@Soundwave:
You liked the Gamecube right, so then why does it matter how much it sells? As long as it does decently enough for Nintendo to make a new system, then lifes good. Also, I see nothing wrong with Nintendo expanding the market with new types of games/ways to play them while still providing the same gameplay experiences we know n love. Besides, for all we know the Wii would have happened regardless of the Xbox.

Microsoft saved Nintendo if it was not for them Sony would have Steamed rolled the Wii (even with the casual market), Have all the third party games released this gen and would be poised to win next gen. Microsoft slowed the beast that was the PlayStation and made a path for Nintendo to thrive.

HMmm i like his POV too^^^

This isn't really the case though. The Wii really wasn't the successor to the GameCube/N64/SNES at all, it was Nintendo moving in a direction of aiming themselves to non-gamers because they couldn't sustain their console business on only 23 million users that the GameCube sold unfortuantely.

In a lot of ways, the Nintendo of the 80s/90s died when MS entered the game business. I think Nintendo also holds the feeling that they cannot compete with MS' huge money warchest and have to be different now, whereas they never used to operate that way before.

And again, no knock on MS, they have done a great job in the game business, I do like that they have taken Sony down a couple of pegs for sure (because it was needed). I just wish it wasn't at the expense of the traditional Nintendo, which is what I think indirectly has actually occured.

I think it's more likely that Microsoft saved Sony. Sony was so full of hubris that they would have self-destructed completely with their $599 USD stupidity and been abandoned by third parties if the 360 weren't so similar in specs to the PS3 that they could easily port games between the two.

Nintendo would've won that console cycle with "GameCube 2" I think in that case. Sony still would've probably bet the farm on Blu-Ray and Nintendo would've cashed in. There would be no Wii though.

Which to me, wouldn't be the worst thing in the world.

There's nothing wrong with the WiiU, it's gonna be a cracking console, if your so bothered about specs get a gaming pc, Sony/Microsoft can play at been gaming companys but there not, I'll support a company with history and tradition, How anyone can call themselfs a gamer and not support a "gaming" company, the only real one left, then your not a true gamer in my eyes, maybe if you supported Nintendo 3rd party games would sell better and would have better hardware, support the heart and soul of the industry Nintendo!!

I always supposed ms was using the xbox as vehicle for windows as they almost did nothing for gamers before xbox(some flight sims,a little bit realtime strategy)and they've proven me right since kinect
but they were really important for competition since Sega left the hardware business as nintendo became lazy in the early 90ies and was missusing its monopol and sony became arrogant with the ps2 .
Without microsoft console internet standard would be now on Wii standard(sony)
and almost non-existing on nintendo systems(its still pretty shitty)
Nintendo owners who aren't interessted in internet don't care about this but most gamers do.

The thing ms should not have been allowed to do was buying rare-Rare was almost useless for MS but it hurted nintendo a lot as they have lost lots of home console core users since then and some interessting franchises.(i bet wii u sales would be twice as high with Rare on nintendos side)
On the other hand Nintendo did something similar with exclusiving monster hunter or dragon quest for handhelds though they already had 70%+ handheld market share.Greedy bastards trying to monopolize handheld market though they already were too big and too fat.Since than(and considering nintendos low tech hardwars) i think they get right now what they deserve.

I think nintendo is just now paying the price for ignoring competition hardware and internet-wise.this is not microsofts fault.

I disagree.

Oh yeah I don't want to give the impression that Microsoft is in the wrong here at all. They're not. They've made an honest effort and deserve whatever success they have.

Nintendo deserves a lot of the fault for their issues.

That said, I still feel like the GameCube was a pretty darn good effort that went largely underappreciated and pushed Nintendo into a direction that I and I think a lot of other people didn't like.

So just from *that* POV, I can't help but wonder what the game business would be like today if MS wasn't around. No offense to XBox fans.