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Forums - Nintendo Discussion - NeoGAF: Wii U GPU 160 ALUs, 8 TMUs and 8 ROPs

fatslob-:O on 08 November 2013
F0X said:
fatslob-:O said:
F0X said:
I hate to see this discussion devolve so much. :/

Let me rephrase something I've said earlier: I could choose to believe this information, and that would be fine. There's nothing wrong with putting stock in a good theory, especially when it has supporting evidence. Or I can wait for hard confirmation before coming to my own conclusions. Or I could simply not care at all and make my conclusions about the hardware based on whether or not it has games I desperately want to play.

And all of those viewpoints are logical in their own sense, so I'm left wondering why this thread is rapidly becoming devoid of respect, and by extension, respect for logical thought.

Dudes like eyeofcore in this is an eye sore to high tech discussion. If we keep ignorant people like him out we can solve the puzzle more easily without disruptions from him. Others like Teriol keep going on to damage control. 

It's devoid of respect because they can't respect an opposing view of another but yeah you should buy the consoles based on games not hardware. 


Yeah, there's too much needless damage control going on. The games being released for Wii U look good. Some of the recent third-party multiplats are passable (Assassin's Creed IV comes to mind). And even the digital scene is shaping up to be something good. Why the insecurity?

As the old joke goes, Wii U doesn't need more flops. :P

There some games that I do want to play on the wii u! 



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fatslob-:O on 08 November 2013
vaio said:
fatslob-:O said:
eyeofcore said:
oni-link said:
at this point I think no real Nintendo fan will care what specs the Wii U has!!! I for one don't care if it has the specs of a 15 year old Sega Dreamcast (I'm so tired of the BS about specs taking a rumor as fact) as long as it produces games as beautiful as SM3DW, X, Rayman Legends, Bayo2 etc!!! People shouldn't give a shit about which console has the biggest D!ck as long as it satisfies their needs no? Besides PC outshines any of the "big" 3's consoles anyday...so does Steam Machines!!!


I agree with you, I am here just refuting the obvious rumor and fallacy...

Fatslob forces a rumor as a fact yet the die shot, mm^2 available for GPU and other things say otherwise... He can't handle it.

Specs don't matter, Wii ruled for several years straight stomping Xbox 360 and PlayStation 3 in sales and software sales and DS proved PSP and 3DS proved Vita are no match to the attractive design and games, for three years in a row, weakest console won in sales and software sales.

Hopefully the Wii U will continue the trend.

Die shots don't matter when a console is taking less than 35 watts. Deal with it! 

This rumor is partly backed up by the fact that it takes less than 35 watts. Deal with it once again. 

BTW what fallacy is there when you yourself can't back up your point with sources ? (Uh oh it really sounds like your reaching for that damage control LOL.)


so gamecube with average of 23watts is less powerfull then ps2 phat at 70 watts?

The gamecube came in a different process node. 



fatslob-:O on 08 November 2013
fallen said:
fatslob-:O said:
fallen said:
ViktorBKK said:
F0X said:
ViktorBKK said:

The Wii U has more ram, thats it. Everywhere else it is lagging. You obviously do not understand the correlation between semiconductor lithography and power consumption.

Wii U : 40/45 nm & 40 Watts

PS360 Slim Versions: 40/45 nm & ~100 watts

Do the math.


Care to elaborate more? I'm led to believe that technology is supposed to become more effiecent over time.

Chip designs get more efficient over time, but engineers are not wizards. Especially when it comes to GPUs, where things are highly paralellized. You can improve a design and gain maybe 15% performance under the same thermal ceiling. You can't ever get 100%. Ever seen a 100W AMD card beat a 200W nVidia card? When both cards are in the same proccess node, it cannot happen. Also consider that the GPUs from all 3 current gen consoles, come from the same fab(TSMC).


not really true because smartphones are approaching ps3 power and they draw like a watt or two.

 

mind you, i believe the wii u is quite weak. just correcting you.

Not even close!


Not even close what?

 

Go look up the benches. Even something like Tegra 4 is as powerful as a 7800 GTX which is the GPU in PS3.

 

Let alone Project Logan, Nvidia's next mobile GPU, which they explicitely state is more powerful than PS3 (google Project Logan).

You may not see mobile games that look as good as PS360 yet, but that's for many reasons. The raw power is increasibgly there.

Project logan is gonna fail like the rest of the shitty tegra chipsets.  

How can they get more effieciency with the same node ? 



F0X on 08 November 2013
fatslob-:O said:
F0X said:


Yeah, there's too much needless damage control going on. The games being released for Wii U look good. Some of the recent third-party multiplats are passable (Assassin's Creed IV comes to mind). And even the digital scene is shaping up to be something good. Why the insecurity?

As the old joke goes, Wii U doesn't need more flops. :P

There some games that I do want to play on the wii u! 


Heck, my second-most anticipated Wii U game is Donkey Kong Country: Tropical Freeze. And that game is no technical showcase (but I love the art design). At least not compared to X, Bayo 2, or even 3D World.



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fatslob-:O on 08 November 2013
F0X said:
fatslob-:O said:
F0X said:


Yeah, there's too much needless damage control going on. The games being released for Wii U look good. Some of the recent third-party multiplats are passable (Assassin's Creed IV comes to mind). And even the digital scene is shaping up to be something good. Why the insecurity?

