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Forums - Sony - Vita needs permanent $169.99 price drop. Here's why.

BuckStud on 27 December 2012
VGKing said:
the_dengle said:
VGKing said:
the_dengle said:
VGKing said:
the_dengle said:

lol. Yes, people like me. It's funny how a little over a year ago, Vita outselling the 3DS was an inevitability, and now it's "an unrealistic feat."

Of course, it is unrealistic now. Sony doesn't have to outsell the 3DS, and that's good, because they can't. What they do need is to sell well enough to stay afloat and continue receiving software support. They're not doing that right now. In order to do that, they need a price cut and a rebranding.

And sure the PS3 didn't need saving in 2006; that's why it got a price cut in 2007, right? Also note that I never said the Vita had to outsell the 3DS. It was the OP that stated Sony needs to make drastic changes to save the Vita.

That was back when Vita and 3DS were supposed to be $250. Can you blame people for thinking Vita would outsell the 3DS? If 3DS didn't do a price cut maybe Vita would have...

You should check the second article again. It was written in October 2011, two months after the 3DS price cut. And I recall at least a few VGChartz users, even after the Vita's launch, claiming it would ultimately surpass the 3DS*. As for the bolded, that's downright preposterous. The week before the price cut (25th week in Japan), the 3DS had sold over 3.5 million units. The Vita just passed that point a couple of weeks ago, almost a full year after its release. 3DS sales still would be been in the 15-20 million range at least, and it probably would have gotten a price cut regardless when the XL launched.

*And... by golly, one of the users springing to the defense of the Vita in that thread was you!

"Think of Xbox as the PSP.
The Xbox 360 as the Vita.

Be afraid. Be very afraid."

Can't imagine what you could have meant by that if you weren't claiming the Vita would be able to contend with the 3DS. And you said that not only well after the 3DS price cut, but after the Vita had launched in all major regions. I take it you are not still so optimistic?

Apart from all that, all you have to remember is that Sony themselves expected to sell three times as many Vitas as they will this fiscal year, which would have put them at least in the vicinity of 3DS's first year sales.

From the same thread you linked to. This is my comment http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=4444529

"Did we learn nothing with the PSP and DS?

The most affordable console always ends up selling the most. Nintendo would have to screw up really bad or Sony would have to have some genius marketing and tons of dev support for Vita to win this gen."

And yet...

"I think Vita has a chance  to outsell the 3DS. Not now, not in 6 months. Let's see where Vita sales stand in 18-24 months compared to 3DS."

"The point is that if Sony could sell ~60million PS3s(and counting) with such a horrible launch and high price, an $80 difference between Vita and 3DS won't be as much of an obstacle as the high PS3 price.  Vita is affordbale despite many people asking for a price cut."

"Vita could outsell 3DS; the price isn't a huge obstacle" is a pretty big change from "the most affordable console always sells the most." And although it is only 8 months later, it is pretty clear where the situation will be in another 12. Optimistic suggestions for 2013 Vita sales are in the 6-7 million range, while pessimistic suggestions for 3DS sales are in the 13-14 million range. The sales gap by the end of next year will easily be in excess of 30 million units.

It was not my intention to turn this into a personal attack on your position. I'm just trying to show that it was SONY fans, and in fact Sony themselves, who set the expectations for Vita sales as equal to or better than the 3DS -- NOT Nintendo fans. As evidenced by the OP claiming that Sony needs to make "drastic changes" to compete with the 3DS.

Look at when I posted that comment. February 28. That's like Vita launch week. Do I still think Vita can outsell 3DS? No. Things change, who could have predicted Nintendo would drop the price. Anyway I love how you left out the second part of that second comment:

"Vita will probably struggle until the holidays. After the holidays word of mouth will be really high and the install base will be high enough to satisfy 3rd party developers."

That was my prediction and it seems I was spot on, at least the first part. Holidays sales are much better than earlier in the year, but still not at healthy levels like I thought.

I take no offense in you disagreeing with me, you looking up my posts for way back in February is borderline stalking...but I'm good.

So here's my new prediction. Feel free to bookmark for next year:

Vita will continue selling poorly until it receives a price cut especially in Japan. Games are obviously a must as well. I don't expect any game to be a Killer-App next year or to single-handedly revive the Vita, but I do expect a combination of mid-tier games to really help the Vita hype once word of the price cut is in full effect. I can't predict its sales, but I can predict it won't outsell the 3DS, not that it needs it to be successful though.

Dude, Nintendo dropped the price of the 3DS long before you make those comments....so I guess anyone could have "predicted it"...

