By using this site, you agree to our Privacy Policy and our Terms of Use. Close

Forums - Politics Discussion - What would happen to the USA if we ended prohibition right now?

Mr Khan said:
The bureau of ATF exists for a reason: just because certain, easily abusable items (alcohol, tobacco, firearms) are legal does not mean that the black market has gone away, namely because these things are regulated still for public safety (fighting against moonshine made with engine coolant). While legalization will make strides against use by children and such, it will not vanish entirely.



And the ATF does a nice job at it (barring the exceptions like waco tx and ruby ridge and others). Don't you think the ATF can handle this?



Around the Network
snyps said:
DeadNotSleeping said:
More addicts, more accidents and a greater burden on the health care system. The average IQ will decrease, as will the number of eligible blood/organ donors. Criminal organization will choose to either compete with legitimate business to sell drugs, likely opting to cut corners on safety and sanitation during production to keep things competitively priced, or they will supplement the lost income by focusing on other methods at generating revenue. Racketeering and weapons smuggling may increase as a result. Average national life span will decrease. Number of infants born with birth defects or neurological conditions will rise--these persons may have the same difficulties moderating emotions as those born with FAS and so a hereditary predisposition towards violence may emerge in a greater number of families. Insurance premiums will rise in certain age groups. National averages for high school test scores will decrease. Border security will be increased to prevent smuggling outside of the country.


None of that happened after alchohol prohibition ended in 1933. What makes this different?

-There are more alcohol addicts per capita post-1933 than prohibition-era.
-Alcoholism has had a massive burden on health care, organ donation eligibility.  Drugs do the same.
-Alcohol consumption has resulted in more accidents and has been a precurser to more violent and/or sexual crimes than there was during the prohibition.
-Alcohol has almost no effect on blood donation as it is easily purged from the bloodstream, but drugs remain present longer and have a more pronounced effect on organs that affect the properties on one's blood.
-Racketeering and smuggling was rampant in that time, though I owe that more to deficiencies in the investigative techniques and technologies of those times.  
-Average lifespan has since increased since 1933; largely due to antibiotics and vaccines--neither of which are effective against organ damage drugs are responsible for.  A greater accessibility to drugs results in increased use which results in adverse health effects.  This has occurred with alcohol post-1933. So it shouldn't be different with drugs.
-When criminal organizations are denied sources of revenue, they invariably try to find it through alternative means, starting with an increased effort in their other activities.  This happens everywhere.  If drugs are part of their revenue, they will behave accordingly. 
-Fetal Alcohol Syndrome has since increased since 1933. This condition impairs one to moderate anger--such persons are far more likely to go to prison for violent or sexual crimes.  Similar conditions emerge when drugs are taken during pregnancy.
-The end of the prohibition era had the US aligning itself legally nearly equally to its neighboring countries.  If the US ended drug prohibition but Canada does not, the Canadian government will tighten its borders, and this means that the US will do the same.
-Dry counties still exist in the US.  When persons from said counties go to areas without prohibition, their alcohol intake increases on average.  Greater accessibility and less legal ramifications results in increased use.  This is reflected in insurance policies.  DUI offenses increase insurance rates across the board; with more people doing drugs, even the perceived increase of risk in certain age groups will result in higher insurance premiums.
-Those most likely to indulge in the increased availabity of drugs are those in their teens and twenties; since drugs have a measurably adverse effect on one's mental function (memory and problem solving in particular), average grades will predictably decrease and the average national IQ will reflect this.

 

 

In short, a lot of this happened after prohibition-era 1933, so there is little reason why it will be different.



badgenome said:

Perhaps. But when people are generally trying to sell drug legalization, they say, "Tax and regulate that shit!" If the taxes are too high or the regulation is too strict, and there's already a well developed black market in place, nothing much will change.

Also, regulation generally means some kind of age limit. So underaged users will still need to avail themselves of the black market.



Speaking from experience, I started selling weed, making a $1000, a week at 15. I can tell you the only reason it was being exposed to kids in school is because suppliers need to off load their products somewhere. Where better than a prison school. Suppliers just want a place to sell.



snyps said:

Speaking from experience, I started selling weed, making a $1000, a week at 15. I can tell you the only reason it was being exposed to kids in school is because suppliers need to off load their products somewhere. Where better than a prison school. Suppliers just want a place to sell.

I'm not sure I understand your point. Kids have always tried to score booze. Why wouldn't they still try to score drugs?



badgenome said:

Also, regulation generally means some kind of age limit. So underaged users will still need to avail themselves of the black market.

1. It would be more difficult for the youngins to get drugs if it were regulated. Right now, its easier for a young person to buy street drugs than alcohol or cigarettes.

