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Forums - Sony Discussion - Proof that the site is seriously undertracking PSP games in Others !!!

hunter_alien on 12 February 2008
Neos said:
okay so it's not doing horribly bad, just horribly

what's the big deal?

 You know that there are ~ 500 games released in the EU , so not even 1% of the games are tracked . I would say that this is a pretty big deal . Also , Im shure that this arent the top sellers . Also , GTA games are not tracked on weekly basis at all ... 

 

  There are over 100 million softwares shiped worldwide , where do you think they are shipping it ? To the dumpster . Also , this week alone in the US PSP/Games attach ratio was ~ 3.4 , and I wouldent call that absymal ( hell , I wouldent be surprised if even US PSP games are undertracked ) .

 

   The only region while I bealive that the attach ratio is trully less than 2:1 is Japane , and thats because the last 50 games are in the 100-500 region ...



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hunter_alien on 12 February 2008
lombard2578 said:
hunter_alien said:

First of all , I would want to say that this site is great , and I love it ( just before all haters will throw themself at me ) . I know that ioi and the others who track data are doing their best , and Its normal for the site to have a couple of minuses , especially if its entirely for free to use . The only thing I dont like about the site , are the people , who keep on yelling how terrible PSP software sale are . I admit , they are bad , but not even far as bad ( at least in Others ) as it would seem .

This week , the Others chart show us that only 14299 games where sold , and 49522 PSPs ... this would be a terrible attach ratio . But then I looked at a couple of games .

 

This week FIFA 08 sold on the PSP in Others 5846 copys . WWE Smackdown vs. RAW 08 sold 3434 copys . The Golden Compass sold 2629 copys . The Simpsons Game sold another 2320 copys . So only 4 games sold ... OMG , what a surprise ... exactly 14299 copys !!!

 

The site is tracking in Others only 4 games ! And last year there where some pretty big EU games released like Pursuit Force : Extreme Justice and Wipeout Pulse . Both are much bigger in the EU than in the US .

 

So please , before you yell : " OMG teh PSP haz no software salez !!!! " think about this thread , and maybe , just maybe I finally convinced some that the PSP is actually selling games ( not much , but enough to keep 3rd party support ) .


It's not the first time i see the question.

The total, you speak, is only the total for the game of the top 50, so not the right total you think.

It's a fact, the totals in others are only totals for the game in the top 50.

And, you can imagine there is a lot of game selling about 1000 copies behind the fourth game you speek, which give better software sales for the psp, but not incredible sales, because it's not the case, because piracy for exemple.


 Those games are not even in the top 50 ... and dont tell me that Wipeout Pulse didnt manage to pass the 20k it needed when it was released to break in the top 50 , because seeing sales for many games ( Tomb Raider Legends , GTA games , Pursuit Force etc. ) Others is the best software seller for the PSP . 

 

  I know that PSP software sales are far from stellar , but saying absymal is pretty silly :) 



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FishyJoe on 12 February 2008

But do you have any proof that it's only PSP that's being undertracked? Aren't all games regardless of system that miss the charts not counted in the weekly total? If so, then then all systems will be under represented, not just the PSP.

It's possible the PSP is losing by even bigger margins if you include all games from all systems that don't chart. I'd bet that the system market share for charted games is close to the system market share for non-charted games. If so, then the PSP is probably losing worse if you were to include all game sales in the total.



lombard2578 on 12 February 2008
hunter_alien said:
lombard2578 said:
hunter_alien said:

First of all , I would want to say that this site is great , and I love it ( just before all haters will throw themself at me ) . I know that ioi and the others who track data are doing their best , and Its normal for the site to have a couple of minuses , especially if its entirely for free to use . The only thing I dont like about the site , are the people , who keep on yelling how terrible PSP software sale are . I admit , they are bad , but not even far as bad ( at least in Others ) as it would seem .

This week , the Others chart show us that only 14299 games where sold , and 49522 PSPs ... this would be a terrible attach ratio . But then I looked at a couple of games .

 

This week FIFA 08 sold on the PSP in Others 5846 copys . WWE Smackdown vs. RAW 08 sold 3434 copys . The Golden Compass sold 2629 copys . The Simpsons Game sold another 2320 copys . So only 4 games sold ... OMG , what a surprise ... exactly 14299 copys !!!

