By using this site, you agree to our Privacy Policy and our Terms of Use. Close

Forums - General - Should People Take Justice Into Their Own Hands (partocular case)

 

Should People Take Justice Into Their Own Hands (partocular case)

Yes 48 57.83%
 
No 32 38.55%
 
Total:80

i see our discussion had a big effect on you.

i know what those boys did was beyond wrong, but killing children is also wrong. it was right for them to be detained in comfort, something that was lacking in their lives in the first place. the main point of their imprisonment was to keep them out of society, so they were no longer a threat. I don't believe that torturing them or keeping them in a bare cell is necessary. They have no freedom, and they'reaway from society. That's what imprisonment is, right?

After all, there is evidently something very wrong in their minds, and after thinking about it for a few days (since we spoke about it), I've realised that its a good thing, them being given access to some normal childhood things. After all, wouldn't deprivation from that just make them worse as they grew older?

What I DON'T agree with, however, is their release and new identities. Jack Straw actually endangered the lives of many UK citizens when he grante them new identities. VIgilante attacks on individuals thought to be Jon Venables have occurred, and what happens when someone is wrongly murdered for having a build/accent/geography similar to the predicted ones of these men?

I don't think that the guilty boys should have been killed, by the government or anyone else. But those children are now men, and the past remains the same... the fact that the government were so worried about attempts on their lives just goes to show that the story, nearly 20 years on, is still very much in people's minds, and people are still angry.

That story still makes me so so sad.



Highwaystar101 said: trashleg said that if I didn't pay back the money she leant me, she would come round and break my legs... That's why people call her trashleg, because she trashes the legs of the people she loan sharks money to.
Around the Network
sapphi_snake said:
Porcupine_I said:

hold the moral sledgehammer.

i never defended anything they did, i simply question your standpoint in this case.

you are the one asking for the death of people. but you are not ready to kill them yourself, because you are scared of the consequences.

what does that make you in the end?

A coward? But the reason I wouldn't want to kill them does not have anything do to woth my fear of "consiquences". I'm just not cold blooded enough to be a good executioner. There are people better suited for that.

 

Now what does your desire to let child killers on the streets make you?

and that desire do i express in which of my posts exactly?

Don't be childish now. you have actually thought about what you asked in your OP, that is a good thing! There is no need to revert to juvenile argumentations because you didn't like what you came up with.



“It appeared that there had even been demonstrations to thank Big Brother for raising the chocolate ration to twenty grams a week. And only yesterday, he reflected, it had been announced that the ration was to be reduced to twenty grams a week. Was it possible that they could swallow that, after only twenty-four hours? Yes, they swallowed it.”

- George Orwell, ‘1984’

trashleg said:

i see our discussion had a big effect on you.

i know what those boys did was beyond wrong, but killing children is also wrong. it was right for them to be detained in comfort, something that was lacking in their lives in the first place. the main point of their imprisonment was to keep them out of society, so they were no longer a threat. I don't believe that torturing them or keeping them in a bare cell is necessary. They have no freedom, and they'reaway from society. That's what imprisonment is, right?

After all, there is evidently something very wrong in their minds, and after thinking about it for a few days (since we spoke about it), I've realised that its a good thing, them being given access to some normal childhood things. After all, wouldn't deprivation from that just make them worse as they grew older?

What I DON'T agree with, however, is their release and new identities. Jack Straw actually endangered the lives of many UK citizens when he grante them new identities. VIgilante attacks on individuals thought to be Jon Venables have occurred, and what happens when someone is wrongly murdered for having a build/accent/geography similar to the predicted ones of these men?

I don't think that the guilty boys should have been killed, by the government or anyone else. But those children are now men, and the past remains the same... the fact that the government were so worried about attempts on their lives just goes to show that the story, nearly 20 years on, is still very much in people's minds, and people are still angry.

That story still makes me so so sad.

In my opinion they should never have been released. They should've spent their whole lives behind bars (and no comforts and luxuries, like TV or workout either). There are situations where compassion is not a good thing, and sometimes it's better when you lack it entirely. Administiring punishment to such individuals is such a time. It's about obtaining justice for the victims, and for society as a whole.

If anything, these two are better off now than they would've been had they never committed this atrocity.

The fact that they were abused isn't an excuse. Most people are abused in some form. Very few act like they did. They choose to kidnapp, torture, mutilate and kill a 2 yar old boy. No one forced them to do that. They deserve no compassion.

As for the identity thing, you're right. Besides that, people have a right to know who they're dealing with. One of them was convited last year for possessing porn movies of infants. Nobody in his/her right mind would allow kids near these guys if they knew who they were! They shouldn't be making all these "rehabilitation" experiments on the expense of law abiding citizens.



"I don't understand how someone could like Tolstoy and Dostoyevsky, but not like Twilight!!!"

"Last book I read was Brokeback Mountain, I just don't have the patience for them unless it's softcore porn."

                                                                               (The Voice of a Generation and Seece)

"If you cant stand the sound of your own voice than dont become a singer !!!!!"

                                                                               (pizzahut451)

Porcupine_I said:
sapphi_snake said:
Porcupine_I said:

hold the moral sledgehammer.

i never defended anything they did, i simply question your standpoint in this case.

you are the one asking for the death of people. but you are not ready to kill them yourself, because you are scared of the consequences.

what does that make you in the end?

