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Forums - Sales - Was MS Wrong When They Claimed The #1 Spot For HW Sales WW?

 

Which Option Do You Think Is More Accurate?

The PS3/360 Is Over/Undertracked In EU. 135 23.48%
 
Ballmer Was Including A Few Jan Shipments. 67 11.65%
 
MS Stuffed The Channels. 246 42.78%
 
IT'S 2012! WE'RE ALL GOING TO DIE! 123 21.39%
 
Total:571
cookingyourmama on 04 February 2012
sales2099 said:
cookingyourmama said:
sales2099 said:
cookingyourmama said:
sales2099 said:
cookingyourmama said:
sales2099 said:
cookingyourmama said:
sales2099 said:
cookingyourmama said:
ZaneWane said:
why is that xbox selling most console in 2011 is making people mad

Because it didn't. People saying Microsoft 'sold' more & moving the goal posts from sold to shipped is what is annoying ps3 fans.

Fixed. 

Seems the only people who do care are PS3 loyal. Nintendo fans dont care. 360 fans dont mind going by shipped. The only camp that is sensitive seems to have a PS3 bias. 

Personally this all stems from PS3 being last place. PS1/PS2 was on top and now PS3 is last and struggling to take 2nd. The fans are used to being #1 so whenever theres real facts that prove just how far the brand has fallen....they fight and spin and complain until they are convinced the PS3 ir performing like how the PS2 did. 

This might be out there, but I feel its the root of all this sensitivity. I can assure you the 360 camp doesn't mind this one bit. 

That's why i constantly see massive MS cheerleaders like you in nearly every single 360 vs ps3 2011 sales thread kicking up a fuss, acting in denial and only going by the numbers that suit the 360 best, pot calling kettle black.

It's as simple as this, this is a website that deals in ACTUAL SOLD TO CONSUMER NUMBERS NOT SHIPPED. Earlier in the year Microsoft claimed they would sell the most to consumers NOT SHIP THE MOST TO RETAILERS. Microsoft lost & because they lost now we have a situation where 360 fans constantly post and try to shift focus away from Microsoft losing their bet by bragging about profits and shipment numbers (whilst also being in denial that Microsoft overshipped).

Im sorry but VG chartz does shipped articles all the time......

And you have NO proof of MS over shipping in Oct-Dec. Just personal propaganda to convince yourself. 

You dont get it...profits and shipment numbers is THE OFFICIAL criteria of how one corporation > another. So MS possibly lost their sold though bet....they still won on all official accounts, which is shipped and profits. 

The numbers on Vgchartz front page and in their weekly sales data is SOLD TO CONSUMER DATA NOT SHIPPED.

I have already proved that Microsoft overshipped in January-March 2011 a few pages ago, go back and read it, it's a fact. That's different from the up coming January-March 2012 data which we are yet to receive, you've got confused between the two and don't know what you are talking about.

Thanks again for your opinion that shipments and profits are better than actual sales to consumers on a website which is about sold to consumer data. I can tell already what kind of poster you are but you've picked the wrong guy to try and debate with because plain and simple you're wrong.

Ya so u proved jan-mar 2011 but oct-dec over shipping is pure speculation on your part so id cut it out until the april results come in. 

 

Jus saying

All independent sales data for Oct-Dec 2011 shows that Microsoft overshipped, we will know for 100% sure when the next shipment data comes in but pretending it isn't likely is incredible naive. When companies constantly under or overship, using shipped data for a years worth of sales becomes pretty worthless. Not only is this website about SOLD TO CONSUMER DATA but this thread is specifically about sold to consumer totals not shipped.

Thanks for defining Vgchartz and what the closedminded boundries of this thread are. 

"using shipped data for a years worth of sales becomes pretty worthless". Oh contrair they wouldnt have been able to ship as much if actual sales couldnt keep up. But again its how corporations beat one another. 

 In the real world, Corporations criteria for victory > some guys on a forum. 

So, by all official counts. MS won 2011. 

I've already proved that they undershipped in Oct-Dec 2010 so in Jan-March 2011 they had to overship to make up for it. That's nothing to do with how much consumers were actually buying in Jan-March 2011.

Thanks again for you OPINION about corporations & shipped data on a website about sold to consumer data. Sony sold more whilst Microsoft shipped more, get over it.

"Sony sold more whilst Microsoft shipped more, get over it"

I totally get that. But it seems the argument now is which one should be the true measure of victory.

Im just saying that MS and SOny dont give a crap on sold through: they use shipped as their criteria for victory. 

Again....corporations criteria > Ours. Thanks for your OPINION but you really cant argue against MS beating Sony when BOTH measure shipped as criteria. 

You can say it a million times over but you'll never change the fact that this is a website about sold to consumer data & most of the people here don't give a cr*p about how a corparation measures success, they care about which console actually sold the most.



