Soundwave said: Except NSMBU, Mario Kart 8, Super Mario 3D World, Pikmin 3, DKC: Tropical Freeze, are all perfectly playable without it.  All you're doing by sticking to it is forcing a high price SKU. Lets face it ... Nintendo screwed up with this console in multitudes of ways, but if they could offer a cheap option for people that strictly just want a "Wii 2" and to play Mario Kart 8/Wii Sports/Mario 3D World as their secondary console for cheap ... better to have those customers than to not have them.  Beggars can't be choosers, Nintendo needs every console customer they can get.  The PSP Go isn't a valid comparable because disc games weren't playable on it and it was more expensive than the regular PSP.

The OS and UI are integrated into the GamePad.  You can't just remove it without significantly editing your OS and UI.    The costs alone to do that would negate any gains achieved by the increased sales.

And then imagine the backlash from people that bitch that they now have to buy a $100 GAmePad add on just to play some new game they want.

Soundwave said: ListerOfSmeg said: I think that would be a stupid move. Sorry it would be. It would be like Sony dropping ever feature from the PS and Vita except for basic controls. Do you ask for Rumble to be dropped because it adds nothing and would be cheaper? PS4/ would be cheaper if the touchpad wasn't in it, and it adds nothing to games is that also something you want dropped? Without the Game pad some games wouldn't work as they are now. I wouldn't be able to watch youtube while surfing websites. Off TV play would be lost. asymmetrical game play would be lost. It would limit new game play ideas. I want more than just prettier graphics. You want them to drop the one thing that makes them unique that the other 2 do not have. It comes off as you want them to drop it so they no longer have an advantage over PS. Except NSMBU, Mario Kart 8, Super Mario 3D World, Pikmin 3, DKC: Tropical Freeze, are all perfectly playable without it.  All you're doing by sticking to it is forcing a high price SKU. Lets face it ... Nintendo screwed up with this console in multitudes of ways, but if they could offer a cheap option for people that strictly just want a "Wii 2" and to play Mario Kart 8/Wii Sports/Mario 3D World as their secondary console for cheap ... better to have those customers than to not have them.  Beggars can't be choosers, Nintendo needs every console customer they can get.  The PSP Go isn't a valid comparable because disc games weren't playable on it and it was more expensive than the regular PSP.

Actually it is valid because it was a main selling point of PSP disc based games. Take it away and nobody wanted it.

I have a feeling even if it never came with one and was more powerful you wouldnt buy it any way

Einsam_Delphin said: ListerOfSmeg said: I think that would be a stupid move. Sorry it would be. It would be like Sony dropping ever feature from the PS and Vita except for basic controls. Do you ask for Rumble to be dropped because it adds nothing and would be cheaper? PS4/ would be cheaper if the touchpad wasn't in it, and it adds nothing to games is that also something you want dropped? Without the Game pad some games wouldn't work as they are now. I wouldn't be able to watch youtube while surfing websites. Off TV play would be lost. asymmetrical game play would be lost. It would limit new game play ideas. I want more than just prettier graphics. You want them to drop the one thing that makes them unique that the other 2 do not have. It comes off as you want them to drop it so they no longer have an advantage over PS. Sounds like you're under the wrong impression that the OP is suggesting the Game Pad be dropped periord.

No I am under the impression that nobody will make games that use its features if its not the main part of the console. Why support an add on? Did developers add support for the balance board in every game? No they didnt. Was Move in every game? No it wasnt. This way every console has one so developers know that by adding those features they will actually get used.

I do enjoy the fact that since you couldnt argue against anything I said, you had to turn it into something I didnt say.

Viper1 said: Soundwave said: Except NSMBU, Mario Kart 8, Super Mario 3D World, Pikmin 3, DKC: Tropical Freeze, are all perfectly playable without it.  All you're doing by sticking to it is forcing a high price SKU. Lets face it ... Nintendo screwed up with this console in multitudes of ways, but if they could offer a cheap option for people that strictly just want a "Wii 2" and to play Mario Kart 8/Wii Sports/Mario 3D World as their secondary console for cheap ... better to have those customers than to not have them.  Beggars can't be choosers, Nintendo needs every console customer they can get.  The PSP Go isn't a valid comparable because disc games weren't playable on it and it was more expensive than the regular PSP.  The OS and UI are integrated into the GamePad.  You can't just remove it without significantly editing your OS and UI.    The costs alone to do that would negate any gains achieved by the increased sales. And then imagine the backlash from people that bitch that they now have to buy a $100 GAmePad add on just to play some new game they want.

I have a friend that almost never uses his gamepad and is able to boot into any game. It's would be easy enough to tweak the OS to work strictly with the Wiimote and Pro Controller, they already do in most ways. The eShop and message boards are the only things really locked out right now. The notion that the Wii U OS doesn't work at all without the Game Pad is false, try booting up with your Wiimote next time and leave the tablet controller on the cradle -- it works fine. 

It's better to have a customer that bitches once in a blue moon than to not have them at all. 

Mind you, I don't think such a move would "save" the system, I think it's pretty much already a failure and Mario Kart/Smash are just going to be temporary bursts, much like the GameCube situation, but a move like this could maybe sell Nintendo an extra 5-10 million consoles if they get a cheap SKU out alongside Mario Kart 8. 