Holiday levels were better in part to people like myself who already owned a Vita but bought the Assassins Creed bundle at the super low $179.99 price that Amazon was selling it for....it kind of made me wish that I hadn't bought the original one at such a high price as it was collecting dust most the the time anyway......





Stop hating and start playing.

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Kynes on 27 December 2012
VGKing said:
..

Vita will continue selling poorly until it receives a price cut especially in Japan. Games are obviously a must as well. I don't expect any game to be a Killer-App next year or to single-handedly revive the Vita, but I do expect a combination of mid-tier games to really help the Vita hype once word of the price cut is in full effect. I can't predict its sales, but I can predict it won't outsell the 3DS, not that it needs it to be successful though.


Saying this and nothing is the same. This prediction is so vague that you can always say it's true. I mean, if it sells more than 4 millions next year you can say you were right, as it would sell more than in 2012.



VGKing on 27 December 2012
Kynes said:
VGKing said:
..

Vita will continue selling poorly until it receives a price cut especially in Japan. Games are obviously a must as well. I don't expect any game to be a Killer-App next year or to single-handedly revive the Vita, but I do expect a combination of mid-tier games to really help the Vita hype once word of the price cut is in full effect. I can't predict its sales, but I can predict it won't outsell the 3DS, not that it needs it to be successful though.


Saying this and nothing is the same. This prediction is so vague that you can always say it's true. I mean, if it sells more than 4 millions next year you can say you were right, as it would sell more than in 2012.

Some Nintendo fans in this forum seem to have this belief that Sony fans think the Vita will make make a comeback and outsell the 3DS or something. I'm saying I'm not one of those people despite what my comments earlierin the year may have stated.

Of course my prediction is vague, but it is also realistic and within the realm of reality. You can't predict miracles and I'm sure as hell not counting on one to happen next year for the Vita.



Wlakiz on 28 December 2012
BuckStud said:
Wlakiz said:
You guys aren't taking in account of other factors.

1. Can supply keep up with the increased demand if they lowered the price?
- They can definitely sell more at a a loss but what is the point? They don't have the supply to cater to market demand at that price point. When they become overstocked (due to lack of sale), its an automated process that they will do a price cut to purge their stock even at a loss but until then, the price is fine where it is.

2. 3DS and PSVita are different enough in capability that they each cater to a different demographic market (age, gamer, income-earner). Which means, if someone buys a 3Ds, it doesn't mean they won't buy PSVita and vice Versa. So 3Ds taking a massive mobile gaming market share right now should not have an effect on the life time sale of the PSVita.

3. PSMobile - Sony is pushing their PSM platform similar to google play/IOS. Until the games/Apps numbers hit critical mass, there is no reason to damage the brand, by getting more people on board to a 'lack-of-content' platform.

Sony has stated before, their strategy for vita is to for their content to be the incentive for people to buy their vita not the price.

1. Sony would be more than happy to produce (and very capable of having them produced) 1m Vita's a month if they thought that they could sell them. They even projected that the first full fiscal year that they would sell 16m of them, then dropped it to 12m then again to 10m. They're going to be lucky if they sell 5m.

2. Your competition selling a similar product to yours always has an effect. Every young person who gets a 3DS for Christmas is another person helping your competition. Some of them may eventually get a Vita, but that isn't enough.

3. Sony looses money on every Vita sold but makes money on all software after cost. They can't afford to lower the price of the Vita by much, otherwise they would have already. Printer companies have sold their printers at a loss for years, then make the money back on the ink they sell. It's similar, but they were typically able to recoup their cost quickly as ink cost pennies per unit and next to nothing to develop, where as the bigger Vita titles cost many millions to develop. The low number of Vita's currently sold is very harmful to their bottom line. Anyone who believes that the Vita has been an overall money maker for Sony, truly doesn't understand business.

1. It is a basic supply and demand problem. If they wanted to sell 100 million.. set their vita price to $1 and see how the market would react. A good example is the HP's TouchPad, as soon as a substantial price reduction came in place, the tablet became the second fastest selling tablet but thats not what they want.

2. Thats like saying anyone who buys a Civic is hurting the Ferrari sales. VIta is not catering to grandmothers and 10 year olds. They are catering to teens -> adult players that can and would spend money on downloadable apps and games.

3. Are you even addressing my point or making a tangent one? No one cares about whether or not Vita is making a profit or a loss for Sony. You can make wild assumptions that "Sony would have done blah blah if they were making money", but the fact is that you don't have facts. Companies do whatever they can do to maximize profit/sell while factoring in other things like royalty and licencing fees. As PSP/Wii shown, having hardware sold does not equate to software sells. The average PSP owners only own 3 games (IIRC). Even wii, the users are usually just content with Wii sport and don't bother purchasing anymore software. PS Mobile is suppose to mimic the mobile phenomenon by capitalizing on user-generated content. Even if third parties don't pick up PS Vita, if PS Mobile hit critical mass, it would have enough content to be self-sustaining.