Around the Network
sales2099 on 04 February 2012
cookingyourmama said:
sales2099 said:
cookingyourmama said:
sales2099 said:
cookingyourmama said:
sales2099 said:
cookingyourmama said:
sales2099 said:
cookingyourmama said:
sales2099 said:
cookingyourmama said:
ZaneWane said:
why is that xbox selling most console in 2011 is making people mad

Because it didn't. People saying Microsoft 'sold' more & moving the goal posts from sold to shipped is what is annoying ps3 fans.

Fixed. 

Seems the only people who do care are PS3 loyal. Nintendo fans dont care. 360 fans dont mind going by shipped. The only camp that is sensitive seems to have a PS3 bias. 

Personally this all stems from PS3 being last place. PS1/PS2 was on top and now PS3 is last and struggling to take 2nd. The fans are used to being #1 so whenever theres real facts that prove just how far the brand has fallen....they fight and spin and complain until they are convinced the PS3 ir performing like how the PS2 did. 

This might be out there, but I feel its the root of all this sensitivity. I can assure you the 360 camp doesn't mind this one bit. 

That's why i constantly see massive MS cheerleaders like you in nearly every single 360 vs ps3 2011 sales thread kicking up a fuss, acting in denial and only going by the numbers that suit the 360 best, pot calling kettle black.

It's as simple as this, this is a website that deals in ACTUAL SOLD TO CONSUMER NUMBERS NOT SHIPPED. Earlier in the year Microsoft claimed they would sell the most to consumers NOT SHIP THE MOST TO RETAILERS. Microsoft lost & because they lost now we have a situation where 360 fans constantly post and try to shift focus away from Microsoft losing their bet by bragging about profits and shipment numbers (whilst also being in denial that Microsoft overshipped).

Im sorry but VG chartz does shipped articles all the time......

And you have NO proof of MS over shipping in Oct-Dec. Just personal propaganda to convince yourself. 

You dont get it...profits and shipment numbers is THE OFFICIAL criteria of how one corporation > another. So MS possibly lost their sold though bet....they still won on all official accounts, which is shipped and profits. 

The numbers on Vgchartz front page and in their weekly sales data is SOLD TO CONSUMER DATA NOT SHIPPED.

I have already proved that Microsoft overshipped in January-March 2011 a few pages ago, go back and read it, it's a fact. That's different from the up coming January-March 2012 data which we are yet to receive, you've got confused between the two and don't know what you are talking about.

Thanks again for your opinion that shipments and profits are better than actual sales to consumers on a website which is about sold to consumer data. I can tell already what kind of poster you are but you've picked the wrong guy to try and debate with because plain and simple you're wrong.

Ya so u proved jan-mar 2011 but oct-dec over shipping is pure speculation on your part so id cut it out until the april results come in. 

 

Jus saying

All independent sales data for Oct-Dec 2011 shows that Microsoft overshipped, we will know for 100% sure when the next shipment data comes in but pretending it isn't likely is incredible naive. When companies constantly under or overship, using shipped data for a years worth of sales becomes pretty worthless. Not only is this website about SOLD TO CONSUMER DATA but this thread is specifically about sold to consumer totals not shipped.

Thanks for defining Vgchartz and what the closedminded boundries of this thread are. 

"using shipped data for a years worth of sales becomes pretty worthless". Oh contrair they wouldnt have been able to ship as much if actual sales couldnt keep up. But again its how corporations beat one another. 

 In the real world, Corporations criteria for victory > some guys on a forum. 

So, by all official counts. MS won 2011. 

I've already proved that they undershipped in Oct-Dec 2010 so in Jan-March 2011 they had to overship to make up for it. That's nothing to do with how much consumers were actually buying in Jan-March 2011.

Thanks again for you OPINION about corporations & shipped data on a website about sold to consumer data. Sony sold more whilst Microsoft shipped more, get over it.

"Sony sold more whilst Microsoft shipped more, get over it"

I totally get that. But it seems the argument now is which one should be the true measure of victory.

Im just saying that MS and SOny dont give a crap on sold through: they use shipped as their criteria for victory. 

Again....corporations criteria > Ours. Thanks for your OPINION but you really cant argue against MS beating Sony when BOTH measure shipped as criteria. 

You can say it a million times over but you'll never change the fact that this is a website about sold to consumer data & most of the people here don't give a cr*p about how a corparation measures success, they care about which console actually sold the most.

Thats the beauty. It doesnt matter if people here dont give a crap.......why should they, they dont work for MS or Sony. 

Doesn't make them right. What we care about doesn't mean whats relevant. And by we I mean PS3 fans. Cause 360 and Nintendo fans dont mind one bit. 

