Sega fans blame the PSX for destroying the Saturn adn they blame the PS2 for killing the Dreamcast and forcing Sega out of the hardware business.

Sega of America only had themselves to blame, alienating third parties. If you alienate third parties you alienate a good chuck of your base and Sega survived purely off of first party and a couple of third party games. That wasn't enough to help the Saturn and they failed to pay attention to trends when not only did they repeat the same mistakes, but also never pushed format to DVD. They were pirated to hell.

How some of the most vocal "Sony fans" behave on this site it's no wonder Nin/MS fans "team" up

Yet, if the PSX and PS2 never existed Sega would have been able to recover. Sega made plenty of mistakes, but after Sony took over and controlled the gaming market Sega sufficated. Playstation was the new cool and even though the Dreamcast did everything right and had the best games, people waited for the promises Sony made about the PS2.

I think that if the Playstation never existed games like MGS, FF7, and Crash Bandicoot would have all been Sega Saturn games. Obviously if that were the case Sega would have been in a completely different position leading into the Dreamcast and beyond.

Regardless of the debate as to why Sega was forced out of the hardware market, Sega fans often feel that the Playstation had a lot to do with Sega's downward spiral.

Not true, Sony expanded the market.Sega consoles never sold that much to begin with when you look at the amount of consoles they've shipped from generation to generation. The Genesis was pretty much it for them and even that couldnt properly compete with Nintendo. Before Sony entered the console race home consoles were frowned upon and Nintendo dominated a console race that at best commanded ninety million consoles. When Sony entered the console race they increased the userbase to two hundred million consoles and solidified consoles in the media as potent multimedia electronics. Sony saught respect for gaming consoles,and gained the respect of the wealth of third parties at a staggering pace. Sega was in a downward spiral regardless of the existence of Sony. Nintendo was butchering Sega and Sony showed both how you create a dominant console and stay ahead of trends, because after all they were a hardware company. You pirate their format, they'll just make another one. Microsoft at that point was notified of Sonys market dominance and the increase in the size of the gaming market and saw the console industry as a visible threat to their multimedia dominance because of their then monopoly over PC OS and was talked into making a console to cut down Sonys marketshare.

Most Ninty fans are quite nice, most of them.

I don't think it means what you think it means... :P

The big industry mindset started with sony, not MS.

If you don't believe me, just listen to their E3 1995 where they talk about how they want to hollywoodize the game industry.

and they suceeded....

I'm a Nintendo fan and love my 360 (or 360s). I actually know a lot of Nintendo fans who also own an Xbox and regularly play. PS3 is a little less present among those people.