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Forums - Gaming Discussion - Wii U vs PS4 vs Xbox One FULL SPECS (January 24, 2014)

superchunk said:

 

CPU: (neXtBox ~ PS4 >> Wii U)

Wii U neXtBox PS4
IBM PowerPC Type 750
AMD Fusion APU
4 Jaguar cores per cluster
AMD Fusion APU
4 Jaguar cores per cluster

Produced:    2012
Clock:            1.24GHz
Cores:           3 (all for gaming)
L1 cache:     32+32 KB/core
L2 cache:     3MB shared
L3 cache:     none
Threads:      1/core (2 instructions)

Produced:  2013
Clock:          1.6GHz
Cores:         8 (6 for gaming)
L1 cache:   32+32 KB/core
L2 cache:   2MB per cluster
L3 cache:   none
Threads:    1/core
Produced:  2013
Clock:          1.6GHz
Cores:         8 (? for gaming)
L1 cache:   32+32 KB/core
L2 cache:   2MB per cluster
L3 cache:   none
Threads:    1/core

With WiiU finally being torn down and evidently hacked, the CPU is clear now. It is an enhanced Wii CPU. The clock is about twice as fast PER CORE and it has THREE cores vs Wii's ONE core. Along with that comes 12-times the cache. As compared to what is likely in the other next gen systems... clearly it will be below them by a significant amount.

MSony are essentially going to provide the same CPU within their overall APU design. However, this will not mean they are identical as each company will have tweaked various other items related to memory, bandwidth, etc.

However in the end, it appears we'll see a MSony CPU that is basically the same while WiiU lags far behind. Considering we're approaching a point where the GPU will be doing nearly all the work, this may not be as big of an issue for WiiU as it suggests.

For CPUs we're looking at: XBox 360 * 1.5 = WiiU * 4 = neXtBox ~ PS4.


GPU: (PS4 > neXtBox >> Wii U)

Wii U
neXtBox
PS4
AMD HD GPGPU - Custom design
AMD HD 7XXX (approximation)
"Southern Islands" technology
AMD HD 7XXX (approximation)
"Southern Islands" technology

Produced:        2012
Memory:          sub 64GB/s
Clock core:       500MHz
Clock Mem:      ??
GFLOPS:            352
Pixel Fill Rate:  ??
Texture Fill:      ??
TDP:                   25 to 35W (whole MCM)

Produced:        2013
Memory:         64GB/s
Clock core:      800MHz
Clock Mem:    1GHz
TFLOPS:           1.2
Pixel Fill Rate:  ??
Texture Fill:     ??
TDP:                   75 to 100 (whole APU)
Produced:        2013
Memory:         176GB/s
Clock core:      800MHz
Clock Mem:    1GHz
TFLOPS:           1.84
Pixel Fill Rate:  ??
Texture Fill:     ??
TDP:                   75 to 100 (whole APU)

Nintendo has gone with a 100% custom chip design in order for them to create their MCM solution with a strong focus on efficiency and backwards compatibility. The end result is a design that is not like any standard AMD GPU, making it difficult to analyze. It does contain fast eDRAM (32MB + 2MB) and SRAM (1MB). Statements support the idea that it will utilize the same DX11 type features and technologies as its competitors, but it will be hampered by a far slower GPU and memory bandwidth.

MS appears to be going with a slightly smaller GPU (as compared with Sony) along with a slower memory pipeline and some sort of "Move Engine" that is believed to assist its data transfer speeds within the APU. It will go with general DD3 RAM and compliment that with 32MB of eSRAM. Being a Microsoft product, it will be utilizing 11.x varient of DirectX.

Sony is going with a more traditional PC-like approach in that its matching the GPU with actual GDDR5 RAM vs general purpose DDR3 RAM. It has 18 compute units (CU) in its southern islands based GPU. Like WiiU, this will be support DX11 type features and technologies.

For GPUs we're looking at: XBox 360 * 2 = WiiU * 5 = neXtBox * 1.5 = PS4.


