DanneSandin said: zumnupy10 said: DanneSandin said: weaveworld said: Since Sony is in seriously bad weather they may even delay bringing a next console to the market. The Microsoft plan sounds really half-ass to me. Maybe i don't see the point yet, im a slow learner they say ;P. Anyways, as i think next-gen isn't really nescesarry at the moment (yeah that's just personal) sony might be able to profit from the early release of the next xbox and continue to dominate 'this gen'. I don't know if developers will buy that. It would make room for more smaller companies to step in on the market and maybe we get to see some gems like in the days of old. I personally think that delaying ps4 to 2014 would be a mistake and they'd end up in last place next gen... Which in turn could mean that it's the last playstation. At the very latest PS4 will launch in spring 2014. And that's pushing it. I guess the Xbox Lite (I like that name more) would be for those who's interested in Apple TV or whatever it's called. It's also a great competitor against the Wii U for those who likes the features of Wii U but don't wanna play the games... There's a lot of people out there not playing games, and wouldn't pay for a gaming console. But an entertainment box with the added bonus of some light hearted games on the other hand... I really disagree with the overall opinion that Sony has to be Nº 1, next gen. Being on the top in sales is great.  But being profitable is far more important for Sony nowadays. If they had to choose between being Nº 1 in sales but lose money in the process or Sell less but get a good profit. I think they would go with the second option. I think you and I are on the same page here. I'm saying exactly the same thing as you are. PS4 needs to be profitable for Sony. And that's why I think it'll be closer to Wii U's power.

Sony is in a tough position.

Making a console similar to Wii U in power won't work for them.  It might work for Nintendo because Wii U is a big leap from Wii.

Sony really should make a console that is a big jump in tecnology from PS3 and do the same as MS with their subsidized console, using PS+

Jay520 said: DanneSandin said:   Regarding your first post; I'm actually agreeing that x3ox will be a relative failure if it's too powerful; it'll only receive ports from WiiStation that don't use the whole power of the console, meaning that MS will be throwing away money on specs that won't get utilized. And that's why I think that all 3 consoles will be similar in power and receive all 3rd party multiplats, and this could be why Wii U might win next gen imo. I don't think I ever stated that devs will make games too powerful for PS4 to handle. If so, please link it cuz that has to be a mistake =p I think that Wii U and PS4 will be similar in power (but with PS4 being the strongest out of the 2). Devs will try to keep costs down as much as possible, even furthering my point of PS4 and Wii U being similar in power... DanneSandin said: Yes, I agree with that if the 3 consoles are similar in power Wii U will win next gen, simply because they have their 1st party games. But I don't know what else there is to do for Sony. MS could always up the specs, and try to gain market share by being the most powerful console. But what of Sony? What can they do? They can't compete with Nintendo's 1st party, nor can they compete in terms of power with MS, since MS have so much more money and can outspend Sony... No matter how things play out, I'm quite certain PS4 will end up last next gen.   Here, you're stating that Microsoft could make a powerful console and gain marketshare. The only way they could do this is if they dominated 3rd party support. And the only way the Nextbox could dominate 3rd party support via power is if the 3rd party games are too powerful to be fully experienced on the PS4 Otherwise, if the games were the same on the PS4, then there would be no reason the Nextbox would gain 3rd party support or why they would gain marketshare. How else could the Nextbox use power to gain marketshare, if not by using that power to attract exclusive 3rd party support? That seems to be the only way power could theoretically lead to higher sales.

i fully agree with your analysis. if ms is to dominate next gen with a powerful console its because of third party support making games too powerful for either ps4 or wii u to play. but i dont see that happening. games costs much as it is, and selling on only one console means fewer games sold, meaning less profits. x3ox needs to be the next ps2 for this to happen, and thats not very likely. 

what ms and sony needs to do is making powerful systems that wii u cant compete with, or else nintendo is set to dominate this gen as well. question is can sony afford this?

