs work, even though they were trying to bring some semblance of realism to this genre of movies. That's entirely a possiblility, but I don't think it's likely.

This has to be the most pointless argument I've had in my life. Reply if you want, I don't care anymore.

The Godzilla in this film is a culmination of 60 years of series lore. If it were strictly a predator/prey dynamic, he would have eaten the dead Mutos. He didn't, because he was not there looking for food; he was fulfilling his established role as nature's strong right arm, restoring balance.

Your average moviegoer is not going to know much about the range an EMP can travel, so the filmmakers had soome leeway there.



curl-6 said:
adriane23 said:

Now you're basically just repeating yourself. Just like you say that perfect realism is out the window in a monster movie, so is coherence in a franchise that's lasted this long. It makes absolutely no sense that a predator shows up just to fight other big monsters and not see them primarily as a food source. It's just ridiculous and a plot point like that would actually make the movie complete garbage, so why do you believe in it so much?. It's 2014, not 1954. That kind of plot just doesn't fly anymore, especially for a serious movie. In this movie, Godzilla is the predator and the MUTOs are his prey. That was specifically said and I really don't understand why this basic facet of the plot bothers you so much.

The pulses before birth were concluded to be a method of echolocation, yes. They were not EMP blasts as the electrical equipment didn't get shut down until the monster started to hatch or until the military tried to kill it (I forgot which happened first). Which goes back to my first point. To be able to communicate that far of a distance with EMPs would disrupt electrical equipment for several miles each time the monster wanted to say hello. But you know what, maybe the people that made this movie were that dumb in not understanding how EMPs work, even though they were trying to bring some semblance of realism to this genre of movies. That's entirely a possiblility, but I don't think it's likely.

This has to be the most pointless argument I've had in my life. Reply if you want, I don't care anymore.

The Godzilla in this film is a culmination of 60 years of series lore. If it were strictly a predator/prey dynamic, he would have eaten the dead Mutos. He didn't, because he was not there looking for food; he was fulfilling his established role as nature's strong right arm, restoring balance.

Your average moviegoer is not going to know much about the range an EMP can travel, so the filmmakers had soome leeway there.

They also don't care that a nuke doesn't give off radiation before it has detonated so they also stuffed that in the movie.



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adriane23 said:
curl-6 said:

It's not just about Ken Watanabe's line. Since his birth in the 1954 film, Godzilla has represented nature biting back, whether it be punishing man for our nuclear sins, or in this case neutralizing a monster we awoke. It is well established in canon across 60 years and dozens of films. It's not just a throwaway line, it's a reference to a core element of the character that has been well established in series lore.

And this being a giant monster movie, perfect realism is out the window from the start. But the pulses the male emits before birth are concluded by the characters to be communication with the female; they only become a weapon after the male notices that what was presumably a cry for help conveniently disables his tormentors. 

Now you're basically just repeating yourself. Just like you say that perfect realism is out the window in a monster movie, so is coherence in a franchise that's lasted this long. It makes absolutely no sense that a predator shows up just to fight other big monsters and not see them primarily as a food source. It's just ridiculous and a plot point like that would actually make the movie complete garbage, so why do you believe in it so much?. It's 2014, not 1954. That kind of plot just doesn't fly anymore, especially for a serious movie. In this movie, Godzilla is the predator and the MUTOs are his prey. That was specifically said and I really don't understand why this basic facet of the plot bothers you so much.

The pulses before birth were concluded to be a method of echolocation, yes. They were not EMP blasts as the electrical equipment didn't get shut down until the monster started to hatch or until the military tried to kill it (I forgot which happened first). Which goes back to my first point. To be able to communicate that far of a distance with EMPs would disrupt electrical equipment for several miles each time the monster wanted to say hello. But you know what, maybe the people that made this movie were that dumb in not understanding how EMPs work, even though they were trying to bring some semblance of realism to this genre of movies. That's entirely a possiblility, but I don't think it's likely.

This has to be the most pointless argument I've had in my life. Reply if you want, I don't care anymore.

