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Forums - Microsoft - Spindoctor Aaron Greenberg: "Reporting Can Get Confusing, But We Did Sell 3.9"

Sorry I have to say this site is at its worst point. Its lowest. Ive never in 7 years seen posters blatantly twist things, and then gang attack the site owner. Ioi always got respect through the years. And hes 100% right here. That twitter poster waded in and challenge something that didnt need challenging. That poster had an alterior motive from the start. Aaron simply said thanks to a congrats on their report figure which is always sold to retail for god knows how long.

Seriously? To many posters have taken over this site in his absence. Ive been no saint. But I know for a fact im changing and being more rational. Thinking about my posts. And ive never gone to the lengths in this thread.



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ioi said:
DonFerrari said:

You seemed just like a dictator right know... And I know I'll probably get banned for any reason by going after you... and perhaps you should frequent more your own website and have more staff and mod meeting to see their ban historic, protected members, etc...

You may think I'm flaming Xbox, which I'm not, tired of being banned for silly jokes at it. I'm firmly disagreeing of Aaron posture... he as the front man on this case (as you in the case of this site) must set the standard, not bend things to their will... So while people think he didn't had any purpose in not saying it was sold to retail not to customer I and others will keep disagreeing... you know why? Because you aren't the onwer of the truth in this case as none of us is... So if you want to say "In your opinion he wasn't spinning, just talking about sold to retail without any agenda" I won't disagree, but if you say that he is 100% factually saying it and you are sure, then you are putting your opinion as fact and not being neutral, and not holding the standard you say you created your site on.

I am a dicatator, this is my site. It isn't a democracy. I set the rules.

You are flaming Xbox - you have been in hundreds of posts now as have others that you have mentioned and that I have noted previously. It is tiresome and is adding nothing to the discussion on this site.

Greenberg said that "sold is the correct terminology" WHICH IT IS. That is a FACT. Microsoft SOLD 3.9m units to their customers - Gamestop, Walmart and so on. He is correcting the guy who is saying that he should use the word SHIPPED by saying "actually you are wrong - SOLD is the correct word which is why we have used it" and he is right. There is no dispute. Read Sony's financial report and they will also use the world SOLD. Just because some people don't understand the situation it doesn't mean that it is not right.

Not once did Greenberg suggest that Microsoft sold 3.9m units to consumers.

Thanks for agreeing and being so open about it. It really is eye oppening... you change your stance reallllly fast.

You say you don't participate in the forums anymore, but you have a tab of Sony users that you think keep flaming MS... probably you have a tab for MS and Nintendo as well? Or they are more civilized and neutral?

And again, go to the financial thread and see if I have challenged their numbers... I even congratulated them, but that doesn't matter. This wasn't a financial report, it was a twitter to everybody (MS fans, haters, followers, clueless, etc), so I can't take seriously that a PR guy that preffer not to clarify isn't doing spin... but you are entitled to your facts. Won't reply about this, because I have seem that it won't be worth and you wouldn't ever change your position on this.

And I agree with most here that say that MS diehards get away with a lot more than Sony diehards (the Ninty I don't pay much attention since they don't antagonize as much, but most of the ones I talked were nice people), and that threads that flame Sony is better accepted than even small jabs at MS... but as you said it is your site and your will will prevail.

In Brazil we have a saying "To my friends everything, to my enemies the law" (because our law despise what most think is really harsh, just isn't applied)... and I have added quite long ago a part that fits your answer to me... "and if the law isn't enough, I'll change it".



duduspace11 "Well, since we are estimating costs, Pokemon Red/Blue did cost Nintendo about $50m to make back in 1996"

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=8808363

Mr Puggsly: "Hehe, I said good profit. You said big profit. Frankly, not losing money is what I meant by good. Don't get hung up on semantics"

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=9008994

Azzanation: "PS5 wouldn't sold out at launch without scalpers."

shane_stocks said:
Somini said:
shane_stocks said:
ioi said:
shane_stocks said:

How come, that the actual Q4 report from Microsoft clearly states 3.9m to retailers, when simply Aaron says "We sold 3.9m Xbox Ones".

When did he say they sold 3.9m Xbox Ones?

In the very reply he sent me via OP.

"But we did sell 3.9"

Exactly. Shane was arguing that the number is shipped, but he still insisted on use of the word "sold"

He wouldn't have if he wanted us to think that there is no difference between the two.


Spot on. I challenged Aaron that the figure was SHIPPED. Aaron "corrected" me and said no, we've SOLD 3.9m Xbox Ones. Intentions are obvious, to spin the figure into people thinking 3.9m Xbox Ones are in the hands of customers. 

You're making assumptions. He never said sold to whom. You're the one doing the spinning. Your twitter hash tag gives you away?



ioi said:
Somini said:

I'm beginning to think that you're not so neutral yourself. I always see you lashing out at Sony fans and now you say you're keep a list of them? I never see you go into a deep discussion with someone like Kowenicki.

I'm beginning to understand why NeoGaf is banning anyone who mentions this site!!


I've had run-ins with Kowenicki, Seece and many others in the past.

The people on my list are people that are causing trouble - it isn't my fault that they happen to mostly be Sony fans at this moment in time.

