A reason to count Wii Sports ... wasn't Super Mario Bros. counted in NES pack-ins? If that is considered counting, than Wii Sports must be counted. And, even if you refuse to count Wii Sports, you HAVE to count Wii Play, no matter what comes with it. If you want a controller, you can get one for 40 bucks. Or, you can get a controller AND a game. Looks like people are choosing to get the game. Can't count that against Nintendo for being smart. All that said, no one compares to the 360's attach rate, and it didn't need a pack-in to achieve it either. Both the Wii and the PS3 have slim pickins for original software right now.

Just a reminder: I did count Wii play in any and all charts, as it's actually sold to the consumer: regardless if its a ultra-cheap title. I think the question we need to ask is (thinking like a developer): How much money are the consumers willing to pay for a video game on system X, Y and Z? A systems true merit is in the software that can be sold. For Nintendo, Wii Sports doing well is great, but to Konami or Square Enix, it matters very little.

rocketpig said: nintendo_fanboy said: but if you don't take out wii sports, the wii has sold more software altough everybody said the wii is only for casuals and they will buy less games than the xboxers do. I guess you can look at it both ways. and about wii sports: depending on what you want to see, you should in or exclude it. If you are interested in the number of games the wii buyers own and how much they play then you should include it. If you want to know about the money spent on games you should exclude it of course. When trying to judge software sales, you can't include a bundled game. People get it whether they want it or not. There's no choice in the matter and people aren't spending a single extra dime for the game. It's akin to Sony claiming that they've sold almost 3m peripherals already for the PS3 because they're including every controller that came bundled with the system. It doesn't make sense.

Wrong. Can we end this once and for all please? Whether or not you know it, every person buying the Wii is paying extra for Wii sports being in the package PERIOD. The Japanese Wii that doesn't include the game costs LESS buy about a games worth because of them having to buy the game separately. Wii sports is not a throwaway that Nintendo is losing possible money on per Wii sold in EU and NA. You are being charged for it. Period. Now if we didn't have the concrete evidence (Japanese Wii pricing) then you could argue that the game is free, but unfortunately to anyone with a brain it should be easy to see.

mrstickball said: How about the statement I made stating the fact that the Wii s/w has done the less sales as the 360 did last year? Any opinions on that?

Sure, step back away from your charts and look at the name of the games maybe? Ghost Recon, Oblivion, Perfect Dark, Project Gotham? Vs what? Monkey Ball? Super swing golf? Elebits? Open season? And a million last gen PS2 port ups with tacked on waggle? Lets close our eyes and pretend the lineups of the 360 and Wii were in ANY way shape or fashion, comparable quality wise. Then lets act shocked that the 360 had a better 3rd party tie ratio and higher amount of software sold. Or not. Lets give the people reading this forum a little more credit than that k? Those lineups 6 months from release aren't even in the least bit comparable. Wii had some great 1st party games (that have been selling SHOCKING) 1 or 2 decent games from third parties, and a nice stack of steaming pile, laying next to god only knows how many last gen Ps2 PsP port ups. 360 had a much MUCH better lineup, Oblivion alone craps on anything Wii has out right now IMO. Especially coming so much earlier than the PS3 version. Developers know that a platforms merit is in how much software can be sold, but they also arent idiots with GED's and horrible business sense. They see the potential when the Wii is selling software respectably in comparison to the 360 in the first 6 months DESPITE having a garbage line up of throwaways the 3rd parties chucked out ASAP as they missed the boat. This argument is old as dirt. And the two 3rd parties you mentioned. Konami and Square Enix who you assure us don't care about the success of the first party titles, have already announced support for the Wii. This thread is full of lose, and has been done to death. Its just another "Why the Wii might not garner 3rd party support like many think it will" thread. Except these posts hurt even MORE now that the very third parties being spoken about have already announced support. Edit: Ok so that sounded offensive as all hell, and I didn't intend it to. I like the charts and data you post alot, so don't get me wrong. Its just these "Wii/PS3 software sales are teh lose" stuff is getting old. The developers can tell PS3 software hasn't been breaking down doors because of its low user base and the Wii hasn't been knocking down doors because of its game selection. I don't think we should assume that the developers look at the numbers and just say. "OH WELL THATS THAT!" Because if they did, the 360 would have each and every developers absolute full and best support, and so would the original Xbox, as both of these consoles had astronomical attach rates the other two could only envy.

We can extrapolate all we like on the numbers. Im not really trying to prove anything outside what the numbers show. We can make them whatever we like, and thats the fun of PREDICTION, estimation and so on. I just always like providing visual elements to an otherwise drab meaning of whatever we're arguing about. There are a million variables to video game sales about the Wii, PS3 and 360, as you have said - Wii s/w hasn't been the greatest due to some of the games, and to me, I'd think Tiger Woods 2k7, Sonic & The Secret Rings and others should do better, but again, we're predicting here on our free time. I don't take offense, because I'm not making or losing a dime off your comments. I mod and do pred. league, So what? It's just a hobby of mine. Why do I do charts that have an anti-Wii tinge to them? No one else will. 90% of people here are Wii supporters (or atleast seem like it), the other 5% are banned PS3 fanboys, and the other 5% are neutral or 360 owners. Im not trying to vilify the Wii owners, but just show that there are reasons some of us believe that the Wii isn't the be-all-end-all of gaming. Maybe it is, but again, thats a prediction, and thats what we're here to do ;)

360 does a good job pushing software with the gamerpoints system, and most 360 owners are the hardcore gamer type anyway.

....Which is exactly why places like Gamefly (I think thats the one) has 360 software always dominating the rental charts. Whenever my blockbuster gets a new game, even if they have 20 copies of a game, it's always gone for weeks on end. This is coming from a guy that just hit the 30k market for score :) The best website to check gamerscore stuff out (and a good indicator of XBLA game sales) is Mygamercard.net

I think the chart is great. Do more. I think the Wii is great and I don't have the others. (Softcore gamer.) I wish we had some Euro numbers though.

Well, it looks like ioi will be doing some numbers at some point soon with Europe, and I'll gladly make some charts for them. Do we want a Japanese s/w chart to show Nintendomination or something else?

mrstickball said: Well, it looks like ioi will be doing some numbers at some point soon with Europe, and I'll gladly make some charts for them. Do we want a Japanese s/w chart to show Nintendomination or something else?

hey, give us nintendo fans something to smile at geez..we couldn't do this for a lot of years you know. 

mrstickball said: How about the statement I made stating the fact that the Wii s/w has done the less sales as the 360 did last year? Any opinions on that?

 Japanese and European software sales are higher for Wii