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Forums - Gaming Discussion - Pirates, admit you're thieves

Kasz216 said:
pezus said:
Kasz216 said:
pezus said:

Pirating>Buying used games

 

That is all


Not actually true.

While piracy has been shown to be negliagble when it comes to sales.


Used markets have been show to increase new sales and be a positive force in the market place.


I mean think about it... where did those used games come from?

People who bought the game new.... why did they buy the game new?  Partially because they knew when they were done with it they could sell it and put that money towards new games.

They could also have bought it used and then sold it, thus not giving the publisher any money.

Except... every used copy needs to have at one time been a new copy at some point.  Making that arguement a silly one.  If someone bought a used game and sold it back... they probably paid little for it, and got little back.

Which meant they wouldn't of bought it new in the firstplace.   Heck said game probably isn't even on the shelves anymore at this point.

Why do you say that? If I couldn't buy used games, would I not buy games at all?



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Galaki said:
phinch1 said:

The retailer then gets a smaller audience to sell to, if people know they can get it for free it make it a lot harder for retailers to sell the game, heck they might not even sell it, at the end of the day it is stealing, you have a developers product and you havnt paid for it


A download does not equate a sale. Remember that.

But it's exactly what the corps are trying to tell you and many eat it up.


THIS.



updated: 14.01.2012

playing right now: Xenoblade Chronicles

Hype-o-meter, from least to most hyped:  the Last Story, Twisted Metal, Mass Effect 3, Final Fantasy XIII-2, Final Fantasy Versus XIII, Playstation ViTA

bet with Mordred11 that Rage will look better on Xbox 360.

Piracy is not theft. Some people may consider it morally equivilent, but that doesn't make it theft.

 

But really, why pirate when there's Steam? Steam offers a full row of pros that pirated copies lack, and prices are often so low it should be illegal.

Steam needs to be on consoles.



This is invisible text!

pezus said:
Kasz216 said:
pezus said:
Kasz216 said:
pezus said:

Pirating>Buying used games

 

That is all


Not actually true.

While piracy has been shown to be negliagble when it comes to sales.


Used markets have been show to increase new sales and be a positive force in the market place.


I mean think about it... where did those used games come from?

People who bought the game new.... why did they buy the game new?  Partially because they knew when they were done with it they could sell it and put that money towards new games.

They could also have bought it used and then sold it, thus not giving the publisher any money.

Except... every used copy needs to have at one time been a new copy at some point.  Making that arguement a silly one.  If someone bought a used game and sold it back... they probably paid little for it, and got little back.

Which meant they wouldn't of bought it new in the firstplace.   Heck said game probably isn't even on the shelves anymore at this point.

Why do you say that? If I couldn't buy used games, would I not buy games at all?

If you are only buying used games at $20 or under?  Well yeah.

or at best you'd be buying the discount clearing out the bin type games at K-Mart and such.  Which doesn't really benefit the developer nearly as much as getting people who are willing to pay $30-40 to pay $60 upfront.


$60 dollars today is more valuable then $40 dollars 6 months from now and $20 1 year from now.



Kasz216 said:
pezus said:
Kasz216 said:
pezus said:
Kasz216 said:
pezus said:

Pirating>Buying used games

 

That is all


Not actually true.

While piracy has been shown to be negliagble when it comes to sales.


Used markets have been show to increase new sales and be a positive force in the market place.


I mean think about it... where did those used games come from?

People who bought the game new.... why did they buy the game new?  Partially because they knew when they were done with it they could sell it and put that money towards new games.

They could also have bought it used and then sold it, thus not giving the publisher any money.

Except... every used copy needs to have at one time been a new copy at some point.  Making that arguement a silly one.  If someone bought a used game and sold it back... they probably paid little for it, and got little back.

Which meant they wouldn't of bought it new in the firstplace.   Heck said game probably isn't even on the shelves anymore at this point.

Why do you say that? If I couldn't buy used games, would I not buy games at all?

