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Forums - Sony - Finland: consumer board says Sony should pay dude €100 for OtherOS removal

Kudistos Megistos on 24 April 2011
kitler53 said:

last time i checked piracy wasn't considered very respectful.

Last time I checked, not every person who bought a PS3 was committing piracy. In fact, not a single one was.

But everyone had something they paid for taken away from them.

you know full well that the option to install linux wasn't targeted at the average consumer ... it was an olive branch to the homebrewers.  that's why a majority of the poster on this site don't give a shit about loosing other OS and why the mainstream consumer cares dramatically less ... hell, most of them don't even know what the feature is.  

That last bit doesn't surprise me. Were you one of them?

In any case, you can't take something away just because a small number of people use it. Maybe Sony should pick out some game that not many people bought and stop people from playing it. Obviously, if only a few people used it, it doesn't matter, right?

other os was a gift to the homebrewers.  a portion of the homebrew community gave sony the finger by finding an exploit that allowed them to breach the security.

Can one person be called "a portion"?

And can you ban something because it is possible to do something bad with it? Perhaps we should stop the sale of all knives except plastic ones. After all, you could stab someone with one! Don't give me any of that "I need to chop up my food" BS, you're obviously going to stab someone.

you guys fucked up, next gen you won't be able to complain about loosing a feature cause you'll never have it.

No, we won't have any extra features from Sony.

We'll have Xboxes instead.


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kitler53 on 24 April 2011
Capulous said:

I agree, claiming Sony has more respect for customers than MS or Nintendo has no merit.  MS and Nintendo did not  list another OS as a selling point for their system. Sony did. They also offered free online play as well, it was not either or, it was for both.

Since the PS3 was hacked and has been hacked before and after the removal of Linux; it seems like removing it changed nothing. Having additional features that is paid for (they were not "gifts") does not mean a company has more respect for consumers. These items were all part of the advertised package for PS3. If someone purchased a PS3 for these featueres, and when these features were advertised as part of the system, then they have every right to file a grievance.


could you send me a link to where Sony's marketing listed other OS as a selling point?  i check my box and it wasn't a listed feature, i've never seen it marketed.  frankly, if it wasn't for these forums i'd probably have no idea the feature ever existed.  but if i'm wrong and sony marketed this feature i'd love to know i'm wrong.



ROBOTECHHEAVEN on 24 April 2011

sony shouldnt have too pay this guy a damn cent. 



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oldschoolfool on 24 April 2011

Are people still talking about this? The only people that cared about this were the hacker's and piracy people. If people hate Sony that much,then bye all means buy something else,instead of posting about how much you hate sony and what they did in every thread. 



Kudistos Megistos on 24 April 2011
Ferryarthur said:

Or those people are shooting themselves in the foot by using a feature the wrong way, the piracy lovers are only making it worse for the TRUE homebrew people. They took it too far, and this is the result. This is something that goes both ways.

Sony: security failure/feature                  =    hackers: Hacking Skilzz going too far.

Sony: fear of piracy/hacks                         =  hackers: making piracy and hacking possible!

You can't have Sony's problems without the hackers, remove them and Sony's problems disappear. Hackers staying within bounds = keeping OtherOs, but its too late for that now. I feel bad for the people who just wanted their OtherOs function for something that didn't compromise any other party.

If your neighbour fires rockets at me, I'm going to bomb your entire street. It's not my fault, it's his fault!

These "hackers" don't excuse Sony's heavy-handed and ILLEGAL actions, actions that punish everyone.

And It could be just my eyes getting old, but I seem to see Sony gaining a bigger market share again. Despite their customer rights infringement.

That's because PS3s are cheaper now

And how many of those ''honest'' gamers are really that honest? A lot of them, if not almost all of them are doing way worse things to other companies and gamers. Most ''honest'' gamers don't care about the OtherOS or actually agree with nullifying it, lets be honest here, how many people actually knew it existed before it got removed?

Did you just imply that stupid=honest?

Everyone who isn't an idiot knew about Linux on PS3, and there was a significant community using it. Just because YOU and your friends didn't use it, doesn't mean no-one did, and doesn't mean that the ones who did use it don't matter.

The problem with these kind of things is that people only see the bad side of stuff, they removed a small function of the ps3, but people don't see the stuff they got for free AFTER buying their product. They nag more about a single feature being removed, than a bunch of new ones being put in.

They nag about a feature they paid for.

I if steal something from you and then give you some free stuff, would that be OK? You can't nullify for a crime by handing out free stuff afterwards.

If sony needs to pay someone for removing a feature, then should they pay for getting new ones?

Fine. Sony would be well withing their rights to do that.

The new one wasn't mentioned when they bought their ps3 either right, so Sony could just charge for it right? When the old ones are removed, aswell as when knew ones are putting in, you have to agree to the new users terms of the update. You can also choose to not agree to them and keep your OtherOS and old features, with the cost of not being to able to play the newest games.

A console has to be capable of playing any game designed for it. A PS3 is sold on the understanding that it will be able to play PS3 games.

Btw, did the mention of the OtherOS by sony include the promise that they could play the latest games without losing the OtherOS? Yes I agree it seems natural, but you should always doublecheck that before getting ripped of by a loophole.

It's implied unless they expressly stated otherwise. Don't try to shift the burden of explanation.

People should really give the big three a break sometimes, they're not perfect, everyone can make a mistake. But instead of console wars we are getting the nag and sue wars. I actually like the console wars better, at least it made me lol sometimes.

