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Forums - Microsoft Discussion - 'A Kinect shooter would be horribly boring', says Ghost Recon dev

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oniyide said:
Rainbird said:

It's all about investment for a developer. If voice recognition isn't something that seems likely to improve your game, then why include or even experiment with it, if it's going to be a big investment to integrate into the game? Mass Effect 3 does experimentation. BioWare wants to see if this is something gamers want and whether it will improve the game. And the easiest way to experiment with it is through Kinect by the looks of things. I'm sure if becomes an essential feature, it will move over to other platforms as well, but until developers know that gamers want it, why invest a disproportionate amount of time and effort in it?

Sorry still dont buy it.  All your questions can be answered by one word: Money. Are you trying to tell me that MS didnt give Bioware some money and/or favors to implement voice recognition just to boost their own Kinect product? Bioware did actually work out of the goodness of their hearts?? Yeah right.  MS wants that Kinect label on as much games as they possibly can. If Bioware actually cared to experiment, why just limit it to one product, ok sure the PS3 version isnt going to do 360 numbers, but the PC version will do just as much, if not more. Where is their voice recognition?? 

Money is always a concern. Maybe BioWare thinks that having voice recognition on the 360 will pay off if they can attract a few Kinect consumers who wouldn't otherwise have bought the game, and at the same time, they can experiment with voice recognition without making a huge investment in it. If it turns out to work really well, maybe they'll implement fully for their next game.

I'm not saying Microsoft couldn't have persuaded them to do it, but why assume there is money involved? Sony convinced Ken Levine to use the Move in Bioshock Infinite, and no money exchanged hands there. Why assume that Microsoft couldn't make a good case for Kinect for developers and that money had to be involved?



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you have ps3 throwing away money for exclusive thats fine so why do people bitch as microsoft if they want an exclusive feature. you dont have to buy it. the developer said it so what people think is quite irrelevant.



Rainbird said:
oniyide said:
Rainbird said:

It's all about investment for a developer. If voice recognition isn't something that seems likely to improve your game, then why include or even experiment with it, if it's going to be a big investment to integrate into the game? Mass Effect 3 does experimentation. BioWare wants to see if this is something gamers want and whether it will improve the game. And the easiest way to experiment with it is through Kinect by the looks of things. I'm sure if becomes an essential feature, it will move over to other platforms as well, but until developers know that gamers want it, why invest a disproportionate amount of time and effort in it?

Sorry still dont buy it.  All your questions can be answered by one word: Money. Are you trying to tell me that MS didnt give Bioware some money and/or favors to implement voice recognition just to boost their own Kinect product? Bioware did actually work out of the goodness of their hearts?? Yeah right.  MS wants that Kinect label on as much games as they possibly can. If Bioware actually cared to experiment, why just limit it to one product, ok sure the PS3 version isnt going to do 360 numbers, but the PC version will do just as much, if not more. Where is their voice recognition?? 

Money is always a concern. Maybe BioWare thinks that having voice recognition on the 360 will pay off if they can attract a few Kinect consumers who wouldn't otherwise have bought the game, and at the same time, they can experiment with voice recognition without making a huge investment in it. If it turns out to work really well, maybe they'll implement fully for their next game.

I'm not saying Microsoft couldn't have persuaded them to do it, but why assume there is money involved? Sony convinced Ken Levine to use the Move in Bioshock Infinite, and no money exchanged hands there. Why assume that Microsoft couldn't make a good case for Kinect for developers and that money had to be involved?

Because that is what MS has been doing all gen, moneyhatting right and left. GTA, COD, TOV, CoE, FF13, the list goes on and on, and how do you know that Sony DIDNT offer Irrational some money for MOVE support?? Id be more inclined to think they did, its buisness after all. Thats how it rolls.  And if Bioware really think something as measly as voice recognition being used for a device that is mostly known for MOTION control will convince the soccer mom and grandma crowd to play ME3, they are in for a rude wake up call



gameonbro said:
you have ps3 throwing away money for exclusive thats fine so why do people bitch as microsoft if they want an exclusive feature. you dont have to buy it. the developer said it so what people think is quite irrelevant.


nobody's bitching, its part of the game, anyone with common sense knows that.  If Ms wants to spend their money, this way then its on them.  I personally think that that money could be spent on making actual games and i know im not alone, but whatever, its all good



Just make a fps with kinect voice commands. Halo CEA took the first steps, ME3 and Ghost Recon is taking that even further.

The best kinect shooters are ones that make kinect and gamepad work in sync.



Xbox: Best hardware, Game Pass best value, best BC, more 1st party genres and multiplayer titles. 

 

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sales2099 said:
Just make a fps with kinect voice commands. Halo CEA took the first steps, ME3 and Ghost Recon is taking that even further.

