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Forums - PC - Help Building a New Computer

You ask a lot of questions, but then again, you are planning on dropping a lot of money on this, so it's understandable.

It took the better part of five years for quads to become the standard for any system that requires the extra processing power. Even today, most games run competently on duals, not that I'd recommend one to anyone building a gaming PC, even on the cheap.

Hex cores, barring AMD systems (who have used hex core designs in CPUs available for about or less than $300 simply because they provide less performance per core than their Intel counterparts) are pretty much for workstation or extreme high end gaming PCs currently. Gaming PCs with Intel hex cores don't even see much, if any boost in performance for games simply because no games are optimized to utilize the extra cores.

Even with the current rate of progress due to Moore's Law and all the R&D that goes on to keep the trend going, I don't see hex core systems being common for years, simply because there are limited applications that take advantage of the extra processing power.

For 3D artists who do a lot of rendering, hex cores pay off instantly. Same for video editors who do regular video encoding. Add post processing and video effects in apps like Adobe After Effects and the extra processing power will be put to good use. Photo editing generally doesn't require the same level of processing power barring professionals and digital artists who work with huge files. Music production requires less processing power, but with high end editing systems, it helps.

So maybe the question should be how long are you planning on keeping this system in the state it will be in once you build it, followed by when are you planning on doing a major upgrade like a CPU swap.

Personally, even if I was spending $4000 on an all new system build today (which in the US would pretty much give me carte blanche to build any configuration I wanted), it would be so with the acknowledgement that in no less than 2 years, there will be much faster components available at the same price or less.

So maybe the rule for anyone doing a pricey build is that they should only be doing it for a system they'll only be using for 3-4 years tops barring any major upgrades (I say 2-3). Anyone who justifies an expensive (for their budget) build with the rationale that it will last them forever (or even 5 years) is setting themself up for a disappointing shot of reality. If you're comfortable with that, then buy the best components available today that you can afford.

Otherwise, build a system on an i7 2600/2700k and you'll probably feel a lot better when you build a new system in another 2 years.

For me personally, if I needed to build a moderately priced system from scratch that gave me the best performance for my dollar, who works extensively in Maya (3D artist/animator) and works regularly with HD video (videographer) and digital photography (file sizes in the hundreds of megabytes), I'd build one on a 2600k and use it for the next 18-24 months while waiting for the upcoming Ivy Bridge processors. The only drawback is that I wouldn't be able to re-use the LGA 1155 motherboard (a $200+ part) and RAM, which is nothing at $85 for 16GB in the US currently. Add the $300 2600k and that's really only about $600 worth of parts that I'd be replacing, which is nothing over the span of even 18 months.

If I went with an LGA 2011 motherboard today (cheapest being a $300+ part, closer to $400) my cheapest CPU option (unlocked since I'm an overclocker) is a $600 Core i7 3930K. Add in another $85 for 16GB of RAM and that's about $1,100 worth of components to be replaced, meaning I'd probably be using that set up for quite a bit longer.

For the record, I did a rebuild in early 2010 based on an i7 920, LGA 1366, 12GB RAM and currently do most of my Maya (not rendering) and video editing work on an i7 quad MacBook Pro. The PC is currently only used for rendering and the occasional game so I won't bother to upgrade until I need more processing power, which will probably be to an Ivy Bridge CPU on an LGA 2011 motherboard with 32GB of RAM.



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Looking at your requirements and things you want to do. I believe the choice should be obvious.

You need to get liquid cooled Quad SLI GTX 580s minimum...or you may as well just get an Atari 2600 and live in a cave...with mountain goats. :)



greenmedic88 said:
snakenobi said:
zarx said:
You left off the most important piece of information, budget


i have enough like $3000-4000

the fact that i didn't mention it is because in india almost all things cost 1.5-2times

 

also because all the things like CPU and GPU have verious different price categories like Xeon,Core i7 extreme,Core i7.thats why i asked which will be enough for me or is there need of more

i7 2600k/2700k is all and more than most of the population needs for a gaming/productivity system. For gaming, the i5 2500k performs about the same for $100 less. Unless you're building a server, which you aren't, you can skip the Xeons. 

If you want the most current and are willing to spend more on the CPU/motherboard, the i7 3930k was recently released as a part of the new line of CPUs using the new socket LGA 2011. It's a $600 CPU with limited (but excellent) motherboard choices that currently don't dip below $300 at the bottom end and are closer to $500 at the top.

http://www.amazon.com/dp/B00603QXPM/ref=asc_df_B00603QXPM1837559?smid=ATVPDKIKX0DER&tag=hyprod-20&linkCode=asn&creative=395093&creativeASIN=B00603QXPM


Or...

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16819103961



Snesboy said:

Or...

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16819103961

I'd never build a productivity PC with an AMD CPU.