zumnupy10 said: DanneSandin said: zumnupy10 said: DanneSandin said: weaveworld said: Since Sony is in seriously bad weather they may even delay bringing a next console to the market. The Microsoft plan sounds really half-ass to me. Maybe i don't see the point yet, im a slow learner they say ;P. Anyways, as i think next-gen isn't really nescesarry at the moment (yeah that's just personal) sony might be able to profit from the early release of the next xbox and continue to dominate 'this gen'. I don't know if developers will buy that. It would make room for more smaller companies to step in on the market and maybe we get to see some gems like in the days of old. I personally think that delaying ps4 to 2014 would be a mistake and they'd end up in last place next gen... Which in turn could mean that it's the last playstation. At the very latest PS4 will launch in spring 2014. And that's pushing it. I guess the Xbox Lite (I like that name more) would be for those who's interested in Apple TV or whatever it's called. It's also a great competitor against the Wii U for those who likes the features of Wii U but don't wanna play the games... There's a lot of people out there not playing games, and wouldn't pay for a gaming console. But an entertainment box with the added bonus of some light hearted games on the other hand... I really disagree with the overall opinion that Sony has to be Nº 1, next gen. Being on the top in sales is great.  But being profitable is far more important for Sony nowadays. If they had to choose between being Nº 1 in sales but lose money in the process or Sell less but get a good profit. I think they would go with the second option. I think you and I are on the same page here. I'm saying exactly the same thing as you are. PS4 needs to be profitable for Sony. And that's why I think it'll be closer to Wii U's power. Sony is in a tough position. Making a console similar to Wii U in power won't work for them.  It might work for Nintendo because Wii U is a big leap from Wii. Sony really should make a console that is a big jump in tecnology from PS3 and do the same as MS with their subsidized console, using PS+

i agree that sony needs the ps4 to be a major leap over wii u. only question is; can they afford it? its looking rather bleak to be honest...

I can't really see MS releasing 2 different consoles, thereby fragmenting their userbase and limiting the number of games they can sell on either console. If anything, they'll just continue supporting the current 360 and turn it into some crazy casual party machine, while at the same time releasing the 720 and fully supporting that with new games of all genres. Not just core ones, 'cos that would severely limit it, too.

DanneSandin said: i fully agree with your analysis. if ms is to dominate next gen with a powerful console its because of third party support making games too powerful for either ps4 or wii u to play. but i dont see that happening. games costs much as it is, and selling on only one console means fewer games sold, meaning less profits. x3ox needs to be the next ps2 for this to happen, and thats not very likely.  what ms and sony needs to do is making powerful systems that wii u cant compete with, or else nintendo is set to dominate this gen as well. question is can sony afford this?

Sony shouldn't have a difficult time making the PS4 noticeably more powerful than the Wii U. Reports show that the Wii U costs about $180 to manufacture (excluding the Gamepad since it doesn't contribute to power). When the time the PS4 launches, the Wii U's manufacturering cost will be down even lower. Sony could release a $350-380 console while making a profit releasing it at $400. That would be a situation where the PS4 costs approximately double that of the Wii U. The PS4 would be easily more powerful than the Wii U and Sony wouldn't be risking too much money.

I agree with most of this post, with a couple of exceptions.

 

1.  Sony Entertainment is profitable for Sony, which could become a blessing or a curse.  They may see the need to maintain their current market position, regardless of cost, or go cheap next gen so they don't start losing money in a profitable devision.  Pay attention to share holder meetings, not forums, for the answers to that.

2.  Microsoft has already launched surface, and I believe developers will use surface and the Wii U pad interchangeably for easier ports.  Sony also has PlayStation software on cell phones and tablets, so expect all three to be used similarly.  Difference is, Sony and MS will require gamers to bring their own tablet, many with varying specs so developers will have to play to the lowest common denominator.  Parents won't understand why the $100 tablet they bought Bobby at Toys R Us doesn't work with certain games, and corporations are well aware of the impact to sales if they don't address those concerns-even if ultimately they decide to ignore that group.

