By using this site, you agree to our Privacy Policy and our Terms of Use. Close

Forums - Politics - Does the religious myth benefit modern society or not?

 

Is religion a benefit

Yes religion is a benefit to society 61 36.75%
 
No religion does not benefit society 31 18.67%
 
Religion is not helpfull but harmfull 61 36.75%
 
See results 12 7.23%
 
Total:165
LilChicken22 on 04 May 2013
nuckles87 said:
Just copy and paste the link.

It's going down in America, but its growing worldwide, largely in the third world. So regardless, on a WORLD WIDE scale you are quite correct. Interesting, but not surprising. I imagine there are still many potential converts in the third world. I believe Islam is growing as well in these areas.

I found this article about the increased IQ ( http://pespmc1.vub.ac.be/FLYNNEFF.html ). The highest gain was around 1970>1985 when they started developing the first computers and learned to program.



Around the Network
nuckles87 on 04 May 2013

If it weren't religion being divisive or harmful to the world, it would have been ethnicity, nationality, or lord knows what else. Humanity will always find a way to categorize, demonize, and hate itself, regardless of whether or not organized religion exists.



Max King of the Wild on 04 May 2013
nuckles87 said:
Just copy and paste the link.

It's going down in America, but its growing worldwide, largely in the third world. So regardless, on a WORLD WIDE scale you are quite correct. Interesting, but not surprising. I imagine there are still many potential converts in the third world. I believe Islam is growing as well in these areas.



I just looked at wiki because I knew it was increasing world wide. I would also think islam is going also and other religions that believe in god as well. Lil chicken has made 2 outrageous claims in this thread. I also don't want to challenge him on his knowledge of DNA because frankly... I need to go study ALLLLL about it for my final next week



richardhutnik on 04 May 2013
Jay520 said:
richardhutnik said:
Jay520 said:
Ji99saw said:
I hate when people discuss religion on this VGC, it's cringe worthy to read some of the comments from the some comments from people that swear there more intelligent than others because they "don't believe in any thing but themselves" and yet fail to realize how important religion is on a fundamental level. It's sad to see people fumble in ignorance.

OT- Religion built almost all the foundations we have today. Law,Order, Justice, Love, Right and Wrong. If it were not for some type of religion we would be mostly feral and kill each other over territory and resources (more than we already do) and it would be complete chaos.


You might have a point if you were referring to more ancient civilizations...maybe. But this thread is talking about modern society where religion is no longer necessary for structure, so you don't really have a long to stand on here. Especially considering many modern civilizations do just well without a strong emphasis on religion.

What you have seen in modern societies, particular those of western secular nations, is an increase in the role of secular government to do things done prior to religious based societies.  You see in individuals who will call for smaller government, IF they care to even address what is done for people, how somehow religious organizations are supposed to step in the gaps.  But the trend is ever increasing growth of government in societies without a religious base to them, and them filling in these roles.  And ethics ends up also mainly being a matter of the person who is most expedient politically.


uhh....thanks for the information, but I am not sure I understand your point. Do you agree or disagree?

Just saying that societies that have less religious organizations active in them is bound to get more government agencies involved.  Secularization comes with bigger government.  Now there is also the push for the Libertarian bent, but then the will of the public prevents society from lacking certain things.  So, end result is more government.

I was just commenting, not agreeing or disagreeing.



oldschoolfool on 04 May 2013

Your opinion is awesome.



Around the Network
SlayerRondo on 04 May 2013
ArnoldRimmer said:
SlayerRondo said:

Given my recent discussion on the VGChartz forums I have found myself in a discussion that without religion we will be a me-centric society. 

I just can't get my head around this at all. I myself care about the wellbeing of other's despite being an athiest and do so through chritable works as well as many of the people i work with. And unlike many christian charities we don't go around to people trying to convert them in return for aid. Not to mention that Warren Buffet and Bill Gates are both athiest but are the largest charitable donators in the world.

While i'm not trying to say that the religious are less willing to help other's I certainly reject the view that athiest are me-centric.

Opinion's?

My opinion is that you are indeed egoistic/self-centric - just like every other human. I'd say that the difference between religious people and others is not about who of both is egoistic/self-centric, but how that egoism shows.

I've once read that there is a theological belief that concepts like "heaven" and "hell" are necessary to keep humans from negative behaviour, and there might indeed be a certain truth to that.

For example, imagine I saw you standing on a bridge, willing to end your life. If I were a strong believer in heaven and hell, I would probably try to stop you from doing so and do anything to help you instead - but I might indeed only do so because I believe this will benefit me in my afterlife by reducing the danger of going to hell and improving the chance of going to heaven.

If, however, I was completely sure that there is no afterlife, my reaction might be completely different: I might instead try to figure out if you're leaving a big-breasted blonde behind that soon needs some solace, take your wallet and car (you're not going to need them anymore anyway) and then help you achieve your goal.

This is why I think that in practice, religious beliefs might indeed lead to a certain tendency to make people behave in a way that seems less egoistic.

