I did pay for the best console. You didn't address my question at all. Do so, or leave the thread. Thanks.

I did in my origional reply. You pay for the best or you play a Wii or PS3. Online offcourse.

You seem to struggle with retention/comprehension or some other learning disability. I bolded the question that you supposedly answered. It's a simple yes or no, neither of which you stated. You're presenting the same convoluted argument that I have been attempting to bypass with others in this thread. Address the question, or leave the thread.

Sorry if my explanation warrants simpler words.

No it is not. For what you get and the ease of its use, it is not. You pay for the best or you dont get it at all.

But if you want me to get more judical on you, extortion is a criminal offense and carries hefty penalties. MS has been doing this since 2002. Legally. With millions of willing paying customers. No court has ever convicted MS of extortion.

So there, in a more literal judical sense, Live isn't extortion because they have never been convicted of it in a court of law.

Your move :P

You haven't read the thread, so I'll allow you some forgiveness. Extortion has already been defined multiple times, and it does not only pertain to legal consequences.

You don't seem to understand the point I'm making. You keep packaging Xbox360 with Xbox Live as some big package. They are completely independent things, yes? Okay, good. Moving on...

Can you play games online without XBL? No, you cannot. MS does not create the multiplayer aspect of the game you've purchased, but it is locking you out from being able to use that content (that they had nothing to do with).

I couldn't care less if you feel the service is superior. That isn't even relevant to this discussion we're having. Remove your bias for one second and be objective.

He's not talking about that kind of extortion though. I think what he means is more along the lines of a convenience store charging $6 for a gallon of milk.

Either way what he doesn't seem to understand is it's all subjective. A few bucks a month for far and away the best online service console gamers have available to them might seem like extortion to him but it doesn't mean it's extortion to someone else. The type of extortion YOU are talking about is clear and definitive. If MS were standing next to us with a flamethrower pointed at our 360 saying their trigger finger might slip unless we sign up for a year of Live Gold, ok, that is clear extortion. But a company charging for something another company does not charge for when the service they provide is superior.. that isn't. It might seem so to others, but it's not factual, it's opinion.

Of course he'll chime in and say that MS is essentially standing over your games telling you they're worthless unless you pay for Live Gold but again, how is that extortion? Is it extortion for Sony to take away your PS+ games when you stop paying them? You have a choice, one he himself made so his ignorance regarding extortion is amusing.

What J_allard said.

Both of you are completely incapable of realizing the situation.

You are basically being charged for subscription-based multiplayer, only that subscription should be going to the game developers as they are the ones who create the multiplayer aspect of the game and support it. Not Microsoft, yet MS is reaping the rewards. Why do you think COD attempted to institute that subscription pro nonsense?

I understand you feel as though the package is worth it, that isn't an issue. The issue is the lockout of content that has nothing to do with MS by MS. What if you had to start paying your Computer maker for online gaming? What if you had to pay your Television maker to use the internet on internet capable TVs?

How you can say this model isn't extortion is really beyond belief. Maybe I am just poorly explaining it, but you should be able to see what I am attempting to convey to you. This isn't an attack on Xbox360 owners who pay for Live, it's an attack on Microsoft for extortion.

its not extorition becuase there is a clear choice. the facts are known before the system is bought, not after. Its really that simple.

Extortion happens when people have no choice, like in a disaster someone racking up the price of needed goods. a $15 bag of bread is only extorion when it happens after a disaster, after choices have been taken away through a natural disaster.

with xbox live they have a choice to not buy the system and instead get one that has free online. there is no way you can twist xbox live into being extortion. if it was they would be breaking the law as extrotion is illegal. so the governments of the world do not agree with you either.

It's exceedingly tedious to have to address the definition of extortion every other post. Can you guys read the last few pages of a thread before posting something that has already been resolved? Thanks, it would really be beneficial moving forward.