 

The site is tracking in Others only 4 games ! And last year there where some pretty big EU games released like Pursuit Force : Extreme Justice and Wipeout Pulse . Both are much bigger in the EU than in the US .

 

So please , before you yell : " OMG teh PSP haz no software salez !!!! " think about this thread , and maybe , just maybe I finally convinced some that the PSP is actually selling games ( not much , but enough to keep 3rd party support ) .


It's not the first time i see the question.

The total, you speak, is only the total for the game of the top 50, so not the right total you think.

It's a fact, the totals in others are only totals for the game in the top 50.

And, you can imagine there is a lot of game selling about 1000 copies behind the fourth game you speek, which give better software sales for the psp, but not incredible sales, because it's not the case, because piracy for exemple.


Those games are not even in the top 50 ... and dont tell me that Wipeout Pulse didnt manage to pass the 20k it needed when it was released to break in the top 50 , because seeing sales for many games ( Tomb Raider Legends , GTA games , Pursuit Force etc. ) Others is the best software seller for the PSP .

 

I know that PSP software sales are far from stellar , but saying absymal is pretty silly :)

I believe you see these numbers in the top 50, because  we only see the top 50, so where do you find them?

There was really a thread about this fact before, and ioi says it was because the total is only for certainly the 4 games you said, and so, you must be agree, it's not the right total.

For the rest, ioi don't give result for all the games which exist, it's not a surprise. Maybe, he has no time to do it, and certainly, the sample don't give enough data to give acceptable numbers.

For wipeout pulse, he is only rank 20 in UK this week, and it's a return in the top:

 http://www.chart-track.co.uk/index.jsp?c=p/software/uk/latest/index_test.jsp&ct=110026

So, i'm not sure of what you think about this game. 

 

 



kingofwale on 12 February 2008

regardless, we must look at software numbers with a grain of salt, especially older game when it stopped being tracked when it falls below certain top seller list.

Okami can have sold close to 500K instead, same goes for Shadow.



Soriku (Feb 10/08): In 5 years the PS3/360 will be dead.

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Original cast: Badonkadonkhr, sc94597 allaboutthegames885, kingofwale, Soriku, ctk495, skeezer, RDBRaptor, Mirson,

Episode 1: OOPSY!
selnor: Too Human I even expect 3-4 mill entire life and 500,000 first day. GoW2 ( expect 7 - 9 million entire life and over 2 mill first day), Fable 2 (expect 5-6 million entire life and 1.5 mill fist day) BK3 (expect 4 - 5 mill sales entire life and 1 mill first day).. Tales/IU/TLR should get to 2 or 3 million! post id: 868878
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hunter_alien on 12 February 2008
FishyJoe said:
But do you have any proof that it's only PSP that's being undertracked? Aren't all games regardless of system that miss the charts not counted in the weekly total? If so, then then all systems will be under represented, not just the PSP.

It's possible the PSP is losing by even bigger margins if you include all games from all systems that don't chart. I'd bet that the ratio of games sales vs system sales for charted games is close to the ratio of non-charted games vs system sales.

 Just look at the top 50 and you can see that only there every sistem has more than 4 games in the top 50 . 4 games , thats all that is tracked in the EU for the PSP , 4 games . Not 10 , not 40 , but 4 . The DS has in worst case cenario ~ 80 tracked games , but I put my head on that its more . Unfortunatly what I see now is that only PSP software is so severly undertracked , and Im positive , that in Others the weekly hardware sales have over 2:1 attach ratio , but it could be even more ... 

 

The PSP is not loosing by even bigger margins , because it cant be wors than this , bealive me ;) 



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FishyJoe on 12 February 2008
hunter_alien said:
FishyJoe said:
But do you have any proof that it's only PSP that's being undertracked? Aren't all games regardless of system that miss the charts not counted in the weekly total? If so, then then all systems will be under represented, not just the PSP.

It's possible the PSP is losing by even bigger margins if you include all games from all systems that don't chart. I'd bet that the ratio of games sales vs system sales for charted games is close to the ratio of non-charted games vs system sales.

Just look at the top 50 and you can see that only there every sistem has more than 4 games in the top 50 . 4 games , thats all that is tracked in the EU for the PSP , 4 games . Not 10 , not 40 , but 4 . The DS has in worst case cenario ~ 80 tracked games , but I put my head on that its more . Unfortunatly what I see now is that only PSP software is so severly undertracked , and Im positive , that in Others the weekly hardware sales have over 2:1 attach ratio , but it could be even more ...

