It's true. In fact you can find extremists from any religion. But do they really still count as part of that religion when they become extremists?

There is an article in Focus magazine this month that talks about how the structure of cults and the tactics they employ to get people to become sympathetic to their cause and join (little short of brainwashing). But what was interesting is that cults and extremist groups follow the same structure and recruit people the same way, so one could make the argument that extremist groups are no longer part of the religion, but have split to form a new religion.

Or they represent what happens when people fully follow a religion. Maybe they're the "true believers".

I don't even consider these countries "Islamic" if they force people to convert. That's just extremist scum abusing the Islamic name. In fact, the Quran states that it's forbidden to force people into your religion:  (No compulsion in religion) (Al-Baqarah 2:256)

and still people turn into extremists. what a shame

Well, I disagree I'm afraid.

I think that often the extremists have their own agendas, and often you find that they purposefully misinterpret the text to suit their own agenda.

It's like the Westboro baptist church using the book of Leviticus for their anti gay agenda. Every christian worth their salt knows that Leviticus is not supposed to be used as a moral guide, because the teachings of Jesus superseded it (thankfully, Leviticus would be an appalling book for morals in modern society). But that doesn't stop Westboro baptist church picking out a few key passages from Leviticus, discarding the rest*, and using them to support their extremist views.

It is the very definition of misinterpreting the bible, and I think this is a fairly typical example of the mentality behind the extremist groups.

Ask someone who knows the texts well, like MrStickball for example, I'm sure they'll agree (hopefully).

(*I'm certain that even Fred Phelps would confess that a bat is a mammal)

Who even takes the Westbro Baptist Church seriously? I mean, they failed to spark attention with their Quran burning, AND they were denied entry to the UK for their anti-gay march.

Well, like any extremist group, no one takes them seriously, which is good. They are a pest, nothing more. But I was just using them as an example of how an extremist group operates.

I'm not certain whether the reformation that happened in the renaissance is entirely possible with Islam ...

From my understanding, in Islam Mohammed is the final prophet because he received the instructions from god and passed them down in written form in his lifetime; and because of this there is no need to interpret what is said in the Qur'an, and his actions in the Hadiths represent holy sanctioned behaviour. In other words, there is little leeway within Islam to allow for any reforms that would bring much of the Islamic world into modern thoughts and beliefs on a vast array of topics.

Now, this isn't to suggest that all Muslims maintain these beliefs; after all, most Muslims that were born and raised in western developed nations tend to be very secular in nature (in much the same way that most Chirstians in the developed world are more secular than religious).

His supposed actions in the Hadiths are what's the problem. They are what needs to be reformed, i.e. thrown away. They are what is different and contradictory amongst the varies sects of Islam. They are an abomination according to the Qur'an that states you cannot take any other book before itself.

The reformation that needs to happen is the same as what happened in Christianity. Then Priests were the only ones allowed who read the Bible. They were the Hadith. They were removed of this power and the result was free thinking about Christianity and the return to its actual peaceful and moderate message.

Islam needs this. It needs people to stop blindly following the edicts of the Mullahs who have given themselves a priestly power that doesn't even exist in the Qur'an. Islam is not supposed to have "priests". Only teachers who themselves can be wrong and learn, i.e. Imams (means teacher in Arabic, example is Arab Christians don't use that word for their Priests). People need to return to their own readings and understanding of the Qur'an.

People need to realize that what they've done with the Hadiths is the same exact thing as what the Qur'an tells us that Christians have done with their Bible. Its not a word of God (from Islam's point of view), its now a primary work of people who wrote and edited it many/hundreds of years after the respective Prophet ascended(Jesus) or died(Muhammad).

As for your comment regarding modern thinking in Islam... you really need to study history outside of western. Islamic Spain is what ignited the Renaissance in Europe. For centuries when Arab Empire and Islam was at its peak of power it was truly free. It had freedoms of religion, speech, sexual parity, etc. It was the forefront of sciences and math in every way thanks to Arabs realizing the importance of Greek literary work. It had the largest library the world has ever known before that was destroyed by the Mongols who almost immediately afterword completely converted to Islam and returned their conquered nations back to the Islamic Empire. The original Caliphs were are chosen democratically (this democracy vs theocracy was the original reason why Sunni and Shia split respectively).

Islam is not at odds with free democratic societies. Its been there before. Way before the West considered it an option. The problem is over the centuries these societies have fallen to servant roles to outside forces, i.e. Turks, then Europe, and US. They have moved from highly educated and free society to barely educated and largely illiterate. Where it was common to see Muslims who had the entire Qur'an memorized, you now see those whose only references to the Qur'an are based on the speeches of others. In fact, I'd argue that most of the Muslim-Arab world know more about the Hadiths than they do the Qur'an. Muhummad himself wouldn't allow anything else written down that he said or did during his lifetime unless he specifically said it was from God, i.e. the Qur'an. It wasn't until decades after he died that the Hadiths began to be collected and they vary or contradict each other, the Qur'an, and simple logic.

ok, I'll end my rant here, but I think you get my point.

Trying to kill off an entire race (the Jews) is far different than a law concerning adultery. If there's a genocide going on of course we need to step in, but its not our place to go and change laws in another country. If we start forcefully changing their laws we don't like then when does it end?

And as for it being illegal to be anything but muslim in some countries that does suck. The best advice I can give Christians or Hindus is to GTFO of those places if possible.