See, I didn't mind if Godzilla didn't eat the monsters.  Of course, I don't think you're saying that he needed to, either.  What you're saying is that within the own movies logic, Godzilla should have eaten them.  This is why I like the way the Toho movies set up Godzilla better.  He was an animal himself.  He caused destruction himself.  But, when he felt a monster was on "his turf," he would lay down some whoop-ass.  In this movie, they act like nature is a sentient being who just summons Godzilla when there are monsters attacking.  If you think about it, this whole "balance of nature" doesn't work, because what would Godzilla's purpose be in the beginning?  What balance was the MUTOs putting out of whack?  The truth is, they only brought Godzilla about because the MUTOs were attacking (well sorta) humans, even though Gareth stated that Godzilla doesn't care about humans.

I'm also getting tired of these weak strawmen arguments. 

"Well, Godzilla doesn't show up for about an hour in any movie."  I'm pretty sure I have come across 2-3 people complaining about it taking too long to get to Godzilla.  Everyone else, including me, enjoyed the buildup.  So, why use such a weak argument that almost no one disagrees with.

"Well, Godzilla is in only ~20-30 mins of his other movies."  That may be true, but you know why people don't complain about that?  Because when Godzilla gets there, he's treated with just as much importance as the other characters in the movie.  No cut aways so we don't see him destroy buildings and/or fight monsters.

"Well, it would get boring if the movie was just 2 hours of fighting."  Well, no shit.  Who asked for that?  No one.  But, I don't think expecting a 5-10 min fight (one that THE DIRECTOR even sets up to happen) is too much to ask.

"But, there was a 20 min fight at the end.  Didn't that satisfy you?"  Really?  What awesome director's cut did you watch.  I would love to see this 20 min fight.  Oh, there wasn't a director's cut?  You're just adding all the mins from when the fight starts (which, again, we cut away from to follow humans/Ford) to when Godzilla kills the female, even though most of that time is filled by us spending time with the humans/Ford?  Gotcha.  In reality, the fighting we do see is only 5-10 mins of screen time.  Which wouldn't be so bad, but unfortunately, the rest of the movie has been nothing but cock teases, so you're actually expecting to SEE a 20 min fight at the end.



JerCotter7 said:

They also don't care that a nuke doesn't give off radiation before it has detonated so they also stuffed that in the movie.

For all we know they have some other sense for locating nuclear material. It's a giant monster movie, virtually anything goes when it comes to the monster's capabilities, hence Godzilla's atomic heat ray, which isn't exactly biologically plausible, but is still awesome.



I'm a fan of Cranston but he was doing some serious overacting in this movie. Taylor-Johnson has been great in several movies I have seen him in but he literally seems to be sleep walking through this movie. Note to the producers, if your not going to bother making any of the human characters remotely interesting then please don't waste our time with that crap.

I'm also not a fan of the idea that Godzilla is the "hero". The special effects were good though.



thismeintiel said:
adriane23 said:
curl-6 said:

It's not just about Ken Watanabe's line. Since his birth in the 1954 film, Godzilla has represented nature biting back, whether it be punishing man for our nuclear sins, or in this case neutralizing a monster we awoke. It is well established in canon across 60 years and dozens of films. It's not just a throwaway line, it's a reference to a core element of the character that has been well established in series lore.

And this being a giant monster movie, perfect realism is out the window from the start. But the pulses the male emits before birth are concluded by the characters to be communication with the female; they only become a weapon after the male notices that what was presumably a cry for help conveniently disables his tormentors. 

Now you're basically just repeating yourself. Just like you say that perfect realism is out the window in a monster movie, so is coherence in a franchise that's lasted this long. It makes absolutely no sense that a predator shows up just to fight other big monsters and not see them primarily as a food source. It's just ridiculous and a plot point like that would actually make the movie complete garbage, so why do you believe in it so much?. It's 2014, not 1954. That kind of plot just doesn't fly anymore, especially for a serious movie. In this movie, Godzilla is the predator and the MUTOs are his prey. That was specifically said and I really don't understand why this basic facet of the plot bothers you so much.

