fishamaphone said: "Responsible for a hell of a lot" and "deserves a lot of respect for it" don't *necissarily* go hand in hand. I fully recognize the former, but the latter isn't a given. Bush is a good example of someone who is "responsible for a hell of a lot," but doesn't even deserve so much as the 25% approval rate he currently sports. Kutaragi did a lot, but it's legitimate to point out that not all of it was good. He marketed two consecutive under-powered machines as over-powered machines, and got away with it. I wouldn't mark that under "good," personally. But then again, I'm posting at 1:00 AM again... maybe ignore this post...

interesting argument so I'll bite! That analogy would work if Ken was responsible for the 3D0, Atari Jaguar and the Virtual Boy. The long and short of it is that under him, Sony launched the two most succesfull home consoles ever. Bush launched the U.S.'s second least succesful War ever (I mean of course the war of 1812, this is tied with Vietnam so far). However, that is for an off topic thread. A horrible, horrible flame ridden off topic thread. Politics belong everywhere except internet forums.

stof said: fishamaphone said: "Responsible for a hell of a lot" and "deserves a lot of respect for it" don't *necissarily* go hand in hand. I fully recognize the former, but the latter isn't a given. Bush is a good example of someone who is "responsible for a hell of a lot," but doesn't even deserve so much as the 25% approval rate he currently sports. Kutaragi did a lot, but it's legitimate to point out that not all of it was good. He marketed two consecutive under-powered machines as over-powered machines, and got away with it. I wouldn't mark that under "good," personally. But then again, I'm posting at 1:00 AM again... maybe ignore this post... interesting argument so I'll bite! That analogy would work if Ken was responsible for the 3D0, Atari Jaguar and the Virtual Boy. The long and short of it is that under him, Sony launched the two most succesfull home consoles ever. Bush launched the U.S.'s second least succesful War ever (I mean of course the war of 1812, this is tied with Vietnam so far). However, that is for an off topic thread. A horrible, horrible flame ridden off topic thread. Politics belong everywhere except internet forums.

Bleh, getting too political for my blood even with that.  I prefer my video games kept as seperate as possible from politics.  I agree with fishamaphone.  Kutaragi got away with selling the weakest system in 2 generations as the most powerful (prior to launch of course).  It worked until his growing megalomania caused him to push a $600 system as cheap, then people starting realizing his was lying about aspects of the PS3 also.  That lead to the first negative media environment Sony had to deal with in 12 years.

Well, to continue the Bush/Kutaragi analogy (not in a political debate kind of way just illustrate a point in a manner already in use) just because I may think Bush did great things his first 5 years doesn't mean the mistake upon mistake of his last 3 can be ignored.  Same with Kutaragi, just because some may think he did great things with the PS1 & 2 doesn't mean the potential disaster that the PS3 may become can be ignored.  With both we'll need more time to fully judge their legacy, which means neither can be called great or a failure at the moment (probably never will be, few fall outright into either category). 

ssj12 said:   Nintendo is to stupid to realize even their fans want to be able to play their CDs/DVDs in their console doesnt mean you guys should take it out on the consoles that can... (xbox, 360, PS, PS2, PS3, DreamCast, SCD, did the Jaguar play Cds?). I know to many people who have griped about their Wiis not being about to play them. Honestly they make a profit on the system.. was to hard to put a $5 diode in the darn thing to read CD/DVD?

 

Cobretti said: ssj12 said:   Nintendo is to stupid to realize even their fans want to be able to play their CDs/DVDs in their console doesnt mean you guys should take it out on the consoles that can... (xbox, 360, PS, PS2, PS3, DreamCast, SCD, did the Jaguar play Cds?). I know to many people who have griped about their Wiis not being about to play them. Honestly they make a profit on the system.. was to hard to put a $5 diode in the darn thing to read CD/DVD?   Lol to be honest i rather use a high quality dvd player to play my dvds then a cheap diode in a console. However i do agree that nintendo have made stupid things. I don't care what anyone says as much as I like nintnedo they shoud of added at least 720p support to the console. SUre 1080p woudl be nice but i'd settle for 720p with decent online mode for gaming instead of those stupid friend codes.

 720 P would have made the console more expensive and ruined the whole idea of it being 'mainstream' and cheaply priced, wouldn't it?

jajajajajaja ken kutaragi in nintendo, and steve jobs in microsoft? jajajajajaja maybe if nintendo turn crazy want suicide and show all the future projects to the competition (ken kutaragi the man in love with the play station, and only who thinks in a playstation 20,21,22, etc jajaja)

ckmlb said: Cobretti said: ssj12 said:   Nintendo is to stupid to realize even their fans want to be able to play their CDs/DVDs in their console doesnt mean you guys should take it out on the consoles that can... (xbox, 360, PS, PS2, PS3, DreamCast, SCD, did the Jaguar play Cds?). I know to many people who have griped about their Wiis not being about to play them. Honestly they make a profit on the system.. was to hard to put a $5 diode in the darn thing to read CD/DVD?   Lol to be honest i rather use a high quality dvd player to play my dvds then a cheap diode in a console. However i do agree that nintendo have made stupid things. I don't care what anyone says as much as I like nintnedo they shoud of added at least 720p support to the console. SUre 1080p woudl be nice but i'd settle for 720p with decent online mode for gaming instead of those stupid friend codes.  720 P would have made the console more expensive and ruined the whole idea of it being 'mainstream' and cheaply priced, wouldn't it?

no they could of sold the console at the same price for less profit that they make now or no profit at all.

Seariously though if the odl xbox is capable of 720p the wii should be able to do it no excuse with minimal cost boosts. Whislt we on this they shoudl of included 5.1 sound.

stof said: fishamaphone said: "Responsible for a hell of a lot" and "deserves a lot of respect for it" don't *necissarily* go hand in hand. I fully recognize the former, but the latter isn't a given. Bush is a good example of someone who is "responsible for a hell of a lot," but doesn't even deserve so much as the 25% approval rate he currently sports. Kutaragi did a lot, but it's legitimate to point out that not all of it was good. He marketed two consecutive under-powered machines as over-powered machines, and got away with it. I wouldn't mark that under "good," personally. But then again, I'm posting at 1:00 AM again... maybe ignore this post... interesting argument so I'll bite! That analogy would work if Ken was responsible for the 3D0, Atari Jaguar and the Virtual Boy. The long and short of it is that under him, Sony launched the two most succesfull home consoles ever. Bush launched the U.S.'s second least succesful War ever (I mean of course the war of 1812, this is tied with Vietnam so far). However, that is for an off topic thread. A horrible, horrible flame ridden off topic thread. Politics belong everywhere except internet forums.

 You're looking at it wrong.  Both succeeded for themselves, possibly at the expense of the industry/world (respectively). 

Kutaragi took machines which were graphically "meh," and used them to push the idea of graphics that are indistinguishable from real life.  So resources were focused on his machine, focused on making realistic graphics, while the competition was actually more capable. 

Bush took a justification for war which was ideologically "meh," and used it to push the idea of a battle for justice and freedom.  So resources were focused on his war, focused on liberating the Iraqi people, while megalomaniacal weather systems named Katrina really deserved all of his attention.

There are already a couple places where the analogy breaks down, but this was more of a vague comparisson to start with.  I want to be clear that I'm *not* saying Kutaragi : gaming industry :: Bush : Iraq.  I'm just saying that while Kutaragi's effect was immense, it may *not* have been positive.