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Forums - General - being gay a choice vs born that way.

 

being gay a choice vs born that way.

It's a lifestyle choice 120 25.53%
 
Your born that way 250 53.19%
 
no opinion 36 7.66%
 
other---for anything I missed 62 13.19%
 
Total:468
Chrizum on 06 June 2011
DélioPT said:
fastyxx said:
DélioPT said:

 Why do you call people hypocrites when no one said that they are better than anyone else, actually some made it very clear that they are as anyone else and they point sins to themselves. Should we just stop talking and pointing what in our eyes are sins/flaws/mistakes/etc.? Then how could there even be law in this world or respect and tolerance?
Going that route doesn`t bring anything good, just separation.

Your eyes are seeing evil where there is none. Nobody is after you or her or them, for that matter. We just think differently than you, in this.

The people passing laws to prevent marriage or adoption or civil unions or visitation rights or, like in tennessee, to prohibit schools from even acknowledging the existence of gay people until 9th grade, or serving in the military or job protections or housing rights etc. etc. etc. are not just pointing out disapproval.

To just sit and say "Oh we just disagree, let's all have some tea and cookies and smile at each other" is ignorant.

You can't just look the other way and ignore the injustices done in the name of religion by saying that there's no evil intent behind it.  A Christian may think it's all in the name of goodness and light, but to a gay person it's evil.  The lawmaker or the evangelist or the parent or whomever is going out of their way to try and make life difficult for one group of people while willfully ignoring literally thousands of others of groups who sin according to the Bible.

As for whether stoning is O.T. or N.T., I'm not sure I see how that matters. It's just an excuse some Christians make for better being able to pick ou the parts they like and ignoring the parts that are untenable.

You got to understand that when people do those things you said, and i`m speaking of those who act according to their beliefs and not because of hate, they are acting in accordance to what they believe. Of course there are consequences and it`s impossible for them not to exist.
Everyone can understand that there are consequences of taking a stance, but please, don`t think that when a person doesn`t agree with you, specially on this issue, they are against you personally or against everyone who is gay.
Also, that doesn`t mean that we forget our own sins or even other group`s sins - as you put it. It`s just we are talking about just one issue.

I raised the question for a reason: even Jesus said one time that God`s ways weren`t shown completely to men because men`s hearts were hard, so they couldn`t understand it.

Tell me this: why is being gay wrong?



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fastyxx on 06 June 2011
DélioPT said:

You got to understand that when people do those things you said, and i`m speaking of those who act according to their beliefs and not because of hate, they are acting in accordance to what they believe. Of course there are consequences and it`s impossible for them not to exist.
Everyone can understand that there are consequences of taking a stance, but please, don`t think that when a person doesn`t agree with you, specially on this issue, they are against you personally or against everyone who is gay.
Also, that doesn`t mean that we forget our own sins or even other group`s sins - as you put it. It`s just we are talking about just one issue.

I raised the question for a reason: even Jesus said one time that God`s ways weren`t shown completely to men because men`s hearts were hard, so they couldn`t understand it.

They don't forget.  I agree.  they willfully choose to look past it and cast stones at others, in direct violation of their faith.  Look at gay marriage.  Civil marriage has NOTHING to do with the church.  Zero.  Yet in the name of "defending marriage"  the laws are put into place to block gay marriage rather than dealing with the host of real issues that lead to the death of marriage in a traditional sense.  

Your last line there is the beauty of religion isn't it?  It's the magic answer to it all.  Contradiction?  God doesn't want us to know.  Illogical?  God has a plan.  Completely ludicrous?  That's the definition of faith.

And that's why religions are constructed that way.  Yes, constructed.  Men like Martin Luther and King James and various popes and the priest down the street construct ritual and rite out of their flawed interpretations of what God means.  If that weren't the case, there'd e only one denomination of each religion instead of hundreds or thousands of differences, some great and some small.  



Can't we all just get along and play our games in peace?

cloud1161 on 06 June 2011

i think there are subtle things in a persons life that slowly make them gay without anyone realizing it. it cant really be helped.



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sapphi_snake on 07 June 2011
Chrizum said:

Tell me this: why is being gay wrong?

Because God says so! Isn't it obvious?



"I don't understand how someone could like Tolstoy and Dostoyevsky, but not like Twilight!!!"

"Last book I read was Brokeback Mountain, I just don't have the patience for them unless it's softcore porn."

                                                                               (The Voice of a Generation and Seece)

"If you cant stand the sound of your own voice than dont become a singer !!!!!"

                                                                               (pizzahut451)

sapphi_snake on 07 June 2011
DélioPT said:

You got to understand that when people do those things you said, and i`m speaking of those who act according to their beliefs and not because of hate, they are acting in accordance to what they believe. Of course there are consequences and it`s impossible for them not to exist.
Everyone can understand that there are consequences of taking a stance, but please, don`t think that when a person doesn`t agree with you, specially on this issue, they are against you personally or against everyone who is gay.
Also, that doesn`t mean that we forget our own sins or even other group`s sins - as you put it. It`s just we are talking about just one issue.

I raised the question for a reason: even Jesus said one time that God`s ways weren`t shown completely to men because men`s hearts were hard, so they couldn`t understand it.

Already told you that you can't use the "it's my religion" card to justify hateful beliefs.

Your final paragraph is jsut a cop-out.



"I don't understand how someone could like Tolstoy and Dostoyevsky, but not like Twilight!!!"

"Last book I read was Brokeback Mountain, I just don't have the patience for them unless it's softcore porn."

                                                                               (The Voice of a Generation and Seece)

"If you cant stand the sound of your own voice than dont become a singer !!!!!"