Memory: (PS4 > neXtBox >> Wii U)

Wii U
neXtBox
PS4
2GB DDR3
12.8GB/s
1GB reserved for games
8GB DDR3
68GB/s
5GB reserved for games
8GB GDDR5
176GB/s
5GB to 7GB reserved for games

This means that Sony has a clear advantage in RAM due to speed. While WiiU will be both far smaller and slower than both of its competitors. These differences are attempted to be included in the comparisons above for CPU/GPU.

 

Controls:

  WiiU neXtBox PS4
Main Controller(s)

Gamepad

  • 6.2" HD touch screen
  • Dynamic video based on position and game intent
  • Ability to create mobile sensor for Wiimotes
  • Mic and Speaker + headphone connection
  • Dual analog, four face buttons, four shoulder buttons
  • Rumble
  • Ability to play games/video without use of TV
  • Rechargeable built-in battery
  • WiFi (802.11n 5GHz band)
  • NFC
  • TV/Cable/Sat/DVR remote

Wireless Pro Controller

  • Dual analog, four face buttons, four shoulder buttons
  • Rumble
  • Rechargeable built-in battery
  • Bluetooth

Xbox One Controller

  • Dual analog, four face buttons, four shoulder buttons
  • Rumble
  • 2*AA battery
  • Bluetooth
  • Connection port for headset/charging
  • Home button, Split/Snap screen button, Optons button

Kinect 2.0

  • Packed in with every system
  • HD Wide angle camera allowing up to 4 active players.
  • More precise visual capabilities
  • Better voice controls

 

 

 

 

 

 

Dual Shock 4

  • Dual analog, four face buttons, four shoulder buttons
  • Rumble
  • Rechargeable built-in battery
  • Bluetooth
  • Touchpad
  • Speaker
  • Headphone connection
  • "Move" embedded light
  • "Share" button
  • "Options" button (used in place of start/select)

PS Eye

  • Packed in with every system
  • 3D View
  • Enhanced video and audio capabilities
  • Now interacts with Move and DualShock4 controllers.

 

 

 

Secondary

All Wii controls

  • Wiimote (plus and regular)
  • Nunchuk
  • Balance Board
  • Classic Controller (pro and regular)

Tablet/Phone/Internet

  • Interoperability with any smartphone or tablet for MiiVerse, eShop, etc types of interaction. (Don't believe this is gameplay related)

 



SmartGlass

  • Interoperability with any tablet/smartphone for full dashboard, shop, communications, and probably limited gameplay. 
  • Could provide many features similar to WiiU gamepad where sticks and buttons are not required.

 

 

 



Vita

  • Remote play via home network or internet.
  • Base OS feature, no special game developer work except mapping of Vita controls.

Move

  • Doesn't appear to have changed.

Tablet/Phone/Internet

  • Interoperability with any tablet/smartphone for full dashboard, PSN shop, communications, Playstation social networking.


you forget that xbox one has the esdram which is part of the ram that helps to compete with ps4 gddr5 onne. plus  ms hasn't confirmed a all of the specs as well.



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dane007 said:


you forget that xbox one has the esdram which is part of the ram that helps to compete with ps4 gddr5 onne. plus  ms hasn't confirmed a all of the specs as well.

The embedded ram is mentioned in the OP. In the second post I also don't mention WiiU's embedded ram as I didn't feel their 32MB of space would make a big enough difference in comparison to PS4s (still faster) 8GB of GDDR5 ram.

However, for completeness I will add them both.

As far as comfimed specs, yes MS has listed a spec sheet. But they have reported directly to MANY sites (many of them linked in OP) as well as there are pics of the insides and developer confirmed tear downs.

It is as official as we're likely to get as MS knows they are technically worse than PS4 and like their reveal where they only reported transitor count and other BS, they won't get into those specifics. They are taking the Nintendo line now and purposefully leaving it out.



superchunk said:
dane007 said:


you forget that xbox one has the esdram which is part of the ram that helps to compete with ps4 gddr5 onne. plus  ms hasn't confirmed a all of the specs as well.