You can say that this is a sales website a million times over but it doesnt change the fact that the 1st and foremost criteria for victory between corporations has always been shipped. Their criteria > ours. 



Xbox: Best hardware, Game Pass best value, best BC, more 1st party genres and multiplayer titles. 

 

cookingyourmama on 04 February 2012
sales2099 said:
cookingyourmama said:
sales2099 said:
cookingyourmama said:
sales2099 said:
cookingyourmama said:
sales2099 said:
cookingyourmama said:
sales2099 said:
cookingyourmama said:
sales2099 said:
cookingyourmama said:
ZaneWane said:
why is that xbox selling most console in 2011 is making people mad

Because it didn't. People saying Microsoft 'sold' more & moving the goal posts from sold to shipped is what is annoying ps3 fans.

Fixed. 

Seems the only people who do care are PS3 loyal. Nintendo fans dont care. 360 fans dont mind going by shipped. The only camp that is sensitive seems to have a PS3 bias. 

Personally this all stems from PS3 being last place. PS1/PS2 was on top and now PS3 is last and struggling to take 2nd. The fans are used to being #1 so whenever theres real facts that prove just how far the brand has fallen....they fight and spin and complain until they are convinced the PS3 ir performing like how the PS2 did. 

This might be out there, but I feel its the root of all this sensitivity. I can assure you the 360 camp doesn't mind this one bit. 

That's why i constantly see massive MS cheerleaders like you in nearly every single 360 vs ps3 2011 sales thread kicking up a fuss, acting in denial and only going by the numbers that suit the 360 best, pot calling kettle black.

It's as simple as this, this is a website that deals in ACTUAL SOLD TO CONSUMER NUMBERS NOT SHIPPED. Earlier in the year Microsoft claimed they would sell the most to consumers NOT SHIP THE MOST TO RETAILERS. Microsoft lost & because they lost now we have a situation where 360 fans constantly post and try to shift focus away from Microsoft losing their bet by bragging about profits and shipment numbers (whilst also being in denial that Microsoft overshipped).

Im sorry but VG chartz does shipped articles all the time......

And you have NO proof of MS over shipping in Oct-Dec. Just personal propaganda to convince yourself. 

You dont get it...profits and shipment numbers is THE OFFICIAL criteria of how one corporation > another. So MS possibly lost their sold though bet....they still won on all official accounts, which is shipped and profits. 

The numbers on Vgchartz front page and in their weekly sales data is SOLD TO CONSUMER DATA NOT SHIPPED.

I have already proved that Microsoft overshipped in January-March 2011 a few pages ago, go back and read it, it's a fact. That's different from the up coming January-March 2012 data which we are yet to receive, you've got confused between the two and don't know what you are talking about.

Thanks again for your opinion that shipments and profits are better than actual sales to consumers on a website which is about sold to consumer data. I can tell already what kind of poster you are but you've picked the wrong guy to try and debate with because plain and simple you're wrong.

Ya so u proved jan-mar 2011 but oct-dec over shipping is pure speculation on your part so id cut it out until the april results come in. 

 

Jus saying

All independent sales data for Oct-Dec 2011 shows that Microsoft overshipped, we will know for 100% sure when the next shipment data comes in but pretending it isn't likely is incredible naive. When companies constantly under or overship, using shipped data for a years worth of sales becomes pretty worthless. Not only is this website about SOLD TO CONSUMER DATA but this thread is specifically about sold to consumer totals not shipped.

Thanks for defining Vgchartz and what the closedminded boundries of this thread are. 

"using shipped data for a years worth of sales becomes pretty worthless". Oh contrair they wouldnt have been able to ship as much if actual sales couldnt keep up. But again its how corporations beat one another. 

 In the real world, Corporations criteria for victory > some guys on a forum. 

So, by all official counts. MS won 2011. 

I've already proved that they undershipped in Oct-Dec 2010 so in Jan-March 2011 they had to overship to make up for it. That's nothing to do with how much consumers were actually buying in Jan-March 2011.

Thanks again for you OPINION about corporations & shipped data on a website about sold to consumer data. Sony sold more whilst Microsoft shipped more, get over it.

"Sony sold more whilst Microsoft shipped more, get over it"

I totally get that. But it seems the argument now is which one should be the true measure of victory.

Im just saying that MS and SOny dont give a crap on sold through: they use shipped as their criteria for victory. 

Again....corporations criteria > Ours. Thanks for your OPINION but you really cant argue against MS beating Sony when BOTH measure shipped as criteria. 

You can say it a million times over but you'll never change the fact that this is a website about sold to consumer data & most of the people here don't give a cr*p about how a corparation measures success, they care about which console actually sold the most.

Thats the beauty. It doesnt matter if people here dont give a crap.......why should they, they dont work for MS or Sony. 