As the old joke goes, Wii U doesn't need more flops. :P

There some games that I do want to play on the wii u! 


Heck, my second-most anticipated Wii U game is Donkey Kong Country: Tropical Freeze. And that game is no technical showcase (but I love the art design). At least not compared to X, Bayo 2, or even 3D World.

I also realize that software sells hardware. There's no need for people to hound out on me for my analysis! I want to play X and monolith softs decent JRPGs. 



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Proxy-Pie on 08 November 2013
oni-link said:
at this point I think no real Nintendo fan will care what specs the Wii U has!!! I for one don't care if it has the specs of a 15 year old Sega Dreamcast (I'm so tired of the BS about specs taking a rumor as fact) as long as it produces games as beautiful as SM3DW, X, Rayman Legends, Bayo2 etc!!! People shouldn't give a shit about which console has the biggest D!ck as long as it satisfies their needs no? Besides PC outshines any of the "big" 3's consoles anyday...so does Steam Machines!!!

i agree, what always charms be about Nintendo's games is how amazing the art styles can look, especially for so called "last gen" hardware.

i mean just look at this!

This is a Wii game for crying out loud! and still looks completely badass despite the huge gap between the Wii and the PS360.



fallen on 08 November 2013
fatslob-:O said:
fallen said:
fatslob-:O said:
fallen said:
ViktorBKK said:
F0X said:
ViktorBKK said:

The Wii U has more ram, thats it. Everywhere else it is lagging. You obviously do not understand the correlation between semiconductor lithography and power consumption.

Wii U : 40/45 nm & 40 Watts

PS360 Slim Versions: 40/45 nm & ~100 watts

Do the math.


Care to elaborate more? I'm led to believe that technology is supposed to become more effiecent over time.

Chip designs get more efficient over time, but engineers are not wizards. Especially when it comes to GPUs, where things are highly paralellized. You can improve a design and gain maybe 15% performance under the same thermal ceiling. You can't ever get 100%. Ever seen a 100W AMD card beat a 200W nVidia card? When both cards are in the same proccess node, it cannot happen. Also consider that the GPUs from all 3 current gen consoles, come from the same fab(TSMC).


not really true because smartphones are approaching ps3 power and they draw like a watt or two.

 

mind you, i believe the wii u is quite weak. just correcting you.

Not even close!


Not even close what?

 

Go look up the benches. Even something like Tegra 4 is as powerful as a 7800 GTX which is the GPU in PS3.

 

Let alone Project Logan, Nvidia's next mobile GPU, which they explicitely state is more powerful than PS3 (google Project Logan).

You may not see mobile games that look as good as PS360 yet, but that's for many reasons. The raw power is increasibgly there.

Project logan is gonna fail like the rest of the shitty tegra chipsets.  

How can they get more effieciency with the same node ? 

Huh?

Yeah Tegra fails, but that doesn't matter. All the other competing chipsets are just as powerful it was just an example (also I was wrong and edited, Tegra 4 isn't as powerful as PS3 GPU, it's the newest Qaulcomm  SOC)

They get more efficiency from the same node with better designs? I dont know, for whatever reason mobile performance increases extremely quickly.

Probably because it's relatively low to begin with, so there's more room to grow.

There's also a die size variable. A 400mm GPU on 28nm should be 2X as powerful as a 200mm one, all else equal. The max current size is around 550mm. But if you're below that you can increase power just by getting bigger (more transistors) on the same node. So if Qaulcomm makes a 28nm mobile SOC that's 100mm, and then the next iteration they make 150mm, then the next one 200, etc, they can grow that way without decreasing node, at least until they hit the 550 limit (and I dont think mobile is close to that)



JoeTheBro on 08 November 2013
dahuman said:
oni-link said:

Wii U W101 vs Knack:

I actually prefer the latter!!!


Knack is nowhere as entertaining as W101, that much I can assure you lol.

How did you come to that conclusion?

I think both are great!



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curl-6 on 08 November 2013
MohammadBadir said:
oni-link said:
at this point I think no real Nintendo fan will care what specs the Wii U has!!! I for one don't care if it has the specs of a 15 year old Sega Dreamcast (I'm so tired of the BS about specs taking a rumor as fact) as long as it produces games as beautiful as SM3DW, X, Rayman Legends, Bayo2 etc!!! People shouldn't give a shit about which console has the biggest D!ck as long as it satisfies their needs no? Besides PC outshines any of the "big" 3's consoles anyday...so does Steam Machines!!!

i agree, what always charms be about Nintendo's games is how amazing the art styles can look, especially for so called "last gen" hardware.

i mean just look at this!

This is a Wii game for crying out loud! and still looks completely badass despite the huge gap between the Wii and the PS360.

Skytown, Phaaze, and the Pirate Homeworld in Prime 3 look better than anything in the same year's Halo 3 on the more powerful 360.

Retro Studios truly has ome of the best artists in the industry.



curl-6 on 08 November 2013
oni-link said:
curl-6 said:
oni-link said:

or like this

 

and this:


Don't forget the best looking Wii U game released so far:

OH HELL YEAH!!!!

Wii U games definitely LOOK way better than PS360 (note I stopped talking about specs and just how they look for me...it's all about the games)

Even if in terms of specs, the developers of the game, Frozenbyte, have outright said that PS3/360 could not run the Wii U version.

But yes, there is much more to how good a game looks than the amount of FLOPS involved.