HappySqurriel on 28 December 2012
Wlakiz said:

1. It is a basic supply and demand problem. If they wanted to sell 100 million.. set their vita price to $1 and see how the market would react. A good example is the HP's TouchPad, as soon as a substantial price reduction came in place, the tablet became the second fastest selling tablet but thats not what they want.

2. Thats like saying anyone who buys a Civic is hurting the Ferrari sales. VIta is not catering to grandmothers and 10 year olds. They are catering to teens -> adult players that can and would spend money on downloadable apps and games.

3. Are you even addressing my point or making a tangent one? No one cares about whether or not Vita is making a profit or a loss for Sony. You can make wild assumptions that "Sony would have done blah blah if they were making money", but the fact is that you don't have facts. Companies do whatever they can do to maximize profit/sell while factoring in other things like royalty and licencing fees. As PSP/Wii shown, having hardware sold does not equate to software sells. The average PSP owners only own 3 games (IIRC). Even wii, the users are usually just content with Wii sport and don't bother purchasing anymore software. PS Mobile is suppose to mimic the mobile phenomenon by capitalizing on user-generated content. Even if third parties don't pick up PS Vita, if PS Mobile hit critical mass, it would have enough content to be self-sustaining.

Just on #2 ...

I don't think any manufacturer doesn't want any particular demographic using their system, and they would be more than happy to have the additional sales by capturing a broader market, but they do focus on particular demographics where they can be successful. This is substantially different than Ferrari vs. Civic, or any luxury item vs consumer item, because they often don't want a broad demographic using their product because it dilutes its elite status.

Now there is an undisputed area where the PS-Vita more than any other platform is in direct competition with Nintendo: developers. Smaller budget developers for PS-Vita games are very likely to be reallocated to managing larger budget 3DS games, while larger PS-Vita developers are likely to be reallocated to managing lower budget Wii U games; because the small PS-Vita developers are generally too big to be profitable with mobile game development, and the large PS-Vita developers are too small to be effective with PS4 or XBox 720 games.

Basically, it is unlikely that Nintendo could "capture" many of the elite level developers that are producing HD console games currently, but the mid to low budget HD console developers and the mid to large budget PS-Vita developers are actually a very good match for the Wii U; and these same developers are actually a good match for the PS-Vita which puts them in competition for these developers.



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mysticwolf on 28 December 2012

The thing is, I'm not sure if they can afford to lower the price that much. I'm not sure if they have a big enough profit margin.



 Been away for a bit, but sneaking back in.

Gaming on: PS4, PC, 3DS. Got a Switch! Mainly to play Smash

PlaystaionGamer on 28 December 2012
Attoyou said:

Vita needs/should have been a lot of things

- Should have kept this look (with a few changes) 

 

- Should be $199

- Should have stolen Dragon quest or kept monster hunter 

- Should of had Naughty Dog working on a New IP for Vita (and out around launch) 

- Should have been called PSP2.  People just think its a new psp like psp go

- Should have been able to BC psp games

- Should have come out before last xmas. 

Vita would have been a hit. 


Agreed. It shouldn't have looked like a PSP. It should have looked like the GO. 



KHlover on 28 December 2012
PlaystaionGamer said:
Attoyou said:

Vita needs/should have been a lot of things

- Should have kept this look (with a few changes) 

 

- Should be $199

- Should have stolen Dragon quest or kept monster hunter 

- Should of had Naughty Dog working on a New IP for Vita (and out around launch) 

- Should have been called PSP2.  People just think its a new psp like psp go

- Should have been able to BC psp games

- Should have come out before last xmas. 

Vita would have been a hit. 


Agreed. It shouldn't have looked like a PSP. It should have looked like the GO. 

I think the PSPgo looked horrible, I can't even describe this thing with words. But each to his own, I guess...



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Squilliam on 28 December 2012

Actually what it needs is 8-16GB built in flash memory that way you can buy a PS Vita at the store and not have to pay for one of the stupidly overpriced memory cards right from the start.



Tease.

benao87 on 28 December 2012

I honestly don't know what they can do. Game division just turned operationally profitable, but they still have a net loss. They must be readying everything for the launch of PS4, a costly price cut wouldn't seem to comfortable to the delicate financial situation of Sony.
Then again, they need it so badly to keep being relevant, which developer would want to throw a project to a console with such a small install base.



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