2. The black market would be much smaller if it could only rely on the underage.



Recently Completed
River City: Rival Showdown
for 3DS (3/5) - River City: Tokyo Rumble for 3DS (4/5) - Zelda: BotW for Wii U (5/5) - Zelda: BotW for Switch (5/5) - Zelda: Link's Awakening for Switch (4/5) - Rage 2 for X1X (4/5) - Rage for 360 (3/5) - Streets of Rage 4 for X1/PC (4/5) - Gears 5 for X1X (5/5) - Mortal Kombat 11 for X1X (5/5) - Doom 64 for N64 (emulator) (3/5) - Crackdown 3 for X1S/X1X (4/5) - Infinity Blade III - for iPad 4 (3/5) - Infinity Blade II - for iPad 4 (4/5) - Infinity Blade - for iPad 4 (4/5) - Wolfenstein: The Old Blood for X1 (3/5) - Assassin's Creed: Origins for X1 (3/5) - Uncharted: Lost Legacy for PS4 (4/5) - EA UFC 3 for X1 (4/5) - Doom for X1 (4/5) - Titanfall 2 for X1 (4/5) - Super Mario 3D World for Wii U (4/5) - South Park: The Stick of Truth for X1 BC (4/5) - Call of Duty: WWII for X1 (4/5) -Wolfenstein II for X1 - (4/5) - Dead or Alive: Dimensions for 3DS (4/5) - Marvel vs Capcom: Infinite for X1 (3/5) - Halo Wars 2 for X1/PC (4/5) - Halo Wars: DE for X1 (4/5) - Tekken 7 for X1 (4/5) - Injustice 2 for X1 (4/5) - Yakuza 5 for PS3 (3/5) - Battlefield 1 (Campaign) for X1 (3/5) - Assassin's Creed: Syndicate for X1 (4/5) - Call of Duty: Infinite Warfare for X1 (4/5) - Call of Duty: MW Remastered for X1 (4/5) - Donkey Kong Country Returns for 3DS (4/5) - Forza Horizon 3 for X1 (5/5)

Around the Network
DeadNotSleeping said:
....



That is a really good response. I may not get back to you on that right away, but I will after some fact checking.



Mr Puggsly said:

1. It would be more difficult for the youngins to get drugs if it were regulated. Right now, its easier for a young person to buy street drugs than alcohol or cigarettes.

2. The black market would be much smaller if it could only rely on the underage.

Smaller, maybe, but certainly not non-existent. I don't think it would only rely on the underaged. Cigarette smuggling is a big racket because of how high taxes are in certain locales.

It really depends on how onerous the regulations are and how high the taxes. If legal distribution is relegated to dispensaries, then I definitely don't think much would change.



badgenome said:

I'm not sure I understand your point. Kids have always tried to score booze. Why wouldn't they still try to score drugs?



Well, kids don't try to score beer & cigarettes at school. But right now they go there to buy meth.

BTW you make a very good point about over regulation and over taxation. I never thought about that before.



snyps said:
Mr Khan said:
The bureau of ATF exists for a reason: just because certain, easily abusable items (alcohol, tobacco, firearms) are legal does not mean that the black market has gone away, namely because these things are regulated still for public safety (fighting against moonshine made with engine coolant). While legalization will make strides against use by children and such, it will not vanish entirely.



And the ATF does a nice job at it (barring the exceptions like waco tx and ruby ridge and others). Don't you think the ATF can handle this?

That is true. While i could probably have some heroin on hand in 24 hours if I asked some shadier acquaintances of friends of mine, i wouldn't know where to begin to ask for white lightning around here.



Monster Hunter: pissing me off since 2010.

badgenome said:

Smaller, maybe, but certainly not non-existent. I don't think it would only rely on the underaged. Cigarette smuggling is a big racket because of how high taxes are in certain locales.

It really depends on how onerous the regulations are and how high the taxes. If legal distribution is relegated to dispensaries, then I definitely don't think much would change.

The black market would be significantly smaller and that would reduce crime. Less crime and government spendling less money to regulate what people put in their own bodies are my only concerns.

High taxes would make the black market thrive and therefore they should be kept affordable. Hence, higher taxes just leads to higher crime.



Recently Completed
River City: Rival Showdown
for 3DS (3/5) - River City: Tokyo Rumble for 3DS (4/5) - Zelda: BotW for Wii U (5/5) - Zelda: BotW for Switch (5/5) - Zelda: Link's Awakening for Switch (4/5) - Rage 2 for X1X (4/5) - Rage for 360 (3/5) - Streets of Rage 4 for X1/PC (4/5) - Gears 5 for X1X (5/5) - Mortal Kombat 11 for X1X (5/5) - Doom 64 for N64 (emulator) (3/5) - Crackdown 3 for X1S/X1X (4/5) - Infinity Blade III - for iPad 4 (3/5) - Infinity Blade II - for iPad 4 (4/5) - Infinity Blade - for iPad 4 (4/5) - Wolfenstein: The Old Blood for X1 (3/5) - Assassin's Creed: Origins for X1 (3/5) - Uncharted: Lost Legacy for PS4 (4/5) - EA UFC 3 for X1 (4/5) - Doom for X1 (4/5) - Titanfall 2 for X1 (4/5) - Super Mario 3D World for Wii U (4/5) - South Park: The Stick of Truth for X1 BC (4/5) - Call of Duty: WWII for X1 (4/5) -Wolfenstein II for X1 - (4/5) - Dead or Alive: Dimensions for 3DS (4/5) - Marvel vs Capcom: Infinite for X1 (3/5) - Halo Wars 2 for X1/PC (4/5) - Halo Wars: DE for X1 (4/5) - Tekken 7 for X1 (4/5) - Injustice 2 for X1 (4/5) - Yakuza 5 for PS3 (3/5) - Battlefield 1 (Campaign) for X1 (3/5) - Assassin's Creed: Syndicate for X1 (4/5) - Call of Duty: Infinite Warfare for X1 (4/5) - Call of Duty: MW Remastered for X1 (4/5) - Donkey Kong Country Returns for 3DS (4/5) - Forza Horizon 3 for X1 (5/5)