 

The PSP is not loosing by even bigger margins , because it cant be wors than this , bealive me ;)


Again, the PSP is not exclusive to having game sales that don't chart. The DS has a massive library of games, most of which never make the charts. Same goes with the PS2. Wii, PS3 and 360 less so because the systems are newer.



lombard2578 on 12 February 2008
lombard2578 said:
hunter_alien said:
lombard2578 said:
hunter_alien said:

First of all , I would want to say that this site is great , and I love it ( just before all haters will throw themself at me ) . I know that ioi and the others who track data are doing their best , and Its normal for the site to have a couple of minuses , especially if its entirely for free to use . The only thing I dont like about the site , are the people , who keep on yelling how terrible PSP software sale are . I admit , they are bad , but not even far as bad ( at least in Others ) as it would seem .

This week , the Others chart show us that only 14299 games where sold , and 49522 PSPs ... this would be a terrible attach ratio . But then I looked at a couple of games .

 

This week FIFA 08 sold on the PSP in Others 5846 copys . WWE Smackdown vs. RAW 08 sold 3434 copys . The Golden Compass sold 2629 copys . The Simpsons Game sold another 2320 copys . So only 4 games sold ... OMG , what a surprise ... exactly 14299 copys !!!

 

The site is tracking in Others only 4 games ! And last year there where some pretty big EU games released like Pursuit Force : Extreme Justice and Wipeout Pulse . Both are much bigger in the EU than in the US .

 

So please , before you yell : " OMG teh PSP haz no software salez !!!! " think about this thread , and maybe , just maybe I finally convinced some that the PSP is actually selling games ( not much , but enough to keep 3rd party support ) .


It's not the first time i see the question.

The total, you speak, is only the total for the game of the top 50, so not the right total you think.

It's a fact, the totals in others are only totals for the game in the top 50.

And, you can imagine there is a lot of game selling about 1000 copies behind the fourth game you speek, which give better software sales for the psp, but not incredible sales, because it's not the case, because piracy for exemple.


Those games are not even in the top 50 ... and dont tell me that Wipeout Pulse didnt manage to pass the 20k it needed when it was released to break in the top 50 , because seeing sales for many games ( Tomb Raider Legends , GTA games , Pursuit Force etc. ) Others is the best software seller for the PSP .

 

I know that PSP software sales are far from stellar , but saying absymal is pretty silly :)

I believe you see these numbers in the top 50, because we only see the top 50, so where do you find them?

There was really a thread about this fact before, and ioi says it was because the total is only for certainly the 4 games you said, and so, you must be agree, it's not the right total.

For the rest, ioi don't give result for all the games which exist, it's not a surprise. Maybe, he has no time to do it, and certainly, the sample don't give enough data to give acceptable numbers.

For wipeout pulse, he is only rank 20 in UK this week, and it's a return in the top:

http://www.chart-track.co.uk/index.jsp?c=p/software/uk/latest/index_test.jsp&ct=110026

So, i'm not sure of what you think about this game.

 

 


 For wipeout pulse in uk (top full price, because we don't have an all price top):

first week 15 december:  rank 20

http://www.chart-track.co.uk/index.jsp?c=p%2Fsoftware%2Fuk%2Farchive%2Findex_test.jsp&ct=110026&arch=t&lyr=2007&year=2007&week=50

second week 22 december: rank 15

http://www.chart-track.co.uk/index.jsp?c=p%2Fsoftware%2Fuk%2Farchive%2Findex_test.jsp&ct=110026&arch=t&lyr=2007&year=2007&week=51

third week 29 december: not in the top 20

 http://www.chart-track.co.uk/index.jsp?c=p%2Fsoftware%2Fuk%2Farchive%2Findex_test.jsp&ct=110026&arch=t&lyr=2007&year=2007&week=52

fourth week 5 january: rank 20

 http://www.chart-track.co.uk/index.jsp?c=p%2Fsoftware%2Fuk%2Farchive%2Findex_test.jsp&ct=110026&arch=t&lyr=2008&year=2008&week=1