Doesn't make them right. What we care about doesn't mean whats relevant. And by we I mean PS3 fans. Cause 360 and Nintendo fans dont mind one bit. 

You can say that this is a sales website a million times over but it doesnt change the fact that the 1st and foremost criteria for victory between corporations has always been shipped. Their criteria > ours. 

No it is just your OPINION that their criteria is better than ours.



Jexy on 04 February 2012

cooking... you mad?



BOOM!  FACE KICK!

zhao3gold on 04 February 2012

In fact I have one question about those "XBOX360 overshipped" comments. Look at CY2011 Q3 & Q4 shipment figures, MS totaly shipped 10.5M XBOX360 and SONY shipped 10.2M PS3. The difference is only 0.3M consoles. How come people keep saying X360 was overshipped.

SONY shipped 3.8M PS3 in Q3, so in Q4 they didn't need to ship huge quantity to fulfill the holiday market requirements. But MS only shipped 2.3M X360 in Q3, so in order to meet the holiday retail requirement, of course they needed to ship more consoles in Q4.

My opinion is: SONY started to prepare that holiday sales in Q3, but MS didn't start to prepare the holiday sales until Q4.

There is no huge overshipment existed, but probably a slight overshipment. And the overshipment might be for both MS and SONY because December sales was lower than their expectations.

At last, according to NPD, Nintendo and MC, the retail sales of 360 and PS3 in thebiggest 3 markets is on par. So how people here are 100% sure PS3 was outsold 360 in retail?



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cookingyourmama on 04 February 2012
zhao3gold said:
In fact I have one question about those "XBOX360 overshipped" comments. Look at CY2011 Q3 & Q4 shipment figures, MS totaly shipped 10.5M XBOX360 and SONY shipped 10.2M PS3. The difference is only 0.3M consoles. How come people keep saying X360 was overshipped.

SONY shipped 3.8M PS3 in Q3, so in Q4 they didn't need to ship huge quantity to fulfill the holiday market requirements. But MS only shipped 2.3M X360 in Q3, so in order to meet the holiday retail requirement, of course they needed to ship more consoles in Q4.

My opinion is: SONY started to prepare that holiday sales in Q3, but MS didn't start to prepare the holiday sales until Q4.

There is no huge overshipment existed, but probably a slight overshipment. And the overshipment might be for both MS and SONY because December sales was lower than their expectations.

At last, according to NPD, Nintendo and MC, the retail sales of 360 and PS3 in thebiggest 3 markets is on par. So how people here are 100% sure PS3 was outsold 360 in retail?

Because it's not just about one or two quarters, you have to go back to data from last year to show what's happened this year. I've already proved earlier in this thread that Microsoft overshipped in the Jan-March 2011 quarter as well due to undershipping in Oct-Dec 2010.

In total for 2010 Microsoft shipped 12.1 million consoles, however they sold 13,378,231, Microsoft & retailers made a big mistake & undershipped for 2010 with the majority of that happening in Oct-Dec & it ate into their supply of consoles in the retail chain almost causing a sell out. To make up for this Microsoft had to replenish the retail chain by overshipping in 2011 & they shipped 14.9 million whilst selling 13,422,253.

When you combine the two years worth of sales you get 27 million shipped & 26,800,484 sold, which works out perfectly. Microsoft undershipped in 2010 & had to balance it out by overshipping in 2011.



NotStan on 04 February 2012

I don't understand logic of some hardcore fans, when Sony wins shipment data - Sony wins altogether. When Sony looses shipment data but wins the sales estimates on a site that has 5-10% variance, but looses the shipment data, it's a winner as well.

Bias logic at work.



Disconnect and self destruct, one bullet a time.

gameonbro on 04 February 2012

o.O why is this thread still going on



amaral_slb on 04 February 2012

What matter for companies? Money/shipped
What is this site all about? Console Sales

If MS was the one selling more and shipping less the winner for this site purposes would be MS. The day PS3 surpasses the 360 (if it happens) is the day they have more consoles sold.

Hey cook, don´t argue with guys like 2099, it´s worthless, in his eyes there is only one winner in every discussion.

And to 2099 I only say, why are you discussing shipped numbers? What matters is money, so everything that comes after is worthless. I hope MS keeps paying you with the money they are making with every single 360 sold. If you want to discuss profits and shipped numbers leave this site, go to an apple forum and discuss how much money MS is doing, in here we talk sales so you can repeat your worthless post about everything except sales.

And by the way, don´t ever post in any weekly chart thread, there is no point as you say.



Kynes on 04 February 2012
kowenicki said:
where is a MIKEB? the infamous Sony champion... lol

...he'd actually have to say 360 won... oh the irony. He used to bang on about only shipped numbers matter!!


He left this place when he was sure that PS3 wasn't going to sell three times the X360 sales. I can say that I don't miss him.