The embedded ram is mentioned in the OP. In the second post I also don't mention WiiU's embedded ram as I didn't feel their 32MB of space would make a big enough difference in comparison to PS4s (still faster) 8GB of GDDR5 ram.

However, for completeness I will add them both.

As far as comfimed specs, yes MS has listed a spec sheet. But they have reported directly to MANY sites (many of them linked in OP) as well as there are pics of the insides and developer confirmed tear downs.

It is as official as we're likely to get as MS knows they are technically worse than PS4 and like their reveal where they only reported transitor count and other BS, they won't get into those specifics. They are taking the Nintendo line now and purposefully leaving it out.


yea i saw that  but like what type of ram wasn't mentioned as the reveal said 8gb.  or whether it takes 3gb for the OS. its important as they both are considered ram and when the 360 had it , it provided the added advantage over the ps3. Still its not official till ms confirms all the specs details as the sites vary the info. anyways 360 was less powerful then ps3 but ended up doing better then ps3 in graaphics and performance lol.



dane007 said:


yea i saw that  but like what type of ram wasn't mentioned as the reveal said 8gb.  or whether it takes 3gb for the OS. its important as they both are considered ram and when the 360 had it , it provided the added advantage over the ps3. Still its not official till ms confirms all the specs details as the sites vary the info. anyways 360 was less powerful then ps3 but ended up doing better then ps3 in graaphics and performance lol.

Those "missing" details (like type of ram) are confirmed by pictures of the inside of XOne. It is known.

360 had many areas that looked better than PS3 early on (definitely not now) due to

1) the head start EVERY dev had on X360 hardware vs PS3

2) the massive complexity and learning curve PS3 hardware game devs largely due to its CPU

That's all different now as XOne and PS4 share nearly identical hardware design. However, I argued already that they will end up identical as devs will code for the lowest common denominator i.e. the slightly weaker Xone GPU and slower RAM. Then scale down further with the help of modern engines to make sure game works on WiiU as well.



superchunk said:
dane007 said:


yea i saw that  but like what type of ram wasn't mentioned as the reveal said 8gb.  or whether it takes 3gb for the OS. its important as they both are considered ram and when the 360 had it , it provided the added advantage over the ps3. Still its not official till ms confirms all the specs details as the sites vary the info. anyways 360 was less powerful then ps3 but ended up doing better then ps3 in graaphics and performance lol.

Those "missing" details (like type of ram) are confirmed by pictures of the inside of XOne. It is known.

360 had many areas that looked better than PS3 early on (definitely not now) due to

1) the head start EVERY dev had on X360 hardware vs PS3

2) the massive complexity and learning curve PS3 hardware game devs largely due to its CPU

That's all different now as XOne and PS4 share nearly identical hardware design. However, I argued already that they will end up identical as devs will code for the lowest common denominator i.e. the slightly weaker Xone GPU and slower RAM. Then scale down further with the help of modern engines to make sure game works on WiiU as well.


i was talking about the speed of ram, teh graphic card power, speed of the cpu.

 

"360 had many areas that looked better than PS3 early on (definitely not now) due to"

 

Thats purely subjective as i still think there games on 360 that look better then games on ps3. i mean i would say crysis games  t o name  afew and halo 4 are better lookin gthen some ps3 gamrees.  Games only done on ps3 can be easily done on xbox 360 if the developers wanted to do . Both are equal in power  with their own strength and weaknesses



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dane007 said:


yea i saw that  but like what type of ram wasn't mentioned as the reveal said 8gb.  or whether it takes 3gb for the OS. its important as they both are considered ram and when the 360 had it , it provided the added advantage over the ps3. Still its not official till ms confirms all the specs details as the sites vary the info. anyways 360 was less powerful then ps3 but ended up doing better then ps3 in graaphics and performance lol.