If you are only buying used games at $20 or under?  Well yeah.

or at best you'd be buying the discount clearing out the bin type games at K-Mart and such.  Which doesn't really benefit the developer nearly as much as getting people who are willing to pay $30-40 to pay $60 upfront.


$60 dollars today is more valuable then $40 dollars 6 months from now and $20 1 year from now.

I said nothing about $20 or under.

Even buying a discounted new game benefits the developer, buying used doesn't, pirating doesn't. I stated piracy>used games because if you pirate, there is no middle man benefitting.



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Kasz216 said:
Zlejedi said:
SpartenOmega117 said:

I tried pirating once and i was not able to enjoy the game at all. Never pirated again.

While excuses about pirating are funny, this myth is even more rediculus than whatever pirates come with.

And doubly so in the era when half of pc games sell through digital download.


I'm... confused... what's the myth your talking about?  That he pirated a game once then didn't like it?


Truth is, if you pirate something there is a VERY good chance you aren't going to enjoy it as much as if you paid for it yourself... for at least 3 distinct reasons.

 

1) Cognitive Dissonance.  Say someone is given the choice between a blue backpack and a red backpak... and they don't care, they like both backpacks equally, and on a whim, the guy picks Red.   In one year, you will find that the person who picked red will like Red backpacks more, and furthermore will dislike blue backpacks.  Give someone the ability to have any backpack at anytime... this won't happen. 

2) Value.  Paying for something rather then taking it for free (assuming you can pay) shows you value it more.  You make 20 dollars an hour and bought something for 60 bucks?  That was 3 hours of your life right their, what you bought is worth 3 hours of you life.  If you downloaded it?  What's that worth?   Like 10 minutes of your time, off screen, while you did other stuff.  (Or hours if you have a bad internet connection, but you get the point.)

3) With an infinite number of games, most of which aren't going to be great, you'll tend to go more towards trying more new stuff, that's going to probably be less stellar, and focus less on going back and enjoying your favorites.

Are the games you buy so crappy you have to find additional enjoyment in thinking you payed for them instead of just you know playing them ?



PROUD MEMBER OF THE PSP RPG FAN CLUB

pezus said:
Kasz216 said:
pezus said:
Kasz216 said:
pezus said:
 

 

Except... every used copy needs to have at one time been a new copy at some point.  Making that arguement a silly one.  If someone bought a used game and sold it back... they probably paid little for it, and got little back.

Which meant they wouldn't of bought it new in the firstplace.   Heck said game probably isn't even on the shelves anymore at this point.

Why do you say that? If I couldn't buy used games, would I not buy games at all?

If you are only buying used games at $20 or under?  Well yeah.

or at best you'd be buying the discount clearing out the bin type games at K-Mart and such.  Which doesn't really benefit the developer nearly as much as getting people who are willing to pay $30-40 to pay $60 upfront.


$60 dollars today is more valuable then $40 dollars 6 months from now and $20 1 year from now.

I said nothing about $20 or under.

Even buying a discounted new game benefits the developer, buying used doesn't, pirating doesn't. I stated piracy>used games because if you pirate, there is no middle man benefitting.


Except buying used does benefit the developer.  Which i stated, go back and read it. 

Or, i'll state it again here more clearly. 

1) Buying used, creates the used market.

2) Which means people like Gamestop will buy used games.

3) Which means people who don't want to pay $60 dollars for a game WILL because they know they can get that money back.

 

Now,

1) People stop buying used games.

2) Gamestop stops buying used games.

3) People who don't want to pay $60 for a game won't buy it.  Period.  They may pick it up when it's eventually $30 and the company is hurt because they don't make nearly as much upfront and may or may not even still be around in the 6-12 months it takes... and their funding of new games is much lower because they don't have enough upfront money.

Additionally person who woud of paid a total of $60 knowing they'd get 30 may not see $30 as worth it to pay for a game that's 6-12 months old... and therefore may not even pay $30 for it then.  Or they may have just borrowed the game from a friend who bought it.   Or for that matter... pirated it.