I'd suggest you all calm down a little, think a bit more about what you are saying and post in a reasonable and respectful manner.

It isn't that hard.

I don't disrespect people unless they're bigots or something and i don't see anything in my reply where you could've thought i was, unless arguing with you is disrepescting you in your view!

Anyways any chance for a reasonable discussion was lost the moment you began waving the ''i own the place card''

So let your word be the last one here.



selnor1983 said:
Sorry I have to say this site is at its worst point. Its lowest. Ive never in 7 years seen posters blatantly twist things, and then gang attack the site owner. Ioi always got respect through the years. And hes 100% right here. That twitter poster waded in and challenge something that didnt need challenging. That poster had an alterior motive from the start. Aaron simply said thanks to a congrats on their report figure which is always sold to retail for god knows how long.

Seriously? To many posters have taken over this site in his absence. Ive been no saint. But I know for a fact im changing and being more rational. Thinking about my posts. And ive never gone to the lengths in this thread.

You mean that we must respect him as he respect us or just bend over and lick his bots?



duduspace11 "Well, since we are estimating costs, Pokemon Red/Blue did cost Nintendo about $50m to make back in 1996"

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=8808363

Mr Puggsly: "Hehe, I said good profit. You said big profit. Frankly, not losing money is what I meant by good. Don't get hung up on semantics"

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=9008994

Azzanation: "PS5 wouldn't sold out at launch without scalpers."

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ioi said:
DonFerrari said:

Man, you appeared in like two threads in the last weeks and you have patronized and done personal attacks on 3 users already?? Pezus, ethomaz and this new guy and even threating ban hammer if you were more active??? Please read the rules of your own forum and stop attacking your "customers"

Please read my own rules? I wrote them!

I've been active on a lot of side projects lately but it seems obvious that these forums have become a little out of hand just lately. I've spotted at least 6-8 users (and you are on that list as well by the way, I haven't had chance to get around to you as yet) who are clearly on here to flame, wind people up and have absolutely no impartiality or logic when they discuss something. VGChartz is a place of neutral, productive, factual discussion - not just another cesspit of fanboyism and pointless, illogical discussions. When I built this site we had high standards and it looks like I'm going to have a lot of work to do to get us back there!

A new console gen just started. Of course there's going to be lots of pointless fanboy wars, it's like this on every forum. Sony, MS, and Nintendo fans have all had their fair share of fanboyism in the last few months. Not much can be done aside from banning 99% of the users on this site. 



Sigs are dumb. And so are you!

bucky1965 said:
shane_stocks said:
Somini said:
shane_stocks said:
ioi said:
shane_stocks said:

How come, that the actual Q4 report from Microsoft clearly states 3.9m to retailers, when simply Aaron says "We sold 3.9m Xbox Ones".

When did he say they sold 3.9m Xbox Ones?

In the very reply he sent me via OP.

"But we did sell 3.9"

Exactly. Shane was arguing that the number is shipped, but he still insisted on use of the word "sold"

He wouldn't have if he wanted us to think that there is no difference between the two.


Spot on. I challenged Aaron that the figure was SHIPPED. Aaron "corrected" me and said no, we've SOLD 3.9m Xbox Ones. Intentions are obvious, to spin the figure into people thinking 3.9m Xbox Ones are in the hands of customers. 

You're making assumptions. He never said sold to whom. You're the one doing the spinning. Your twitter hash tag gives you away?


What is my Twitter hashtag? Look, I am sick and tired of the spins that Microsoft believe they have to do. FASTEST console sold etc.... This, I knew his intentions and challenged it.



It's Shane Stocks doing all the spinning. Take a close look at his twitter hash tag.



 said:
FlamingWeazel said:

I agree, might make sense why some users here get away with constant flame baiting and others get banned for saying a console is struggling. Nothing here was said that should cause that kind of aggrivation.

No, this is the latest in a long line of threads that I have been reading over the last couple of weeks where the behaviour of certain posters is starting to make itself known to me.

Listen, learn to view things logically and neutrally. Sony spends money on Youtube ads (and won't ask youtubers to disclose what they do) just like Microsoft does. Sony has always used the word "sold" in their financial reports to describe the number of units they sell to retailers (which as a consumer we like to think of as shipped). These things have been happening for many years as have many other things and yet we get thread after thread of you guys finding any tiny thing you can to pull MS up on?

Also, calling a discussion or a point of view idiotic (as I am with the above) isn't an insult. I never called anybody an idiot (something very different) I am just describing the total lack of any kind of logic, neutrality, open-mindedness or resonable debate as idiotic. Either that or it is being done on purpose to cause trouble and wind people up. Either way, there isn't really any place for it on here.


You herd it here, Sony already lied to us now we have to roll over and accept it from any other company that wants to



crissindahouse said:

not sure where the problem is? microsoft sold 3.9 million consoles and retailers sold around 3m to their customers. what's so hard to understand?

ah it's about microsoft? stupid microsoft all spinning and lying wawawa

Yeah, it's about Microsoft, but everyone attacked Sony when they stated sold instead of shipped as well to pad their numbers.  Why should it be any different towards Microsoft?

I personally don't care if they sold or shipped, but right now it does make a big difference as to how many they've actually sold since it's a new console.