From Anandtech's analysis, page 3, third paragraph (link found on the OP):

A look at Wired’s excellent high-res teardown photo of the motherboard reveals Micron DDR3-2133 DRAM on board (16 x 16-bit DDR3 devices to be exact). A little math gives us 68.3GB/s of bandwidth to system memory.

The kind of RAM and its speed are known things, but it's true that how many of this RAM is reserved for the OS(es) is still unknown.



Please excuse my bad English.

Currently gaming on a PC with an i5-4670k@stock (for now), 16Gb RAM 1600 MHz and a GTX 1070

Steam / Live / NNID : jonxiquet    Add me if you want, but I'm a single player gamer.

JEMC said:

From Anandtech's analysis, page 3, third paragraph (link found on the OP):

A look at Wired’s excellent high-res teardown photo of the motherboard reveals Micron DDR3-2133 DRAM on board (16 x 16-bit DDR3 devices to be exact). A little math gives us 68.3GB/s of bandwidth to system memory.

The kind of RAM and its speed are known things, but it's true that how many of this RAM is reserved for the OS(es) is still unknown.

Plus, like this generation anyway, as the years roll pass Sony, Microsoft and Nintendo will make some tweaks and optimisations and reduce the amount of ram the Operating Systems use anyway, so initially it's a rather non-issue untill later on in the consoles life anyway.

Also, that memory bandwidth was rounded up. It's actually 68.256Gb/s rather than 68.3. :P

The math is: DDR clock rate * Bits transferred per clock / 8
I.E. 2133 * 256 / 8.



--::{PC Gaming Master Race}::--

Scoobes said:

For comparison sake, bandwidth for each RAM:

In Xbone:

32Mb eSRAM: approx. 166GB/s

8Gb DDR3: 34.132

Add them together and you get 200Gb/s as MS marketed at their reveal. However, in real-world terms they'll be used in parallel and need to be taken separately. The 200 figure is typical marketing crap.

While it is funny to see someone posting MS fud numners, you should stick to the truth, so:

eSRam 102GB/s, ddr3 68.3GB/s.

And please do not add these two numbers, in theory it looks cool, in practice that case is never going to happen. The actual number depends on how the developers use the eSRam (frame buffer only, or managed cache ram+frame buffer). For example, if you push texture data from ddr3 into cache, the actual number is 68GB/s which is the low end. If you bandwidth-starve the gpu with the frame buffer, the number is 102GB/s, which is the high end. The truth is somewhere in between (or rock bottom, if the developers does not carefully handle the two memory pools). In any case, the (theoretical)  gpu limit of 176GB/s of the PS4 are simply faster (the actual use will be around 140-150GB/s I suppose).



drkohler said:
Scoobes said:

For comparison sake, bandwidth for each RAM:

In Xbone:

32Mb eSRAM: approx. 166GB/s

8Gb DDR3: 34.132

Add them together and you get 200Gb/s as MS marketed at their reveal. However, in real-world terms they'll be used in parallel and need to be taken separately. The 200 figure is typical marketing crap.

While it is funny to see someone posting MS fud numners, you should stick to the truth, so:

eSRam 102GB/s, ddr3 68.3GB/s.

And please do not add these two numbers, in theory it looks cool, in practice that case is never going to happen. The actual number depends on how the developers use the eSRam (frame buffer only, or managed cache ram+frame buffer). For example, if you push texture data from ddr3 into cache, the actual number is 68GB/s which is the low end. If you bandwidth-starve the gpu with the frame buffer, the number is 102GB/s, which is the high end. The truth is somewhere in between (or rock bottom, if the developers does not carefully handle the two memory pools). In any case, the (theoretical)  gpu limit of 176GB/s of the PS4 are simply faster (the actual use will be around 140-150GB/s I suppose).

Do you have a link for those numbers?



I May be late here but I'll ask anyway, on other boards I'm hearing a rumour that the XBO's GPU has actually been down clocked to a possible 800-900GFlops due to the ESram yeilds or what ever they're call anyone know about this or is it old and debunked as the OP still has 1.2Tflops?

 

Edit: This seems to be doing the rounds on GAF