It's not that I have anything against AMD (all but one of my VGA cards are ATI/AMD), but considering that there aren't any professional grade workstations using AMD CPUs is pretty much saying that at best, they are an inexpensive alternative to Intel and the benchmarks support this.

http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/fx-8150-zambezi-bulldozer-990fx,3043-20.html



JEMC said:

snakenobi said:

what do dual and tripple channel ram motherboards mean?

In simple words, it's the nº of channels the CPU use to "talk" with your RAM. More channels = better speeds but also more latency. More: wikipedia

Most CPUs use dual channel, the "old" Intel's i7 (the likes of 920/930, 950 etc.) use triple channel while the new i7 (3930K) go with quad channel. When buying the RAM the difference is that dual channel kits comes in packs of 2 modules, triple channel comes in packs of 3 and quads in packs of 4.

the same for pci-e slots,what do channels mean 

The combo CPU-chipset (like those of X79, Z68, P67, 990FX, etc) talk to the devices that you install in the motherboard via a series of lanes. This number of lanes are finite (X79 gives you 40 PCIe 2.0 lanes while the 990FX has 42) and are spreaded into the different PCI slots that comes with your mobo. Simply put, the more the better. But be careful with the names, a PCIe 2.0 is different from a PCIe. To learn more: wikipedia

and speed mean liek 16x or 8x?

This multiplier tells you the number of lanes the PCIe uses (16x = 16 lanes, 4x = 4 lanes). Every motherboard has at least 1 PCIe 2.0 x16, and this is where the graphics card goes. If you go with SLI/Xfire you must look at the other PCIe slots. When using 2 Gfx cards some boards will split those 16 lanes into the 2 cards (8 for each one). The difference in performance is usually negligible. See more examples here: http://www.hardocp.com/article/2010/08/23/gtx_480_sli_pcie_bandwidth_perf_x16x16_vs_x8x8/

I hope it helps.

does the 2nd PS-E slot not being 16x reduce the speed and performance

or does it only need 16x in total,8x in one and 8x in other

 

there should be enough PCI-E slot to accomodate audio card,wifi,bluetooth card

 

 

 

about ram lanes,is it necessary to ram in specific amount or is it just to increase performance?

for example:if i buy 8gbs of ram and cpu support triple channel.and suppose 8gbs are divided into 4 2gb memory.will the 4th memory not work or perform as well?



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zarx said:
snakenobi said:

What kind of games? Anything in particular you want to play

battelfield 3,crysis 2,etc

What resolution and length are we talking?

mostly 1080p but it can go higher.

though not 4k as i won't be going that high atm

what kind of  existing wireless infrastruture do you have (modem/router etc)

only a router

n-150mbps wifi,4 100mbps ethernet

 

Some Question's from my side :

2600K will be slightly better than the 2500k for video/audio encoding but have no real impact on anything else, the 2700K is slightly better again but for video encoding nothing out now beats the 3960X/3930K and if you are going to be encoding a lot of 1080p video (hours of video) it may be worth investing in but it's really really expensive. How long it will hadle heavy tasks will depend on the tasks, if the tasks stay the same yes but if you are planning to move to movie making with a 4K camera in the future you will want to upgrade.

doesn't GPU give any support in video encoding?

what is 2600k and extrmem good for in video resolutions encoding separately

Mostly irrelevant for DDR3 today, higher you go lower the increase in performance and much higher cost.

so these don't matter?

DDR3-2000/PC3-16000

DDR3-1600/PC3-12800

DDR3-1333/PC3-10666

DDR3-2133/PC3-17000

Ignore this value, focus on the wireless spec 802.11g/n etc, get n devices it's the newest, best fastest spec.

those values should be important as mouse and keboard don't run on wifi

also is it good to get a modular or normal power supply







snakenobi said:
zarx said:
snakenobi said:

What kind of games? Anything in particular you want to play

battelfield 3,crysis 2,etc

What resolution and length are we talking?

mostly 1080p but it can go higher.

though not 4k as i won't be going that high atm

what kind of  existing wireless infrastruture do you have (modem/router etc)

only a router

n-150mbps wifi,4 100mbps ethernet

 

Some Question's from my side :

 

2600K will be slightly better than the 2500k for video/audio encoding but have no real impact on anything else, the 2700K is slightly better again but for video encoding nothing out now beats the 3960X/3930K and if you are going to be encoding a lot of 1080p video (hours of video) it may be worth investing in but it's really really expensive. How long it will hadle heavy tasks will depend on the tasks, if the tasks stay the same yes but if you are planning to move to movie making with a 4K camera in the future you will want to upgrade.

doesn't GPU give any support in video encoding?

what is 2600k and extrmem good for in video resolutions encoding separately

Mostly irrelevant for DDR3 today, higher you go lower the increase in performance and much higher cost.

so these don't matter?

DDR3-2000/PC3-16000

DDR3-1600/PC3-12800

DDR3-1333/PC3-10666

DDR3-2133/PC3-17000

 

Ignore this value, focus on the wireless spec 802.11g/n etc, get n devices it's the newest, best fastest spec.

those values should be important as mouse and keboard don't run on wifi

also is it good to get a modular or normal power supply






So you will want a high end GPU then

 

1080p is pretty heavy so you will need a lot of HDD, RAM and a good CPU

 

GPU can help but not all programs support it so it may not be a good idea to relly on it to heavily especially with editing a lot CPU is still really important. It may be worth checking what programs you will be using.