A coward? But the reason I wouldn't want to kill them does not have anything do to woth my fear of "consiquences". I'm just not cold blooded enough to be a good executioner. There are people better suited for that.

 

Now what does your desire to let child killers on the streets make you?

and that desire do i express in which of my posts exactly?

Don't be childish now. you have actually thought about what you asked in your OP, that is a good thing! There is no need to revert to juvenile argumentations because you didn't like what you came up with.

I'm curious, how do you think this whole situation should've been handled?



"I don't understand how someone could like Tolstoy and Dostoyevsky, but not like Twilight!!!"

"Last book I read was Brokeback Mountain, I just don't have the patience for them unless it's softcore porn."

                                                                               (The Voice of a Generation and Seece)

"If you cant stand the sound of your own voice than dont become a singer !!!!!"

                                                                               (pizzahut451)

sapphi_snake said:
pizzahut451 said:
sapphi_snake said:
pizzahut451 said:

OMG, we should call Dexter !!!!!!!!!!

That's actually a pretty good ideea. He'd so teach those bastards a lesson!


Haha, funny thing is, Dexter isn't really diffrent than those 2 10 year olds you described

Not really. He kills evil people who avoid the law. Those psychos I descibed kill little children for fun. They're Dexter, if he were evil and didn'tcontrol himself.


Dexter is the way he is because of his father.Unlike him, these children had probably no one to watch over them. If Dexter didnt have Harry to teach him, he would have turned out just like these 2 ten year olds.



Around the Network
sapphi_snake said:

In my opinion they should never have been released. They should've spent their whole lives behind bars (and no comforts and luxuries, like TV or workout either). There are situations where compassion is not a good thing, and sometimes it's better when you lack it entirely. Administiring punishment to such individuals is such a time. It's about obtaining justice for the victims, and for society as a whole.

If anything, these two are better off now than they would've been had they never committed this atrocity.

The fact that they were abused isn't an excuse. Most people are abused in some form. Very few act like they did. They choose to kidnapp, torture, mutilate and kill a 2 yar old boy. No one forced them to do that. They deserve no compassion.

As for the identity thing, you're right. Besides that, people have a right to know who they're dealing with. One of them was convited last year for possessing porn movies of infants. Nobody in his/her right mind would allow kids near these guys if they knew who they were! They shouldn't be making all these "rehabilitation" experiments on the expense of law abiding citizens.


if i lacked compassion, what would that say about me?

i understand that this is a very emotional case. trust me, i do. And it obviously upsets you very much, but i think that your emotions are maybe running on "full".  My mum told me a few years ago that after it was on the news she would hold me that little bit tighter when we went out to the shops, watch me that little bit closer.

I don't agree with them being released. They are a threat. Imagine a young woman falling in love with one of these men, marrying him and bearing his children - never knowing his past. Its a scary, possible, thought.

You mention justice. What justice would come of essentially neglecting two children, be it in a jail or otherwise? The family of James B. will never have "true justice". But these children were deprived, rightly, of their freedom, their families and everything else. But as I already stated, to keep them in bare cells, with nothing to occupy their days, would not help anyone.

Compassion is what makes you > the other guy. 



Highwaystar101 said: trashleg said that if I didn't pay back the money she leant me, she would come round and break my legs... That's why people call her trashleg, because she trashes the legs of the people she loan sharks money to.

The justice system in this country is a joke (and it sounds like the UK is even worse)



forest-spirit said:

If people starts taking justice in their hands it would only be a matter of time before an innocent person gets killed.


So no different than our current system then



sapphi_snake said:
pizzahut451 said:
sapphi_snake said:
pizzahut451 said:

OMG, we should call Dexter !!!!!!!!!!

That's actually a pretty good ideea. He'd so teach those bastards a lesson!


Haha, funny thing is, Dexter isn't really diffrent than those 2 10 year olds you described

Not really. He kills evil people who avoid the law. Those psychos I descibed kill little children for fun. They're Dexter, if he were evil and didn'tcontrol himself.

Actually his whole character revolves around the fact that he enjoys killing people but hides this enjoyment behind a moral justification.  But his character constantly acknowledges that this justification is artificial.  That he really does what he does because he likes seeing a person die.

Also you've expressed that any psychological problems these boys had should not be taken into account.  Which I find a ludicrous and dangerous position.  If we ignore the source of the problem any solution you come up with will be ineffective in the long run.  Not to mention that you seem to be proposing revenge and not justice.  Justice would be removing a dangerous individual from society so that he does not harm anyone else.  Revenge would be to inflict harm on another person for emotional satisfaction.  You want vengence so don't mask it as justice.

Killing those two boys because it would ease your ailing conscience won't bring back that 2 year old boy. The simple truth is that Two wrongs don't make a right.  It would be murder to kill those boys (now men) and if you had killed them then you would be a child murderer.  A man who has decided that another man is unfit to live and has come to this conclusion alone and decided to impose his will upon society. 



axt113 said:
forest-spirit said:

If people starts taking justice in their hands it would only be a matter of time before an innocent person gets killed.


So no different than our current system then


UK still has death penalty?