3. I think Microsoft will do harm to themselves by splitting up Xbox users into two systems. A lot of people bought an Xbox for its media capabilities, and buy occasional games that come with a lot of hype.  With a set top box, they won't be able to purchase console games.  Many casual users of the Xbox will be content with cheap app style games, which will reduce the overall install base for traditional console games.  It can work-Apple historically does a good job cannibalizing their own products, so it will be interesting to see how this plays out.

I think you greatly under-estimate the PS4 and over-estimate the Wii U and Xbox 720. Microsoft will continue as they are milking Halo and Gears. The Wii U will lose third party support by this time next year. The PS4 will fix all the errors of the PS3. Better user interface, better download speed, better games out of the gate AND original IP's. Oh and one more thing, PS Plus. Yes, PS Plus will be better than ever. Not to forget FREE CROSS GAME CHAT, and cloud gaming.

 

You will eat your words for sure.

You are all forgetting that nobody can predict the future. You can only watch current trends and try to anticipate, you are trying to predict something without having all the data, you don't know what kind of console PS4 and 720 will be. 

This is what I suspect will happen. Sony might be in the worst position but that doesn't mean they are the most likely to slip up. Of the three I would expect microsoft are the ones to trip up most next time. Nobody is immune to making mistakes. And I think microsoft have already fallen into the key mistakes that will cost them a varied library of genres.

Microsoft have a strangely strong reliance on shooters. It is almost as if microsoft build their exclusives on this shooter image. When rumors about rare working on games for the next xbox surfaced, one was stated to be a 'mature' fps. Their flagship franchise is halo. Even their biggest third party exclusive is a shooter. Then you have this timed exclusive deal with bungie which is apparently another shooter game. You have them constantly promoting call of duty and getting exclusive rights to the dlc. This stereotype might not be true but they have given the idea off that all xbox owners buy is shooters. The other offerings they make are sides of forza and fable.

You may laugh this off but it will come to bite microsoft next generation. It is very hard to get rid of an image that the general public has of you. Ask nintendo. It might not seem like a mistake right now but that is because their new system hasn't released yet. I am willing to bet the library gets overflowed with shooters and lacks any real variety. Nintendo and sony have variety in their list of games. Microsoft do as well but they don't use them. The idea that all xbox owners buy is shooters is going to catch them next generation. Xbox owners, you won't be getting the wide range of choice you got this generation. Mark my words. Even microsoft itself is convinced it can keep the platform alive with shooters.

CCFanboy said: This is what I suspect will happen. Sony might be in the worst position but that doesn't mean they are the most likely to slip up. Of the three I would expect microsoft are the ones to trip up most next time. Nobody is immune to making mistakes. And I think microsoft have already fallen into the key mistakes that will cost them a varied library of genres. Microsoft have a strangely strong reliance on shooters. It is almost as if microsoft build their exclusives on this shooter image. When rumors about rare working on games for the next xbox surfaced, one was stated to be a 'mature' fps. Their flagship franchise is halo. Even their biggest third party exclusive is a shooter. Then you have this timed exclusive deal with bungie which is apparently another shooter game. You have them constantly promoting call of duty and getting exclusive rights to the dlc. This stereotype might not be true but they have given the idea off that all xbox owners buy is shooters. The other offerings they make are sides of forza and fable. You may laugh this off but it will come to bite microsoft next generation. It is very hard to get rid of an image that the general public has of you. Ask nintendo. It might not seem like a mistake right now but that is because their new system hasn't released yet. I am willing to bet the library gets overflowed with shooters and lacks any real variety. Nintendo and sony have variety in their list of games. Microsoft do as well but they don't use them. The idea that all xbox owners buy is shooters is going to catch them next generation. Xbox owners, you won't be getting the wide range of choice you got this generation. Mark my words. Even microsoft itself is convinced it can keep the platform alive with shooters.

That sounds like wishful thinking. Microsoft will play ball with their next gen console and I wish that they get their japanese competitors out of business. Sadly, that is not likely to happen but MS is in position to hurt them both. Badly.