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Forums - Politics Discussion - North America versus Europe - who would win in an all out war?

 

North America or Europe? - continent wise

North America 320 50.24%
 
Europe 313 49.14%
 
Total:633
Augen said:
The answer first is no one. There is a reason a major war between powerful nations has not happened since 1945. It would be suicide for either side, and who would gain anything from such a disastrous war that would send us into a 40 year depression?

If you wanted to take out nukes, then clearly the Finnish would win. Suomen kaikkien!

Pfft. Only because you know this is going to happen.



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dyremose said:
bucky1965 said:
ArnoldRimmer said:
bucky1965 said:
I guess WW2 was just a pipe dream.

Bad example. Very much unlike what hollywood movies suggest, WW2 was a war that the US was hardly even involved in. And that is also the reason why they were indeed the big "winners" of WW2 - they waited until all other countries had already pretty much ruined each other before entering the war. That way, they kept their casualties and expenses extremely low.


I guess it would have been better to let Hitler control all of Europe. And Japan all of Asia. Silly me.


although formally at war on the axis powers since 1941, the US millitary to the war was really just limited to japan. by then the chinese had fought the japanese to a stalemate. the only reason the US even joined the war was because Japan attacked them first. the united states had done everything up to that point to stay out of the conflict and on the europe front all they did was send materials and provide limited war assets. then by 1944  germany was severely weakened from 5 years of war and was being pushed back by soviet forces. it was the perfect time to strike since everyone knew that the war was already won. it required a minimal of logistics since the Uk was still fighting and so had a base of operations for the US to use. not only that but american troops in western europe only accunted for about half as both Uk and canadian soldiers also participated (yet you never hear about that) the two sides in this was that suffered to most casualties was with out a doubt Russia and germany. US role was merely to shorten the war by forcing germany to divide its reinforcements to two fronts. do not be disilusional about their role. hitler would have lost undoubtedly and it isnt even certain that japan would have won since the UK armies in india hadnt yet intervened to help china. something that would definitely have happened if it felt that its territorial interest were at risk. furthermore australia and new zealand hadnt been included in a full scale mainland war but was still limited to island clashes. to summarize... europe owes its freedom primarily to over 1 milion russian lives while china owes its freedom to themselves and you, but also a poor decision from the japanese to fight fully fight on two fronts at once over oil.


I replied to your quote on page 13 of this thread. I forgot to quote it.



I'm sure Europe would win easily after receiving some training from the Vietnamese.



Poll is funny.

You can tell Europeans are just voting and not reading. I have seen zero arguments from Europeans why they have advantages without either adding Russia, or China to the mix.



chocoloco said:
Poll is funny.

You can tell Europeans are just voting and not reading. I have seen zero arguments from Europeans why they have advantages without either adding Russia, or China to the mix.

Even with Russia AND China it's rough, just due to ridiculious US naval superiority.

 

What I find funny is how everyone complains about how much the US spends on the military vs other stuff, why the US has such a big military compaired to the EU that it can use everywhere and is stationed everywhere etc...


but as soon as the question boils down into a "Who would win in a fight"  everyones liberal predalictions disapear because nobody wants to be on the side that loses in a war that will never be fought.

Suddenly Europeons want to have an army just as good, even though a combined EU is really only about the size of the US in GDP terms,  and a combined EU and Russia still smaller then USA, Canada Mexico....

Sort of reminds me of the guys who are "totally cool" with homosexuality, except have to act exageratidly grossed out if they see two dudes kissing. 

At the end of the day, no matter how enlightened most guys are, it all still boils down to one big pissing contest for most people.

Outside which a  EU + Russia army that was superior to the US army would actually cost a hell of a lot more as a percentage of GDP.

Christ the fact that the US would pretty handily defeat a combined Europe+Russia should be seen as something upsetting... for Americans.  Not Europeons.

Because it shows just how freaking wasteful military spending in the US is, that a combined fictional superthreat isn't even really any threat at all.



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Well, I know you said only conventional warfare but one of the things that would be a huge factor in any attempt to invade the US is the fact that well, unlike most of Europe the average Joe can own an assault rifle, and people know how to use them. There are something like 200 million guns in circulation in the US (including all types of firearms). However, because of this I believe the manpower pool in the US would be more capable(since most americans know how to shoot a firearm) if both sides started a draft (which in this type of all out war it would be required)



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I think right NOW the US would win and I'll tell you why. The rest of the worlds military might is in shambles. Really, only the US has increased it's strength in this department and while the numbers would be against them as far as population? American citizens would rise up, and take arms. It's just how they are. Alot of Europe has moved past this sort of mentality. You'd have every man woman and child working in near harmony to defeat the threat and when you combine that sort of unity, will and spirit with the worlds number one military force, it's going to be nearly impossible to defeat.



brendude13 said:

I'm sure Europe would win easily after receiving some training from the Vietnamese.

well now we are talking Vietnam... you do realize that the French got their asses whooped badly before the US intervened. The Kill to Death rate was over 10-1 in favor of the US in Vietnam....so ya take them tactics. Just because we quick because a bunch of hippies and the media turned the general populace against the war does not mean we were not kicking their asses from a tactical and operational standpoint, where we struggled/failed was the stategic element.



End of 2009 Predictions (Set, January 1st 2009)

Wii- 72 million   3rd Year Peak, better slate of releases

360- 37 million   Should trend down slightly after 3rd year peak

PS3- 29 million  Sales should pick up next year, 3rd year peak and price cut

bigjon said:
Well, I know you said only conventional warfare but one of the things that would be a huge factor in any attempt to invade the US is the fact that well, unlike most of Europe the average Joe can own an assault rifle, and people know how to use them. There are something like 200 million guns in circulation in the US (including all types of firearms). However, because of this I believe the manpower pool in the US would be more capable(since most americans know how to shoot a firearm) if both sides started a draft (which in this type of all out war it would be required)


You seem to forget that a lot of european countries (especially in the east) have or had a mandatory 2 year military sentence for all men once they reach a certain age.



I was walking down along the street and I heard this voice saying, "Good evening, Mr. Dowd." Well, I turned around and here was this big six-foot rabbit leaning up against a lamp-post. Well, I thought nothing of that because when you've lived in a town as long as I've lived in this one, you get used to the fact that everybody knows your name.

starcraft said:
anonymunchy said:
The combined military forces of Europe far outnumber the combined forces of North America. I don't think NA would stand a chance really, especially when you start to look at the European Special forces.

Here's some numbers; https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_number_of_troops

And what good is it going to do them?

How are they going to get to North America?
 No ship bigger than a liferaft is going to get close to the US continental fortress.  The Europeans have a tiny but sophisticate Navy.  The Russians have a large but decrepite Navy.  

The US has an enormous and highly sophisticated Navy.  Some people have indicated that it will have to be split into two, Pacific and Atlantic.  But the US has already done this - half of its Navy could take on the combined navies of any other 5 countries on the planet and win comfortably.  That may change one day as China ramps up its military, and the UK looks to rebuild its carriers - but right now it would be carnage, Russia and the Europeans would be slaughtered.

Why would they need to. Pretty sure America makes it a point to attack on other peoples soil in all circumstances lol.



I was walking down along the street and I heard this voice saying, "Good evening, Mr. Dowd." Well, I turned around and here was this big six-foot rabbit leaning up against a lamp-post. Well, I thought nothing of that because when you've lived in a town as long as I've lived in this one, you get used to the fact that everybody knows your name.