fifth week 12 january: rank 16

http://www.chart-track.co.uk/index.jsp?c=p%2Fsoftware%2Fuk%2Farchive%2Findex_test.jsp&ct=110026&arch=t&lyr=2008&year=2008&week=2

sixth week 19 january: rank 19

http://www.chart-track.co.uk/index.jsp?c=p%2Fsoftware%2Fuk%2Farchive%2Findex_test.jsp&ct=110026&arch=t&lyr=2008&year=2008&week=3

seventh week 26 january:  not in the top 20

http://www.chart-track.co.uk/index.jsp?c=p%2Fsoftware%2Fuk%2Farchive%2Findex_test.jsp&ct=110026&arch=t&lyr=2008&year=2008&week=4

eigth week 2 february: not in the top 20

 http://www.chart-track.co.uk/index.jsp?c=p%2Fsoftware%2Fuk%2Farchive%2Findex_test.jsp&ct=110026&arch=t&lyr=2008&year=2008&week=5

So, this game is not very good in UK. 

 



lombard2578 on 12 February 2008
hunter_alien said:
lombard2578 said:
hunter_alien said:

First of all , I would want to say that this site is great , and I love it ( just before all haters will throw themself at me ) . I know that ioi and the others who track data are doing their best , and Its normal for the site to have a couple of minuses , especially if its entirely for free to use . The only thing I dont like about the site , are the people , who keep on yelling how terrible PSP software sale are . I admit , they are bad , but not even far as bad ( at least in Others ) as it would seem .

This week , the Others chart show us that only 14299 games where sold , and 49522 PSPs ... this would be a terrible attach ratio . But then I looked at a couple of games .

 

This week FIFA 08 sold on the PSP in Others 5846 copys . WWE Smackdown vs. RAW 08 sold 3434 copys . The Golden Compass sold 2629 copys . The Simpsons Game sold another 2320 copys . So only 4 games sold ... OMG , what a surprise ... exactly 14299 copys !!!

 

The site is tracking in Others only 4 games ! And last year there where some pretty big EU games released like Pursuit Force : Extreme Justice and Wipeout Pulse . Both are much bigger in the EU than in the US .

 

So please , before you yell : " OMG teh PSP haz no software salez !!!! " think about this thread , and maybe , just maybe I finally convinced some that the PSP is actually selling games ( not much , but enough to keep 3rd party support ) .


It's not the first time i see the question.

The total, you speak, is only the total for the game of the top 50, so not the right total you think.

It's a fact, the totals in others are only totals for the game in the top 50.

And, you can imagine there is a lot of game selling about 1000 copies behind the fourth game you speek, which give better software sales for the psp, but not incredible sales, because it's not the case, because piracy for exemple.


Those games are not even in the top 50 ... and dont tell me that Wipeout Pulse didnt manage to pass the 20k it needed when it was released to break in the top 50 , because seeing sales for many games ( Tomb Raider Legends , GTA games , Pursuit Force etc. ) Others is the best software seller for the PSP .

 

I know that PSP software sales are far from stellar , but saying absymal is pretty silly :)


 Okey, the total is only made with games which have made the top 50 in some weeks. The fourth game you speak, have been in the top 50 before, only these fourth game, which continue to have weekly sales, which are not published, but which exist, when you see the page of the game.



TWRoO on 12 February 2008

I imagined something like this would happen when ioi first started doing Europe software, he can only track what he gets enough data for.

If you look at this week specifically (use the Worlwide tab rather than Other) you will see only 26 DS games are included, and only 30 Wii games/22 PS3 games/24 X360 games.

None of the consoles has a complete set of software by a long shot, so you cannot use the "total software" chart accurately for others yet.... in time it will get better (not sure whether historical data will ever be complete)

It is exactly the same as the America software for last generation, apparently the PS2 sold only 150 million software units, but we know that is way too low... it's just ioi doesn't have data stretching back to the launch of the PS2.

_____________________________________________________________

Basically all platforms software totals would be a lot higher if the charts were more complete, the PSP would (percentage wise) certainly get a bigger boost because of the minute number of titles tracked, but that is because none of it's titles do well enough to get high into the charts.
At the moment the others charts are mainly for seeing what specific games do, nd they do give an idea of how the total software goes (PSP will still be the lowest in actual total software, it just won't be as significantly behind)

 

EDIT: ioi got there first.