The pulses before birth were concluded to be a method of echolocation, yes. They were not EMP blasts as the electrical equipment didn't get shut down until the monster started to hatch or until the military tried to kill it (I forgot which happened first). Which goes back to my first point. To be able to communicate that far of a distance with EMPs would disrupt electrical equipment for several miles each time the monster wanted to say hello. But you know what, maybe the people that made this movie were that dumb in not understanding how EMPs work, even though they were trying to bring some semblance of realism to this genre of movies. That's entirely a possiblility, but I don't think it's likely.

This has to be the most pointless argument I've had in my life. Reply if you want, I don't care anymore.

See, I didn't mind if Godzilla didn't eat the monsters.  Of course, I don't think you're saying that he needed to, either.  What you're saying is that within the own movies logic, Godzilla should have eaten them.  This is why I like the way the Toho movies set up Godzilla better.  He was an animal himself.  He caused destruction himself.  But, when he felt a monster was on "his turf," he would lay down some whoop-ass.  In this movie, they act like nature is a sentient being who just summons Godzilla when there are monsters attacking.  If you think about it, this whole "balance of nature" doesn't work, because what would Godzilla's purpose be in the beginning?  What balance was the MUTOs putting out of whack?  The truth is, they only brought Godzilla about because the MUTOs were attacking (well sorta) humans, even though Gareth stated that Godzilla doesn't care about humans.

I'm also getting tired of these weak strawmen arguments. 

"Well, Godzilla doesn't show up for about an hour in any movie."  I'm pretty sure I have come across 2-3 people complaining about it taking too long to get to Godzilla.  Everyone else, including me, enjoyed the buildup.  So, why use such a weak argument that almost no one disagrees with.

"Well, Godzilla is in only ~20-30 mins of his other movies."  That may be true, but you know why people don't complain about that?  Because when Godzilla gets there, he's treated with just as much importance as the other characters in the movie.  No cut aways so we don't see him destroy buildings and/or fight monsters.

"Well, it would get boring if the movie was just 2 hours of fighting."  Well, no shit.  Who asked for that?  No one.  But, I don't think expecting a 5-10 min fight (one that THE DIRECTOR even sets up to happen) is too much to ask.

"But, there was a 20 min fight at the end.  Didn't that satisfy you?"  Really?  What awesome director's cut did you watch.  I would love to see this 20 min fight.  Oh, there wasn't a director's cut?  You're just adding all the mins from when the fight starts (which, again, we cut away from to follow humans/Ford) to when Godzilla kills the female, even though most of that time is filled by us spending time with the humans/Ford?  Gotcha.  In reality, the fighting we do see is only 5-10 mins of screen time.  Which wouldn't be so bad, but unfortunately, the rest of the movie has been nothing but cock teases, so you're actually expecting to SEE a 20 min fight at the end.

Yes, that's exactly what I was saying. I'm pretty sure I made my point clear, but whatever.  It's the internet after all and people will defend what they want to defend. Even if it's a movie that fails its own logic. And I agree that Godzilla took a back seat to everyone else in this movie. I wouldn't have minded that as much if Bryan Cranston stuck around for the whole movie, but well, he didn't.

I'm still looking forward to the next one. Hopefully, Godzilla is given more relevant screen time and the "movie science" is consistent throughout.



I am the Playstation Avenger.

   

curl-6 said:
JerCotter7 said:

They also don't care that a nuke doesn't give off radiation before it has detonated so they also stuffed that in the movie.

For all we know they have some other sense for locating nuclear material. It's a giant monster movie, virtually anything goes when it comes to the monster's capabilities, hence Godzilla's atomic heat ray, which isn't exactly biologically plausible, but is still awesome.


But even so a nuke isn't actually nuclear until it has a reaction. It's well established in the movie that they monsters feed off radiation. The bomb had no radiation. It would only have ratiation after it exploded. The MUTO also had no idea it was going to detonate otherwise it wouldn't have put the bomb into it's nest. It's a giant plot hole. Well one of many but the others are easier to overlook.