 

It does make a difference but it's not huge and offers diminishing returns higher you go, usally you are usally better spending money on other things tho I wouldn't go below DDR3-1600 for a high performance PC like you are building.



@TheVoxelman on twitter

Check out my hype threads: Cyberpunk, and The Witcher 3!

zarx said:


So you will want a high end GPU then

 

1080p is pretty heavy so you will need a lot of HDD, RAM and a good CPU

 

GPU can help but not all programs support it so it may not be a good idea to relly on it to heavily especially with editing a lot CPU is still really important. It may be worth checking what programs you will be using.

 

It does make a difference but it's not huge and offers diminishing returns higher you go, usally you are usally better spending money on other things tho I wouldn't go below DDR3-1600 for a high performance PC like you are building.

so which CPU 2600K or extreme

also remember 2600k can be overclocked

if it will do with overclocking,how fast does spu run out as in diminish life cycle of a cpu

 

also suggest ram,i was gonna buy 10-12gbs of it

 

and wat do you think of SSD as system drive

or ssd as cache(checkout intel Z68 mobo,they have ssd cache thing)

how should i deal with cache?



snakenobi said:
zarx said:


So you will want a high end GPU then

 

1080p is pretty heavy so you will need a lot of HDD, RAM and a good CPU

 

GPU can help but not all programs support it so it may not be a good idea to relly on it to heavily especially with editing a lot CPU is still really important. It may be worth checking what programs you will be using.

 

It does make a difference but it's not huge and offers diminishing returns higher you go, usally you are usally better spending money on other things tho I wouldn't go below DDR3-1600 for a high performance PC like you are building.

so which CPU 2600K or extreme

also remember 2600k can be overclocked

if it will do with overclocking,how fast does spu run out as in diminish life cycle of a cpu

 

also suggest ram,i was gonna buy 10-12gbs of it

 

and wat do you think of SSD as system drive

or ssd as cache(checkout intel Z68 mobo,they have ssd cache thing)

how should i deal with cache?


Depending on price (I am not sure how much they are where you are) I would probably lean towards the 3930k considering what you want it for and that you want it to be reasonably future proof. check http://www.xbitlabs.com/articles/cpu/display/core-i7-3960x-3930k_10.html#sect0 and http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/core-i7-3930k-3820-test-benchmark,3090-7.html for an indictaion on the advantage it offers, but it will probably end up being a bit to expensive for the advantage for you.

If you do decide to go with the 3930k you will have quad channel RAM so I would suggest 4x4GB for a total of 16GB, otherwise I would say that 8GB would be the absolute minimum for a video editing machine that will be sticking arround for a while ~16 would probably be the sweet spot,video editing is very RAM heavy from what I know so I wouldn't skimp to much. Tho RAM is easy to upgrade so if you want to save a bit in the short term and upgrade the RAM later that is easy to do so if it comes down to cutting CPU/GPU or adding more RAM I would probably cut the RAM and get more later. If you are using after effects tho you may want to consider 24GB+ as that is a monster for RAM.

I haven't really had much experiance with SSDs so I would deffer that to someone else.



@TheVoxelman on twitter

Check out my hype threads: Cyberpunk, and The Witcher 3!

zarx said:


Depending on price (I am not sure how much they are where you are) I would probably lean towards the 3930k considering what you want it for and that you want it to be reasonably future proof. check http://www.xbitlabs.com/articles/cpu/display/core-i7-3960x-3930k_10.html#sect0 and http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/core-i7-3930k-3820-test-benchmark,3090-7.html for an indictaion on the advantage it offers, but it will probably end up being a bit to expensive for the advantage for you.

If you do decide to go with the 3930k you will have quad channel RAM so I would suggest 4x4GB for a total of 16GB, otherwise I would say that 8GB would be the absolute minimum for a video editing machine that will be sticking arround for a while ~16 would probably be the sweet spot,video editing is very RAM heavy from what I know so I wouldn't skimp to much. Tho RAM is easy to upgrade so if you want to save a bit in the short term and upgrade the RAM later that is easy to do so if it comes down to cutting CPU/GPU or adding more RAM I would probably cut the RAM and get more later. If you are using after effects tho you may want to consider 24GB+ as that is a monster for RAM.

I haven't really had much experiance with SSDs so I would deffer that to someone else.


u didn't answer the ram vs channel question?

if ram is put in for exmaple,if the processor supports 3 channel and i put in 4 ram sticks,will it effect performance

 

3930x costs me $1200 and 3960x costs me $1400 in india,is it worth it or will intel bring 6core processors for $300 in 1.5-2 year time

 

how much ram compensates in encoding time for cpu power

 

does cache has to do anything with performace time as i can buy an ssd if needed,a small one