                                                                               (pizzahut451)

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sad.man.loves.vgc on 07 June 2011

People are born with a lot much more disastrous awful abnormalities. Why is it so hard to believe that being gay could be something one is born with? How can you say that your fair god allows other abnormalities to happen but he has total control over the gay gene?


If you think being gay is too awful to be genetic, then go search for the REAL genetic abnormalities and tell me why god let it happen. I guess it's ok since it doesn't involve two adults touching each other.



DélioPT on 07 June 2011
Chrizum said:
DélioPT said:

You got to understand that when people do those things you said, and i`m speaking of those who act according to their beliefs and not because of hate, they are acting in accordance to what they believe. Of course there are consequences and it`s impossible for them not to exist.
Everyone can understand that there are consequences of taking a stance, but please, don`t think that when a person doesn`t agree with you, specially on this issue, they are against you personally or against everyone who is gay.
Also, that doesn`t mean that we forget our own sins or even other group`s sins - as you put it. It`s just we are talking about just one issue.

I raised the question for a reason: even Jesus said one time that God`s ways weren`t shown completely to men because men`s hearts were hard, so they couldn`t understand it.

Tell me this: why is being gay wrong?


No one said that being gay is wrong. If you read some of the posts above you will see that.



sapphi_snake on 07 June 2011
DélioPT said:
Chrizum said:
DélioPT said:
 

You got to understand that when people do those things you said, and i`m speaking of those who act according to their beliefs and not because of hate, they are acting in accordance to what they believe. Of course there are consequences and it`s impossible for them not to exist.
Everyone can understand that there are consequences of taking a stance, but please, don`t think that when a person doesn`t agree with you, specially on this issue, they are against you personally or against everyone who is gay.
Also, that doesn`t mean that we forget our own sins or even other group`s sins - as you put it. It`s just we are talking about just one issue.

I raised the question for a reason: even Jesus said one time that God`s ways weren`t shown completely to men because men`s hearts were hard, so they couldn`t understand it.

Tell me this: why is being gay wrong?


No one said that being gay is wrong. If you read some of the posts above you will see that.

Let's rephrase that question. Why is homosexuality wrong?



"I don't understand how someone could like Tolstoy and Dostoyevsky, but not like Twilight!!!"

"Last book I read was Brokeback Mountain, I just don't have the patience for them unless it's softcore porn."

                                                                               (The Voice of a Generation and Seece)

"If you cant stand the sound of your own voice than dont become a singer !!!!!"

                                                                               (pizzahut451)

DélioPT on 07 June 2011
fastyxx said:
DélioPT said:

You got to understand that when people do those things you said, and i`m speaking of those who act according to their beliefs and not because of hate, they are acting in accordance to what they believe. Of course there are consequences and it`s impossible for them not to exist.
Everyone can understand that there are consequences of taking a stance, but please, don`t think that when a person doesn`t agree with you, specially on this issue, they are against you personally or against everyone who is gay.
Also, that doesn`t mean that we forget our own sins or even other group`s sins - as you put it. It`s just we are talking about just one issue.

I raised the question for a reason: even Jesus said one time that God`s ways weren`t shown completely to men because men`s hearts were hard, so they couldn`t understand it.

They don't forget.  I agree.  they willfully choose to look past it and cast stones at others, in direct violation of their faith.  Look at gay marriage.  Civil marriage has NOTHING to do with the church.  Zero.  Yet in the name of "defending marriage"  the laws are put into place to block gay marriage rather than dealing with the host of real issues that lead to the death of marriage in a traditional sense.  

Your last line there is the beauty of religion isn't it?  It's the magic answer to it all.  Contradiction?  God doesn't want us to know.  Illogical?  God has a plan.  Completely ludicrous?  That's the definition of faith.

And that's why religions are constructed that way.  Yes, constructed.  Men like Martin Luther and King James and various popes and the priest down the street construct ritual and rite out of their flawed interpretations of what God means.  If that weren't the case, there'd e only one denomination of each religion instead of hundreds or thousands of differences, some great and some small.  

The reason people vote against something civil marriage for people of the same sex it`s because, if they are given the chance to express their views, they will go with what they believe. For the Church is an institution made by God and Jesus, and, to the Church, gay marriage is seen as something that goes against that view, so they do speak about "defending marriage".

No that`s not the definition of faith and no one constructed anything. Actually, no one will tell you that they know everything about God. For that reason there really are several branches even on Christianity. But saying that equals to being constructed is wrong.



DélioPT on 07 June 2011
sapphi_snake said:
DélioPT said:

You got to understand that when people do those things you said, and i`m speaking of those who act according to their beliefs and not because of hate, they are acting in accordance to what they believe. Of course there are consequences and it`s impossible for them not to exist.
Everyone can understand that there are consequences of taking a stance, but please, don`t think that when a person doesn`t agree with you, specially on this issue, they are against you personally or against everyone who is gay.
Also, that doesn`t mean that we forget our own sins or even other group`s sins - as you put it. It`s just we are talking about just one issue.

I raised the question for a reason: even Jesus said one time that God`s ways weren`t shown completely to men because men`s hearts were hard, so they couldn`t understand it.

Already told you that you can't use the "it's my religion" card to justify hateful beliefs.

Your final paragraph is jsut a cop-out.

Speaking about hateful speeches, let`s see: all i have been doing is calling someone`s actions a sin. Got nothing against the person just don´t agree with a specific action.
Now, let`s see your comments:

"mind your own business"
"can`t use the "it´s my religion" card..."
"you and your kind"

I could swear there was an attempt on free speech and my own dignity. Seems like descrimination.