I did not mean to imply that i am not egoistic/self centric nor that there were any people who wern't. What i meant was that i did not let my egoistic/self centric aspects stop me from caring from others.



This is the Game of Thrones

Where you either win

or you DIE

SlayerRondo on 04 May 2013
richardhutnik said:
SlayerRondo said:

Given my recent discussion on the VGChartz forums I have found myself in a discussion that without religion we will be a me-centric society. 

I just can't get my head around this at all. I myself care about the wellbeing of other's despite being an athiest and do so through chritable works as well as many of the people i work with. And unlike many christian charities we don't go around to people trying to convert them in return for aid. Not to mention that Warren Buffet and Bill Gates are both athiest but are the largest charitable donators in the world.

While i'm not trying to say that the religious are less willing to help other's I certainly reject the view that athiest are me-centric.

Opinion's?

Unless you are part of a system of belief that has standards agreed to and are beyond individuals themselves, and is something people who agree to the system buy into, you can't help BUT be me-centered in regards to what you consider truth and goodness.  Everthing you will be doing will be based on your measure of what is acceptable.  Being me-centric doesn't mean that you can't have concern for others, it is just the end reason for your concern for others are to placate some sensibilities of yours. 

What you see with human history is the annoying trend for individuals to end up rationalizing all sorts of horrible behaviors to justify what they do.  Almost everyone thinks themselves innocent, or end up going "the devil made me do it".

Even in this, in most cases, the reason why you do charity is because you don't want to be thought of as a bad person, or it makes you feel good, or something else.

But just because it's what you consider truth and goodness does not mean it's inferior to that of a belief system. A belief system (or as you mean a religious belief system) is just as me-centric and selfish as not having a religious belief system as people are still doing things for their own afterlife in most cases rather than because they don't want other people to suffer needlessly in the world.

And yes people end up using all kinds of stupid rationalization's for their actions but as a scociety it has become harder and harder for people to come up with bad justification's as people can easily shoot them down. Religion is an exeption as all one need do is claim god said something and can get people of the religion to follow it without thinking about it's morality.

Sure individuals may not be perfect but they often come together in common cause for the greater good as part of a community that is not religiously associated and when societies morals improve, most of the good people will change their morals as well while most religions will not if it conflicts with their outdated morality.

And maybe the reason why YOU think that people only help others for me-centric reasons (of which organized religion is certainly one of them) is because you are an incredibly me-centric person.



This is the Game of Thrones

Where you either win

or you DIE

slowmo on 04 May 2013

I consider myself a aethiest as I don't believe in god. Yet I will happily goto church to celebrate baptism, weddings, etc. I even have 3 god children despite my views. The point is that while I don't necessarily believe in the spirituality of the religion I do quite like the traditional and ethics they encourage you to practice. Sometimes you accept a white lie for the greater good (Santa).



scat398 on 04 May 2013
drkohler said:
scat398 said:
AbbathTheGrim said:

This is so true. Whenever I watch the news for the Middle-East, I can see the top-notch state of those internal organs from the people that were bombed to pieces after some religious driven bombing.

Or those wonderful people that walk among you that commit suicide because their secular living does not place importance in the value of life.  ... See how it works both ways, religion does provide benefit and has provided far more good in the world than evil.

So you are saying each and every person who commited suicide was non-religious? Interesting attitude. Easily disprovable, but if it keeps you happy, so be it.

That's actually not what i said but fortunately we have this great thing called research that shows people of faith are less likely to commit suicide, they are also shown to be happier overall.  Do you find this to be a difficult truth to accept.  The person I responded too originally had made a horrific and frankly very foolish statement and I was simply pointing out the flaw.



the2real4mafol on 05 May 2013
richardhutnik said:
Ji99saw said:
nuckles87 said:

Religion, in the long run, does not help or hurt society. Religion is not the only thing that keeps us moral, but if it didn't exist I'm sure people who use it to spread hatred and bigotry would just find something else.

Ji99saw said:

OT- Religion built almost all the foundations we have today. Law,Order, Justice, Love, Right and Wrong. If it were not for some type of religion we would be mostly feral and kill each other over territory and resources (more than we already do) and it would be complete chaos.

 

Religion did not build any of that, humanity did. Humanity cannot EXIST without some version of these values. Those things have all existed for as long as humanity has existed. Religion is,  at best, merely a manifestation of these believes that links them to thiestic myths.


What??  That's utterly ridiculous give me one example of this in a previous or modern society with no roots to any religion

Communist nations pretty much are like this.  Of course, when a communist nation ends up working, it takes on religious trappings.

Communist countries still have a religion, it's not the traditional religion anymore though but the state and the leader become the religion through rediculous propaganda



Xbox Series, PS5 and Switch (+ Many Retro Consoles)

'When the people are being beaten with a stick, they are not much happier if it is called the people's stick'- Mikhail Bakunin

Prediction: Switch 2 will outsell the PS5 by 2030