Everyone can make a mistake. Not everyone breaks the law.





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Galaki on 24 April 2011
Kudistos Megistos said:

The last time I checked, infringing their customers rights wasn't considered very respectful.


When Sony slap you on the left cheek, it's only respectful to present your right cheek, too.



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naruball on 24 April 2011

Well judging from how much the sales of the ps3 have suffered since the removal of other OS, I think the public clearly showed Sony how much they care about this feature.

Having said that, I understand why people are upset about it. Still it is a feature that endangered the ps3 community, as we can clearly see now that the ps3 has been hacked. IMHO it was a necessary "evil". It's not like Sony decided one day to take it away to make more profit or something. I think a similar situation would be if one of the "advertised" features of the ps3 was causing problems to the customer's eyes (much like an episode of Pokemon). Would Sony have to keep the feauture, because some customers want it even though it can be affect most of the ps3 community?

And if you think that piracy or jailbreaking or the attacks on the psn are not a big deal, then maybe you don't have a ps3 or don't use it that much. I personally am getting sick and tired of having some as*holes  affect my gaming experience. And before judging a company, because it is a company and "it's evil", think about what yoou would do if you were in their shoes. Leave the other OS for 1% and let themselves and the other 80% (cause not everyone uses ps3 for gaming or psn I assume) suffer?



Ferryarthur on 24 April 2011
Kudistos Megistos said:
Ferryarthur said:

To bad i couldn't edit my post in time, I was foolish enough to use IE8, now i use chrome and just lost my entire post :D

If your neighbour fires rockets at me, I'm going to bomb your entire street. It's not my fault, it's his fault!

It might be stupid, but happens everyday. Innocents get involved in everything. But that wasnt my point, my point was that it's a shame for the true homebrew community that some pople had to go too far. If they didn't Sony, Sony wouldnt have had a reason to do so. Though this is only IF that was the reason of course, I'm assuming that in this case. I was saying Sony fears weren't delusional.

These "hackers" don't excuse Sony's heavy-handed and ILLEGAL actions, actions that punish everyone.

But they do the same, Piracy hurts companies, Anon taking down psn hurts everyone aswell, attacking innocent family members.>> If your dad`s boss fires rockets at me, I'm going to bomb your entire street. It's not my fault, it's his fault!<< Seem familiar, see? It happens like I said.

 

That's because PS3s are cheaper now

Uhm? Thats besides the point, i only said they gained market share, you only gave the reason as to why. My point was correct, wasn't it? (do read the post it was intented to)

 

Did you just imply that stupid=honest?

Everyone who isn't an idiot knew about Linux on PS3, and there was a significant community using it. Just because YOU and your friends didn't use it, doesn't mean no-one did, and doesn't mean that the ones who did use it don't matter.

 

Putting words in my mouth eh? My point was that a part of the community wasn't that honest either, they misused the function, creating this whole mess. I'll repeat i do feel bad about the actual ''honest'' users, they deserve better, but I do understands Sony's point of view. But how big was it, 20 million, how many people knew about OtherOS, 30 million? How many people were bothered by homebrew hacks? Significant is an opinion, something we don't share in this case, sony probably didn't agree with you either, or they just didn't care enough.

But I shouldn't have used the word ''honest'' in the second part, it made you miss my point. I just meant people who don't pirate, probably because they don't know any better. So ''honest'' they buy their games.

 

They nag about a feature they paid for.

I if steal something from you and then give you some free stuff, would that be OK? You can't nullify for a crime by handing out free stuff afterwards.

No of course not, but you could let it slip, they've been nice to you. And they didn't steal it, they locked it up from you because it was dangerous for them. You could just support your friend in need.

 

Fine. Sony would be well withing their rights to do that.

 

A console has to be capable of playing any game designed for it. A PS3 is sold on the understanding that it will be able to play PS3 games. 

It is capable, as long as your agree to the new terms, OtherOS or not. Even if you never used OtherOs, but still don't agree, you won't be able to play the new ones. But what if the new terms crash against an old one? Then it's your choice, just like it's always been.

 

It's implied unless they expressly stated otherwise. Don't try to shift the burden of explanation.

Implied = not a fact. Like I said, it could be a loophole.

 

Everyone can make a mistake. Not everyone breaks the law.

I meant the security ''mistake'' as the person I qouted reffered it as one, they made the mistake to give the OtherOS.







Barozi on 24 April 2011

I'd love to get 100€ back :P



xenogears1234 on 25 April 2011
oldschoolfool said:

Are people still talking about this? The only people that cared about this were the hacker's and piracy people. If people hate Sony that much,then bye all means buy something else,instead of posting about how much you hate sony and what they did in every thread. 


Im with you a 100% i wonder whenever this argument is brought up whether this is just xbots trolling. Other os is a function not advertised as a key marketing/sales tool so to me this is just people whining about nothing the removal of said os in no way affected the gaming or blu ray functions of the console which is why everyone bought the system in the first place. By the way to the OP of this thread finland has as much of a chance of enforcing this as the UN had of stopping us from going into iraq i.e none. Oh and one last thing you know those agreements that you check off when you get a firmware update if some of the posters in here bothered to read them they would realize that sony's lawyers have said they retain the right to do whatever they want including removing other OS if you don't like it by a wii or an xbox unless sony removes something detrimental to gaming/bluray playback im not to concerned.