Zlejedi said:
Kasz216 said:
Zlejedi said:
SpartenOmega117 said:

I tried pirating once and i was not able to enjoy the game at all. Never pirated again.

While excuses about pirating are funny, this myth is even more rediculus than whatever pirates come with.

And doubly so in the era when half of pc games sell through digital download.


I'm... confused... what's the myth your talking about?  That he pirated a game once then didn't like it?


Truth is, if you pirate something there is a VERY good chance you aren't going to enjoy it as much as if you paid for it yourself... for at least 3 distinct reasons.

 

1) Cognitive Dissonance.  Say someone is given the choice between a blue backpack and a red backpak... and they don't care, they like both backpacks equally, and on a whim, the guy picks Red.   In one year, you will find that the person who picked red will like Red backpacks more, and furthermore will dislike blue backpacks.  Give someone the ability to have any backpack at anytime... this won't happen. 

2) Value.  Paying for something rather then taking it for free (assuming you can pay) shows you value it more.  You make 20 dollars an hour and bought something for 60 bucks?  That was 3 hours of your life right their, what you bought is worth 3 hours of you life.  If you downloaded it?  What's that worth?   Like 10 minutes of your time, off screen, while you did other stuff.  (Or hours if you have a bad internet connection, but you get the point.)

3) With an infinite number of games, most of which aren't going to be great, you'll tend to go more towards trying more new stuff, that's going to probably be less stellar, and focus less on going back and enjoying your favorites.

Are the games you buy so crappy you have to find additional enjoyment in thinking you payed for them instead of just you know playing them ?

It doesn't matter how good or bad the game is.  Even if your favorite game is a pirated game, you will have enjoyed it less then if you purchased it.



Kasz216 said:
Zlejedi said:
Kasz216 said:
Zlejedi said:
SpartenOmega117 said:

I tried pirating once and i was not able to enjoy the game at all. Never pirated again.

While excuses about pirating are funny, this myth is even more rediculus than whatever pirates come with.

And doubly so in the era when half of pc games sell through digital download.


I'm... confused... what's the myth your talking about?  That he pirated a game once then didn't like it?


Truth is, if you pirate something there is a VERY good chance you aren't going to enjoy it as much as if you paid for it yourself... for at least 3 distinct reasons.

 

1) Cognitive Dissonance.  Say someone is given the choice between a blue backpack and a red backpak... and they don't care, they like both backpacks equally, and on a whim, the guy picks Red.   In one year, you will find that the person who picked red will like Red backpacks more, and furthermore will dislike blue backpacks.  Give someone the ability to have any backpack at anytime... this won't happen. 

2) Value.  Paying for something rather then taking it for free (assuming you can pay) shows you value it more.  You make 20 dollars an hour and bought something for 60 bucks?  That was 3 hours of your life right their, what you bought is worth 3 hours of you life.  If you downloaded it?  What's that worth?   Like 10 minutes of your time, off screen, while you did other stuff.  (Or hours if you have a bad internet connection, but you get the point.)

3) With an infinite number of games, most of which aren't going to be great, you'll tend to go more towards trying more new stuff, that's going to probably be less stellar, and focus less on going back and enjoying your favorites.

Are the games you buy so crappy you have to find additional enjoyment in thinking you payed for them instead of just you know playing them ?

It doesn't matter how good or bad the game is.  Even if your favorite game is a pirated game, you will have enjoyed it less then if you purchased it.

My 10 years of pirating stuff starting from amiga times shows completly diffrent.



PROUD MEMBER OF THE PSP RPG FAN CLUB

Kasz216 said:


Except buying used does benefit the developer.  Which i stated, go back and read it. 

Or, i'll state it again here more clearly. 

1) Buying used, creates the used market.

2) Which means people like Gamestop will buy used games.

3) Which means people who don't want to pay $60 dollars for a game WILL because they know they can get that money back.

This is the best thing I have read in a long time. Very, very good points indeed. Especially the last one.