ListerOfSmeg said: Einsam_Delphin said: ListerOfSmeg said: I think that would be a stupid move. Sorry it would be. It would be like Sony dropping ever feature from the PS and Vita except for basic controls. Do you ask for Rumble to be dropped because it adds nothing and would be cheaper? PS4/ would be cheaper if the touchpad wasn't in it, and it adds nothing to games is that also something you want dropped? Without the Game pad some games wouldn't work as they are now. I wouldn't be able to watch youtube while surfing websites. Off TV play would be lost. asymmetrical game play would be lost. It would limit new game play ideas. I want more than just prettier graphics. You want them to drop the one thing that makes them unique that the other 2 do not have. It comes off as you want them to drop it so they no longer have an advantage over PS. Sounds like you're under the wrong impression that the OP is suggesting the Game Pad be dropped periord. No I am under the impression that nobody will make games that use its features if its not the main part of the console. Why support an add on? Did developers add support for the balance board in every game? No they didnt. Was Move in every game? No it wasnt. This way every console has one so developers know that by adding those features they will actually get used. I do enjoy the fact that since you couldnt argue against anything I said, you had to turn it into something I didnt say.

lol they already aren't making very many games that use the gamepad in significant ways. That's why they should make an option without it.

And I don't recall saying you said anything, only making sure you understand that the OP is simply suggesting another SKU option, not kill the gamepad all together. Asymmetrical gameplay, off TV play, and all that jazz will still exist, only now people will have the option of whether or not they want that stuff rather than it being forced on them even if they just want to play traditional games or whatever.

Soundwave said: If sales continue to not meet their expectations, I think they'll eventually release a SKU without it. I don't honestly see why Nintendo fans get so emotional over this being raised. The gamepad is a dud as far as being something that moves systems, even most of the hardcore Nintendo fans admit this. A $199.99 Wiimote-only bundle with Wii Sports Club could at least maybe get some extra people to bite on the machine as a secondary/party "Wii 2". If Nintendo could release a 2DS and ditch the 3D entirely, I would not rule anything out.

@bolded:  You're right about this as of now but remember that the DS wasn't flying off of the shelves either until games like Nintendogs and Brain Age arrived - games that utilized and proved the unique properties of the hardware.  Although more novel for its time, even the Wii would not have proven its concept so easily without the 800 pound gorilla that was Wii Sports.  Nintendo's problem was that they relied on Nintendoland to achieve that for WiiU, which clearly failed at it and Wii Party U isn't going to do it either.  Now they're focusing on giving us their tried and true experiences like 3DLand, DKC, MK8 and Smash in the near future - games that don't need the Gamepad.

But we're not talking about R.O.B. the robot here.  The Gamepad is a fully functional controller with many unique possibilities.  It's just up to Nintendo to show us why they designed their console around this concept beyond off-TV play, which, aside from a great browser, is the best thing about the Gamepad so far IMO.

Do you honestly believe that the Wii U is selling so bad is because of the price and the gamepad? The reason why it's selling so poorly is because there has been a huge software drought. I don't know why the gamepad is considered the root of the Wii U troubles. If you can not accept that software is the main and significant  issue of the Wii U, then you have no idea what you are talking about.

 

SOFTWARE  IS WHAT MOVES HARDWARE.

Such a simple fact that people constantly forget.

Well the console could almost survive without the gamepad (I've barely used the device...except to look at maps in pikmin 3 which you could do onscreen anyway)...
They never should've forced the damn thing on us in the first place and have yet to prove its relevance (although this is purely my opinion as I prefer to use other controls whenever offered, which thankfully always are!)

Screamapillar said: Six months ago, I would have said no, but... maybe. It would require significant changes to the console, not the least of which would be a serious change to the firmware. The way the GamePad running out the battery turns off the console, and that you can't turn it off without turning off the console, even if you're using a different controller. It's just so bizarre.... I really have to say, as big a Nintendo fan as I am, I really, really don't understand why the GamePad has to be turned on when I'm using a remote or Pro controller. Turning off the display works, but then a slight bump of any of the buttons, or if something grazes the screen, it turns back on. Obnoxious...unnecessary... you name it. All synonyms are applicable here. Also, the quality of the GamePad screen is lacking. It's got these weird lines in it. The resolution seems adequate enough, but the quality of the panel they used is just unforgivable. If they really couldn't bundle a high-quality GamePad and keep the console under $400, then they should have gone another way in the next generation. All we're left with is a console on par with the PS3, visually, and a clunky, enormous controller that can't be turned off. With the exception of there not being pressure-sensitive triggers, I do very much like the Pro controller. It's not bad.

wow that does sound crazy, i do appreciate you given a well thought out description and at least thinking about it and not getting emotionally and flying off the handle like some folks here.

Soundwave said: ListerOfSmeg said: I think that would be a stupid move. Sorry it would be. It would be like Sony dropping ever feature from the PS and Vita except for basic controls. Do you ask for Rumble to be dropped because it adds nothing and would be cheaper? PS4/ would be cheaper if the touchpad wasn't in it, and it adds nothing to games is that also something you want dropped? Without the Game pad some games wouldn't work as they are now. I wouldn't be able to watch youtube while surfing websites. Off TV play would be lost. asymmetrical game play would be lost. It would limit new game play ideas. I want more than just prettier graphics. You want them to drop the one thing that makes them unique that the other 2 do not have. It comes off as you want them to drop it so they no longer have an advantage over PS. Except NSMBU, Mario Kart 8, Super Mario 3D World, Pikmin 3, DKC: Tropical Freeze, are all perfectly playable without it.  All you're doing by sticking to it is forcing a high price SKU. Lets face it ... Nintendo screwed up with this console in multitudes of ways, but if they could offer a cheap option for people that strictly just want a "Wii 2" and to play Mario Kart 8/Wii Sports/Mario 3D World as their secondary console for cheap ... better to have those customers than to not have them.  Beggars can't be choosers, Nintendo needs every console customer they can get.  The PSP Go isn't a valid comparable because disc games weren't playable on it and it was more expensive than the regular PSP.

not to mention it wasnt like they STOPPED making regular PSPs, i dont get why some are getting uptight, never said to drop the gamepad period, simply saying they could give consumers a choice for all the reasons you listed.