The best kinect shooters are ones that make kinect and gamepad work in sync.


but what about the actual motion part of the game, since that was what MS has been pushing with Kinect from day 1. it sure as hell wasnt the voice commands



I prefer Bioware and other devs to implement Kinect features one at a time than trying to make a new game Kinect only. Voice recognition is a start and will soon become the norm where even Sony will try to make sure they're not left out when devs put that extra bit on Xbox. Going all out is rarely a good strategy so one piece at a time and it's ok. Sometimes I think those who bought everything MS said Kinect would do in the immediate are more Sony fans than MS fans. I paid 150$ for a Kinect and all I get on core games are voice recognition? Yeah so what I get it and you don't if I don't like it well I don't activate the function that's all, at least I get the choice.

Once again, the reason why it's easyer to put voice recognition on Kinect than on other mics is because of the way it's made and the fact that MS wants everybody to be able to control the dashboard with voice. Kinect has an array of 4 mics that suppress a lot of noise and aid in knowing where the voice comes from so it is easyer for Kinect to track the position of player. MS made sure that a robust voice recognition program comes by default with every Kinect. That program can be used by devs, they don't have to code one from scratch nor buy copyrights from another party. Everything is already there for those who have Kinect, why not use it?



oniyide said:
Rainbird said:

Money is always a concern. Maybe BioWare thinks that having voice recognition on the 360 will pay off if they can attract a few Kinect consumers who wouldn't otherwise have bought the game, and at the same time, they can experiment with voice recognition without making a huge investment in it. If it turns out to work really well, maybe they'll implement fully for their next game.

I'm not saying Microsoft couldn't have persuaded them to do it, but why assume there is money involved? Sony convinced Ken Levine to use the Move in Bioshock Infinite, and no money exchanged hands there. Why assume that Microsoft couldn't make a good case for Kinect for developers and that money had to be involved?

Because that is what MS has been doing all gen, moneyhatting right and left. GTA, COD, TOV, CoE, FF13, the list goes on and on, and how do you know that Sony DIDNT offer Irrational some money for MOVE support?? Id be more inclined to think they did, its buisness after all. Thats how it rolls.  And if Bioware really think something as measly as voice recognition being used for a device that is mostly known for MOTION control will convince the soccer mom and grandma crowd to play ME3, they are in for a rude wake up call

I don't think anyone thinks that BioWare will attract people who don't normally play action games, RPGs or shooters even. But there might be RPG fans, action fans or shooter fans out there thinking that voice recognition will make for an interesting way to play and they'll buy the game, even if they hadn't originally planned to.

I think the issue here is that we have two different views. I'd like to think this sort of thing is done because developers think it can improve their games, and you think that developers do it because money exchanged hands. But while there has definitely been made deals, I don't assume money has exchanged hands unless I see proof, and much of the moneyhatting Microsoft has been accused of this generation is purely speculation without conclusive proof.

Agree to disagree?



Rainbird said:
oniyide said:
Rainbird said:

Money is always a concern. Maybe BioWare thinks that having voice recognition on the 360 will pay off if they can attract a few Kinect consumers who wouldn't otherwise have bought the game, and at the same time, they can experiment with voice recognition without making a huge investment in it. If it turns out to work really well, maybe they'll implement fully for their next game.

I'm not saying Microsoft couldn't have persuaded them to do it, but why assume there is money involved? Sony convinced Ken Levine to use the Move in Bioshock Infinite, and no money exchanged hands there. Why assume that Microsoft couldn't make a good case for Kinect for developers and that money had to be involved?

Because that is what MS has been doing all gen, moneyhatting right and left. GTA, COD, TOV, CoE, FF13, the list goes on and on, and how do you know that Sony DIDNT offer Irrational some money for MOVE support?? Id be more inclined to think they did, its buisness after all. Thats how it rolls.  And if Bioware really think something as measly as voice recognition being used for a device that is mostly known for MOTION control will convince the soccer mom and grandma crowd to play ME3, they are in for a rude wake up call

I don't think anyone thinks that BioWare will attract people who don't normally play action games, RPGs or shooters even. But there might be RPG fans, action fans or shooter fans out there thinking that voice recognition will make for an interesting way to play and they'll buy the game, even if they hadn't originally planned to.

I think the issue here is that we have two different views. I'd like to think this sort of thing is done because developers think it can improve their games, and you think that developers do it because money exchanged hands. But while there has definitely been made deals, I don't assume money has exchanged hands unless I see proof, and much of the moneyhatting Microsoft has been accused of this generation is purely speculation without conclusive proof.

Agree to disagree?

ME is a series that is already wellestablished, I really doubt that Kinect voice implemetion will really boost the sales, it sure didnt help Halo Anniversary.

Yeah we are gonna have to agree to disagree



oniyide said:
sales2099 said:
Just make a fps with kinect voice commands. Halo CEA took the first steps, ME3 and Ghost Recon is taking that even further.

The best kinect shooters are ones that make kinect and gamepad work in sync.


but what about the actual motion part of the game, since that was what MS has been pushing with Kinect from day 1. it sure as hell wasnt the voice commands


Sigh...its obvious that Kinect doesnt mesh well with certain genres by itself. Hence the hybrid approach is best. 



Xbox: Best hardware, Game Pass best value, best BC, more 1st party genres and multiplayer titles.